boat stuck in mould

Discussion in 'Fiberglass and Composite Boat Building' started by whacker82, May 25, 2012.

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  1. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    Location: ireland

    whacker82 Senior Member

    It's 10 feet long and at its widest 4 feet and and at the transom I'm pretty sure its 30 inches. AS for dept I'd hazard a guess its about 20 inches. I'll have to check that now again
     
  2. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    Location: ireland

    whacker82 Senior Member

    THe gel coat filler I used also just ripped off the mould, and can be seen on what's left of the boat. There was no grip there what so ever. YOu can get fiberglass in a tin now wit a hardener, different grades some is easy sand and so on. COuld this be a possibility for me as its already fiberglass and not a gel?
     
  3. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    [​IMG]

    These 5 problems are all in a row and seem to indicate you dragged something across the mold here and broke through the wax before gelcoating. I suppose you realize by now that's not a good thing and you have to be careful.
    Did the area where you cracked the mold gelcoat (by hammering) getting your first hull out cause any problems?
     
  4. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    Im am quite convinced there a incommpatability problem with the gel coat and the wax you used !!!
    The places where its stuck are natural places you would have done a lot of brush strokes like up and down the bow , the corner of the transom along the keel and parts in the centre ! All places where any one brushing would do multipal brush strokes . as the gel sat on the wax it was softening the wax and brushing over was then mixing the soften wax and so another lot of gelcoat was going onto that area and doing the same thing till there is no more wax left and so the two gel coat surfaces stick together !! This is the same thing as i posted on another sight . find the soft Johnstons wax and try it on a panel i am sure that wax is what you need to use .

    ok repairs need to grind the places where theres no gel!! need to feather out the edges and back fill with enough new gel to come slightly above the mould surface becasue it will shrink back a little as it hardens . carefull not to add to much catalyst in the gel coat you use to fill with . makes the gel foam a little and you will get porosity and tiny bubbles . lay the gel in carefully and make i smooth job ! less sanding when you start . do all your filling so everything goes hard together . Use straight gel and catalyst dont mix anything with it if the big areas dont fill enough the first time when its gelled mix a little more and brush more to build up the thickness to slightly above the mould surface .
    always over full sllightly then block sand when it hardened !!
    you going to get lots a information so pick through it and take out what you find is what you want :D
     
  5. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    whacker82 Senior Member

    Sam Sam those five marks were done wit a copper flat and rounded at the end,copper so it would curve wit the boat as it went down between the boat and mold. NOt the best idea.

    tunnels will I just keep filling up the holes wit gel coat and nothing else until its just above the mold surface?

    JUst another note pva was never used just mold release wax.
     
  6. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    These just over fill with gel coat !! after you touch with a grinder and feather out the hard edges !!. If you dont feather the edges the hard edge can and usually does get a crack round it and will show up for ever more !!
    The gel needs to be a differant colour which it will be !! so you dont miss any where when you are sanding . As you find the bit that need repairs a small piece of tape to mark it location specially if they are very small they get lost from sight !

    This is a really good learning stage for you !! Dont get depressed and feel the world is coming to a end its not this is all learning . its valuable exsperiance that some guys never get to learn !!. :p
    Everything happens for a reason and a reason for everything happening !!
    Turn negitives into possitives and just get on with it !!:D

    what are you intending to do ??
    making how many boats you want to make ?? :confused:

    i
     
  7. Petros
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: Arlington, WA-USA

    Petros Senior Member

    I do not do much composite work, but it looks to me you found a way of bonding to your mold, even with the wax in place. Better find out what caused it to bond to your mold.

    I will be interested to know what you find out, and how the next one goes. Good luck.
     
  8. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    when it sticks it sticks !!


    There no stick like a chemical bond ! specially when you dont want it to happen .
    Trying to replicate what happened is almost impossible . :eek:
    Know what causes most things and the combination of events leading up to the problem but making it work when you want it to never happens .
    Its why after getting getting to work i pick up the pocket camera is first in my pocket then a mobile phone . :):)
     
  9. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    whacker82 Senior Member

    id like to make as many boats as possible over the summer, just as long as they keep selling ill keep building. i advertised it once and alot of calls straight away and sold my first one in no time, people were ringing me asking if they could order one but i had to put them off because of wat happened. i never told them this mind. i can get pva that can be applied by brush, so when the mold is ready again ill wax it 6 times, then what do i do with the pva?
     
  10. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    Just what i thought you might be about !!
    You need to get a compressor of a decent size !!and a pressure pot spray gun . also a small spray gun because you will need to pva everything . wax now and then but pva always !! you can gel coat almost straight away and dont have to wait for wax to gas off just blow air across the mould and it ready . unclip the gun and hang it up and mix your gelcoat and spray the right amount in one go and clean out your gun and leave it open to dry . by the time you cut you glass to patterns and have it all ready with your resin measured and a stick across the container ! time for a cup of tea and a toilet stop Then into it !!
    Comfortably working efficently you could produce one hull a day all going well . next morning release the hull from mould made the day before and straight into pva and gelcoat and so each day becomes just like the previous one !!. will need a big wall temprature dial and also a humidity meter and keep a close carefull eye on them both !!you will be able to tweek your times of doing thing as time goes by .the pressure pot with a plastic container will hold enough gell for the whole hull so as you get quicker with your spray you can up the catalyst ratio to where its starting to thicken as the gun runs out and starts to splatter the last of the gell in the pot instant clean out and all this before morning tea !!You are bring back lots of memories we can all help you as we have all been in this sort of situation . ;);)
     
  11. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    whacker82 Senior Member

    when will i need to wax it again, how many boats later? what exactly dose the pva do? i got the temperature/humity clock. i read somewhere that 60% humidity or lower is good to apply resin, but anthing higher not to do it with. i got a dehumidifier when i got the mold first, was amazed the amount of water thats in the air. ive also insulated the walls of the shed and any gaps or holes in the shed were all blocked. ill have a look at ebay to see the compressors that can be got. what happens if the gel coat is not dry when i want to apply the second coat and then the fiberglass?
     
  12. daiquiri
    Joined: May 2004
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    Location: Italy (Garda Lake) and Croatia (Istria)

    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    "A man's errors are his portals of discovery" - James Joyce
    "Experience is the name we give to our mistakes" - Oscar Wilde​

    This thread is a proof of the above citations. It has a potential to become a great source of info related to the construction of GRP boats, so please keep up this good job of sharing your experience (i.e. past mistakes :) ). I am learning a lots of interesting stuff here.

    One more for Whacker82:
    "If I had my life to live over again, I'd dare to make more mistakes the next time" - Nadine Stair​
    Don't give up, it looks like a nice boat, worth some sweat and a couple of gray hairs. ;)

    Cheers
     
  13. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    Through my years in the glassing industry i have had the privilidge of learning from other peoples mistakes . i have also had the privilidge of working with some very exsperianced and talented people some time not all of them could speak a word of english I have told this many times when i went to Tahiti i went to teach and show the tahitian workers how to make boats and i was put in my place very early on when i saw how they worked with almost no gear and very little equipment . but they had figured out everything in there own way !! using things i shock my head in disbelief such as silicone car wax ( dont try it ) and just one coat and worked everytime . i was shown how to do multi colours wet on wet gelcoating . was there i learned the importance if understanding and knowing the materials you are working with !!. With a 1 litre pressure pot they sprayed the whole of a 36 foor fishing boat and made a perfect job that did not need to be touched up or have a second coat anywhere . for each litre they knew the size of the area it was surposed to cover and they did just that used the right quantity !!. no calculaters or computers just scratchings witha stick in a dirt floor and they all agreed on the final out come !when i said exsperiance comes with a high price tag i meant just that !!. going to Korea was the final straw that tore my marrage apart . possible should have done it earler . when the dust settled i came to china and have enjoyed the last 12 months of new found freedom and loads of pretty chinese ladies !!
    I am happyest sharing what i have learned over the years with others and its what i do as apart of my work every day some one want something . :D:D
     
  14. whacker82
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    Location: ireland

    whacker82 Senior Member

    love them,

    everything that went wrong with the boat and mold, im turing it into a positive now, looking forward to fixing it up and pulling another boat from it. there is a great drive there now. :D
     

  15. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    repairs galore !!


    The really big places that ned doing tip the mould on its side against a wall or some where so the keel side is almost level and the gel will lay better , fill 2 or 3 times to get it back to the right shape if need be ! us a block as much as possible to make sure its fair !. 80 or 100 grit is ok to just rough off the filed places !!
    one place i was used all velcro papers on there machines and hand paper and had the other side in sheets of peel and stick to the block was reall good clean and easy to use !! bostik f2 is cool just takes longer to work with . sand ,buff and polish is the call till all is finished .

    Compressor size 20 cfm is ok !! the higher the better and keep your eyes out for a good pressure tank that adds some volumn and storage to your system . Use 3/8 air lines with high volumn fittings for everything !!. do it now and you wont regreat it ,need a really good water trap as well to keep moisture out of the lines always !!. Its ok to have 100 psi but using air tools you need volumn as well . I alway us 1/2 inch in any factory i go to then theres little to no pressure drop specially for chopper guns and big gel coat spray units . :rolleyes::
     
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