Aussie fires

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by El_Guero, Oct 21, 2013.

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  1. El_Guero

    El_Guero Previous Member

    Right now is a decent time to put aside our differences and pray for our friends down under.

    Sydney is in the middle of a fire zone, which could become a perfect fire storm.

    Not where I would want to be right now.

    wayne
     
  2. Mr Efficiency
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Very kind of you Wayne. Unfortunately, much of it is the work of pyromaniacs, including children. Not sure what can be done about that ! And people have become accustomed to building in the 'bush', amongst the trees, which is aesthetically desirable, but not always prudent. my father was an old bushman, and would not hear of having trees or undergrowth anywhere near the house, also for the reason of falling in storms etc. Camp under a gum tree.........forget it, they drop big limbs anytime, let alone in high winds. So really a lot of loss comes about from building in areas that maybe are not suitable, fires being inevitable sooner or later.
     
  3. djaus
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    djaus Salted Nut!

    Correct Mr Efficiency. There's also the fact that a lot of rural communities have learnt the hard way & as a result their local fire service will perform "burn offs" & take other measures to eliminate undergrowth & ground fuel before summer comes.

    In the big cities & their outer suburbs though this isn't the case. Look what happened in Canberra in 2003. Pine plantations directly across the street from suburbia were dropping pine needles & debris for over 20 to 30 years. The area's were never cared for, cleaned or maintained.

    I spent 20 years of my life in Canberra, I used to ride my pushy through the Stromlo pine forests. Some areas were even hard to walk through due to the large amounts of pine needles & branches on the ground.
    I had also ventured into the Brindabella ranges in 4x4 vehicles, this is where the fire started before working it's way to the outer suburbs. The fire was triggered by lightening & the ranges are very inaccessible.
     
  4. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    At any rate plenty of stress and suffering for australians living in the area. I was just listening to a bbc report concerning a firefighter who returned home after battling the fire only to find his home burnt down.

    I frequently sail in areas of high forest fire risk and also find it amazing that people choose to live in these regions
     
  5. masrapido
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    masrapido Junior forever

    It still beats living in a war zone for years. If you want to pray, think of those who are spending their whole lives trying to survive the next bombing or invasion of wild maniacs armed to the teeth, killing on sight. A little bit of fire pales in comparison.

    Praying never saved anyone anyway... As nice a gesture as it may be. Just ask those millions of Indians who believed in "mother" Teresa and died anyway, in dirty hospitals, without any medicines and medical help, while the old wrinkly witch was sending all the money collected straight into the vatican's vaults...

    (Dam... I managed to squeeze both subjects moderators hate -politics and religion - into this little rant!).
     
  6. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Agreed Wayne. I have quite a few friends down under and I worry about them when the fires get bad or when the rainy season floods them out.

    Masrapido, your assumptions about prayer are incorrect, though from your vantage point it's obvious why you have difficulty with them. Repeated tests have proven those that pray and are prayed for, heal from illness faster, so you can live in denial if you like, but from only and a strictly statistical point of view, not only are you wrong, but likely to not live as long, nor as well as those (80%+ of the earth's population) that do. Demographically and socially, you'd also be incorrect, again according to tests and statistical comparisons. Those with strong "faith" based values tend to get better deals in life. It wouldn't the first time, a self proclaimed reborn christian (for example) got the promotion, likely over someone like you, though evenly qualified, management felt more comfortable promoting them, feeling they whee more trust worthy and likely to make a larger sacrifice for the job's duties, then the materially motivated, equally qualified other contestants for the job. I guess you're pretty pissed off about the number of times this has happened to you by now.
     
  7. Mr Efficiency
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Don't worry, there are more than a few "maniacs" implicated in these happenings, maybe longer jail terms for arsonists are in order.
     
  8. masrapido
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    masrapido Junior forever

    You couldn't be more wrong amigo. The science proved religion to be nothing more than a schizophrenia (believing in unnatural beings, imaginary friends, you name it. It's classified officially as schizophrenia. Pure science.), not a fact. Your arbitrary 80% number is just that, an invention, not a fact.

    To illustrate how wrong is to believe anything, you for example BELIEVE that I may be pissed off with something and you draw personal satisfaction from that belief.

    The facts are 180 degrees from your belief. I am anything but pissed off with anything. I have a privileged life, due to my family history. Where although a communist family, even piece of shift like pinochet did not dare to touch us, while killing ordinary people like flies. I studied in foreign countries, have two degrees, and am VERY successful now in my agricultural business. I have a spectacularly beautiful wife and a great family. I live in a small but superior country to anything under the sun in so many ways people from the "first world" and "democracy" can't even begin to fathom.

    These fortunate circumstances sadden me to see that people today still live that schizophrenic delusion about some old guy with a long beard and a short little else looking out for them while they kill each other in his name and rant about how he "loves" them.

    You pretend to have statistics for your wonderful claims, but yo cannot quote a single one (independent and as objective as possible - for they do not exist). The facts are that the most successful countries in the world today are the least religious countries: Japan, China, Sweden, Norway, Finland, Cuba (yes, Cuba. It is a country that for all its' problems with the religious "democracy" up north, its' people live better there than an average usanian who works for $2.13 cents per hour. Or a "privileged" few who earn $7-8 per hour, which is 99% of usa - do not trust me this statistics, trust Nobel winner for economy Stiglitz, an usanian economist), India (yep, there are LOTS of atheists in India. You should go visit to see and verify. I was surprised myself to see that Indians are far from being religious as we all believe - see how stupid is to believe things we hear? - them to be), and even Australia mentioned in this thread. On a sideline, not that the fires in Australia have anything to do with boating...

    So, to stick with the subject, while all my sympathy goes to affected people in Australia, let us also consider those who live surrounded with fire of (usanian-made and sold) guns, grow up watching their families blown up by drones made by religious criminals and/or domestic religious terrorists, both claiming their "god" is a loving and a peaceful one but they will still blow your head off for you are infidel of some sort. Surely, they are no less human beings than people in Australia who will survive and go on with their lives a lot easier than those who grow in absolute poverty and mostly without their parents who will likely be killed long time ago. By "god-fearing" schizophrenics.

    So I hope you will spare a prayer or two for those unfortunate people and children too, while praying. They need it a LOT more than (un)fortunate Australians.

    As for your statement that it has been proven to work, please explain, if it is sooooo efficient and effective, how come we have had more wars and bloodshed in the last 2000 years than in the rest of the 30 000 of known history of mankind? What's the problem that those religious people - praying so much and so often - cannot solve and establish the peace in the world?

    That's because the science IS right again... When did a schizophrenia bring anything good.

    (I wonder if I should even mention the placebo effect that strikes irrespectively of your religious affiliations, as long as one gives it a chance)
     
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  9. masrapido
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    masrapido Junior forever

    I just read that the biggest fire was put up by no less than the Australian own army. Will anyone be held responsible? My scientific assumption, based on lessons learned from "democracy", is that government is never wrong and never takes responsibility for anything.
     
  10. Mr Efficiency
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    I'd say the military is probably exempt from any fire ban regulations, but I suspect their PR apparatus will be wanting to avoid a repetition of this unhappy occurrence.
     
  11. El_Guero

    El_Guero Previous Member

    Mas rapido,

    You really need compassion for your fellow man, even if you are jealous that they have it better than you do.

    wayne
     
  12. masrapido
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    masrapido Junior forever

  13. masrapido
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    masrapido Junior forever


    Ok, now you have me confused...

    ; )
     
  14. waikikin
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    waikikin Senior Member

    Crikey, a pretty unrealistic diagnosis, we've seen a bit of that around here. Given the statistic that around about 1% of a population will suffer from schizophrenia your post seems a little off & cruel. I'd take it for fact that most rational people apply learned behavior in daily life & apply the principles that most organised religions & people of conscience hold as righteous .... if an individual starts to apply science to, & over-analyse every day circumstance they might find themselves at risk & unable to function.
    That some governments & organisations can use religion as a tool of manipulation is at odds with the underlying princilples of most religion & conscienced belief systems, far from the absolute delusion of an old guy with beard etc, that is, if you simply applied the logic of an collective human conscience to the concept of God & that their nominated representative on Earth such as Jesus, was a really top bloke..... what would he do in a situation like this, you would find a choice that would be righteous & reasonable.

    To stay on topic, Fire is a risk here, very often we get comfortable with our environment & don't do the stuff we need to, the military may have been responsible for one source out of many, at least one older boatbuilder has lost his sheds & tooling, many many more have lost their homes & belongings/photos etc. Very fortunately ours is a society that can look after each other.
    Jeff
     

  15. Saqa
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    Saqa Senior Member

    I remember the 1994 fires, I was running a farm in Warragamba area surrounded by bush. At night it was 360 degree encirclement of glow from the flames from one of the worst bushfire season of all time. Very scary!!! Back at my parents place 10mins from the city there were ash drifting down like rain!

    Flew into Syndey earlier this afternoon, was surprised that it looked all clear and could only see one plume of smoke
     
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