Boat repair

Discussion in 'Boatbuilding' started by A-white, Nov 9, 2007.

  1. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    so,,,,how would you fix it? since you know ALOT about boat building,, and repairing,,and you wouldnt want us to waste our time telling you something you already know,so the thing to do was tell us your experience level and what your thoughts are :) then we could tell ya how your doing it wrong,,,i mean tell ya how we would do it
     
  2. DanishBagger
    Joined: Feb 2006
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    Location: Denmark

    DanishBagger Never Again

    Still changing explanations. First you couldn't find a hull – you said so in your first post. Now you gathered prices to compare to what it would cost to repair.

    Call it whatever you like. Changing stories and explanations constantly usually means there is something to hide, or one is doing a stint at damage control (in a political sense) – or to say it another way: There's something to hide.

    But good luck on your endevaour.
     
  3. charmc
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    Location: FL, USA

    charmc Senior Member

    Wow. As one of my Australian mates, who goes in this forum by the tag Bergalia, would say, "This is a good set to". Like Sam, Longliner, and Jeff, I tend to believe folks until there is evidence they are not what they claim. I have no dog in this fight, as I'm just a guy who's been messing around with boats of various types and sizes for about 40 years, and what repair skills I may have picked up are mainly fixing wood damage.

    On one hand, to me that boat has had its hull literally ripped open. I'm thinking high speed impact, but normally such a sharply raked bow would cause the boat to climb over the obstacle. One would expect damage at the tip of the bow, or a hole in the bottom. This boat impacted something solid with a protrusion of some sort that dug into the hull and caught it. Whittely seems to be a good manufacturer, so their hulls should be pretty strong. That hull deformed past the tensile strength of the encapsulated glass fibers and tore apart, literally. If I were the owner, I'd have to ask myself if I wanted the guy repairing it to say,"Hey, I wish all repairs were this easy!", or if I'd want him to say, "Hmmm, this was a pretty major disaster, not your run of the mill impact. Could be a lot of hiddden damage. Just doing what I need to do to check for hidden damage is going to add a good bit to the labor. I should probably look for a second opinion before doing it; wonder if others have had to cope with a major whack like this. To be sure structural integrity is restored, it might be less costly to get a new hull. Probably not, but I should at least check." I can imagine a shop being in the boat repair business for years without encountering such a serious collision. This is a lot different from replacing rotted out transoms and stringers, and even common collision damage. It would be only prudent to ask for a second opinion.

    On the other hand, Ashley White's web site claims that the firm is Victoria's GRP repair specialist. Unless you qualify it, that statement will make a reasonable person think you're an expert with a wide range of experience. Had the first post included a statement like, "We've been doing fiberglass repairs for years, even done transom replacements, but this is the worst impact damage I've ever seen. Am I OK in cutting back to sound glass and scarfing in several layers of cloth and resin then refinishing, or could there be more to this than meets the eye?", it might have gotten a more sympathetic response. Moving a business halfway around the globe can't be easy. Perhaps the glass repair expert elected to remain in the UK and it's not been possible yet to hire someone with the same level of experience. Or, as I said, perhaps there's been a lot of experience in boat repair, just not with anything exactly like this.

    I haven't seen contradictory statements from A White, but they have been incomplete. There should have been a lot more info up front. While I think a few guys were too quick to jump all over him (If that's your idea of a common repair, I don't want to go on the water near you, there are way, way too many idiots in your area), I've seen posters who began with an honest explanation of why they are seeking help receive huge amounts of helpful tips, cautions, and general support. Living in Florida, it's easy to see how people can become suspiicious of motives or just plain angry when it appears that a boat shop doesn't have the level of expertise they advertise. If I had a few dollars for every dishonest or incompetent boat builder or repair shop around here I'd spend all my days countin' me money, lads.

    BTW, A White, how is it that buying a 220 kg drum of resin costs 36% more than buying 22 10 kg tubs? If it's the web design guy's error, then I'd put a lot more time into proofing that website and getting a "conventional" merchant account for processing cards before putting it out to the public. Major pricing errors and having Pay Pal as the only shopping cart and payment processor for online payments screams "Amateur".

    Maybe the move was far more costly than planned and funds are thin (Been there, done that). Maybe some key people didn't make the move and skilled craftsmen are hard to come by (more and more common in developed countries, as Sam mentioned). Maybe there's some difficult condition no one else knows about. Not our business, necessarily. But good communication is the key to getting good assistance, especially online, when we can only judge each other by how we communicate.
     
  4. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    is more common where im from then a transom repair or rotted stringers,, i lived where our lakes and ocean has them ugly boogers called rocks. and,, that wasnt that fast of an impact, im betting they were moving less then 20 knots,,,its just that whatever wire or line , or whatever they hit was small and acted like a knife. i stand by 100% that it isnt even CLOSE to a major repair. and when you got a web site stating how much of "specialist" you are,, and your years of experience you should at least play the role.
     
  5. charmc
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    Location: FL, USA

    charmc Senior Member

    Ayah .... I've spent time on Penobscot Bay, and the waters around Cushing, Friendship, Owl's Head, Rockland, Camden, etc. The reality up there makes you sort of "have to" show a little common sense as an operator.

    Yes, that website will create problems unless they either qualify the repair experience in more detail or hire the skill and experience to live up to it.


    I still think I'm correct about the severity of the impact, but I could be wrong on the ease of the repair. As I said, I don't have that level of experience. As an owner, I don't want to have to develop it, either. ;)
     
  6. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    i dont want the experience either,,but being the son of a lobsterman i had NO choice hehe,,and as an owner that SHOULD be a major repair to you,, for ANY boat builder or anyone thats "repaired" boats for over 5 years as a business should look at that job and think here comes alot of easy money.and if i had a biz, and had 1 painter,1glasser,1 carpenter,and when i moved my "painter" didnt come with me,,i dont advertise myself as a full repair and painting shop.and just because i bought a local McDonalds franchise last week,, i dont say i have 50 years of experience., he could be telling alot of the truth,,but the misrepresentation of himself and his now NEW company over-rides ANY of the truths.
    and aint them there waters around camdem and rockland somethin,,hehe,,they've made plenty of fiberglass work possible ;)
     
  7. charmc
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    Location: FL, USA

    charmc Senior Member

    Yeah, kind of defines the term "unforgiving bottom".

    I seem to recall one of the rocks a bit further south, off MA coast, was even kissed by a queen (Cunard's QE2) back in the 90's. That made possible some very profitable steel work for General Ship Corp. of Boston! ;)
     
  8. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    for them or bath iron works, in maine, the ones that make the regis<spellin) destroyers
     
  9. charmc
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    Location: FL, USA

    charmc Senior Member

    Bath had the skills, of course, but you'd never get the Queen up the river. The Aegis newbuilds have to go for sea trials with tanks only partially full to clear the low spots in the channel. No drydock big enough, either, until a few years ago when they bought that humungous floating launch platform over from China. You could build a subdivision or gated community on that thing, with room left over for a marina!

    Hey much, do you remember the old schooners on the river near US 1 in either Demerascotta or Wiscasset?
     
  10. waikikin
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    Location: Australia

    waikikin Senior Member

    Looks like the kangaroo courts over & the reminising started! Much more nicer. All the best from Jeff:)
     
  11. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I've seen this type of damage on boats involved in car accidents. In fact, this looks exactly like what occurred. The impact seems to be what happens when the boat comes sliding up the keel rollers, slams into the bow chock on the winch tower, maybe continuing on to land next to the tow vehicle, possably on top of it.

    Less then desirable syntax with the written word, lack of proofing skills and disjointed posts across a number of specifics, shouldn't lead to the bashing A-white has tolerated, likely not to return. Most every builder and repair person I know couldn't proof read their own resume, let alone a web site. It doesn't mean they're "up" to something. It just means they probably have typos on their business cards too.

    Admittedly, something does seem fishy, when you look over previous A-white threads, but this sterile and impersonal environment of the web, can make this seem so. An unheard voice inflection or unseen tongue in cheek, easily can be miss interpreted, possibly causing harm and unjustly. This coupled with the selective nature of our discussion diets should warrant some latitude, at the very least a PM or email, before we jump off the conclusion cliff.
     
  12. A-white
    Joined: Nov 2007
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    Location: Melbourne, Australia

    A-white Global Powerboats

    Hi everyone thanks for the comments some of you wrote. I’m sure you’re all wondering how the boat was damaged, the person in charge of it (at the time 4 years ago) was drunk (to say the least), his boat collided with another which sank immediately, and thankfully no one was injured. Only now, 4 years after the incident he is able to get the boat repaired (as he had no insurance) after having had to raise the money needed to cover the cost of the other boat that sank.

    I appreciate you comments about the website, it needs A LOT of work done to bring it up to standard, and I have been assured that, the work is nearly ready to be published to the web. If anyone would like a link placed on the site, we would be more than happy to accommodate that.

    I’ll do my best to get some pictures up for you all to see on the progress that’s been made on the repair.

    Best Regards,

    Ashley
     
    2 people like this.
  13. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    i remember them in Demerascotta ,, they still have the old schooners in acadia that all the tourist pay big bucks to go out on and that dry dock is like 4 city blocks,,o.k maybe not that big,, but it made my jaw drop. ya they have probs bringing them destroyers down the river,, theres 1 bend in the river that when they hit it they have 10' of water under them, and a slot thats 50 foot wider then the boat, to fit it in. they're trying to teach a new river pilot to bring em out,, but noones as good as the old dude thats been doing it for 1000 years heh
    A White,,,,you still havent answered the questions we NEEDED answered to give any help. we dont know your skill level, we dont know the amount of damage inside the boat,, even tho i dont think there should be much, most ( not all )of them disposable boats dont have much in the bow, not anything major like stringers or electronics,, but i could be wrong ( again) im not used to those little boats. we also need to know what your shop is capable of,, it would be stupid for us to give ya all kinds of ideas,, explain how to lay fabric,,just to find out all ya got and know how to do is use a chop gun
     
  14. Jesseleey
    Joined: Sep 2006
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    Location: College Station, Texas

    Jesseleey Junior Member

    I can't believe the rudeness!! Are you guys just snobs on here. I don't get on here too often and by no means an expert, I think I can speak for a lot people on here, I am here to learn, not get verbally bashed and asked to leave. You should be ashamed of yourselves. Ecspecially you the1much, your from texas where is the Southern hospitality? Good day.
     

  15. DanishBagger
    Joined: Feb 2006
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    Location: Denmark

    DanishBagger Never Again

    Most people are on here to learn. It just becomes a problem when the one asking questions in fact are demanding answers to be in certain form, yet becomes utterly offensive when asked to give some more information.

    And here you are. "Asking" on behalf of the threadstarter, I presume?
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2007
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