Any westlawn or yds grad actually working in the industry???

distance boat design education

Hello Fede,
I was just browsing for something similar, but found only Westland. Could you please maile me some more school names and if possible their conditions (fees, duration, etc.).

Thank you in advance,
Ariel Wohl
mailto:wohl@bigfoot.com
POB 44192 Tel-Aviv 61441 ISRAEL

 

Poor Fede...

I am a recent graduate of the Webb Institute with an interest in small boat/yacht design, and am familiar with both the physical tribulations of fairing lines with splines and weights, and the mental headache of doing hydrodynamics calcs.

However, I know that coming right out of Webb I couldn't design a yacht. Just the same, there is no way I could design a ship either. Any education you get gives you just the basics, where you take it is up to you.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this thread was started by a guy asking a simple question about getting started in the industry. While the arguments have been flying as to what education is the best to get, I think this question has been forgetten, and I'm sure Fede is more lost than he was before.

To Fede, I say this: you gotta do what you gotta do. It seems like the correspondence courses are your only option, so forget all the university hooplah these guys have been shouting about. So weigh the options that the different courses offer and pick the one thats best. Westlawn is obviously a very respected program (who does happen to send brochures to all Webb students for the engineering vs. drafting combatants) both here in the US and in Italy, apparently. However, no one will (or should anyway) ever guarantee that you will make back your investment of either time or money. The best you can do is get the certificate and try to get a job. Most likely, you will have to start on the low end of the totem pole, probably just drawing another guy's ideas. But, as in any other profession you could try, ability and hard work will allow you to move up the corporate ladder. Whatever you end up doing, I wish you the best of luck.

Tom Edwards
Webb Institute '03
University of Hawaii - MS student
Navatek, Ltd. - Engineering Intern

 

Thanks Tom!
That's an appreciated answer!
Meanwhile I've been studying and visiting yards...
I decided to attend another course wich is held here in Italy and has nothing less than westlawn or yds...actually yuo can even meet your teachers once in a while for live tutoring...that happened in october and now i'm at text 4 of 20...what's important is that i'm really enjoing it and I'm very satisfied!
Italy is full of yards so I decide to contatct them and have a tour of some of them ...see what happens,meet up with people,see what kind of people works in the field, what kind of knowledge is needed, what kind of job I could expect tomorrow...see if I like all this...and then (we use to say in Italy) who will live will see!

 

Industrial or Pleasure

I have worked for 3 major pleasure boat companies and now own my own. If you are looking to get a position as a designer in this industry you will need to have a degree of some sort, Yes. but let me say this. The pleasure boat industry may talk about layup schedules, composites and new technology but very few of them are actually using any of it. Most large manufacturers are building production boats that are built on one thing.... their Bottom Line. Their hulls are no more efficient than they were 20 years ago, in fact some companies are still using those designs to this day. Their lay-up schedules are based on dollar amounts and not overall strength. Resin to glass ratios are based on saving money on waste of resin and cutting cost. As a designer in this industry you will be asked to do one thing, Design a beautiful looking boat that will appeal to the masses..... If you really want to get into this business and be successful make sure you design boats that can be molded. The key to design is looks and being able to mold it with out having to many small parts. Read books on mold making and design with that aspect in mind. I think it was stated before but I will say it again, You will not be doing bottom design. These companies are not willing to build test boats to see if your theories work. It cost alot of money to do so and will not take those chances. They will build bottoms that are tried and tested. Take the time to design at least 3 boats that you can take them to sell. Your best chance of getting your foot in the door is to look at their style and design something similar but with your flair added. Companies hire people not product. If you are extremely good at what you do you will find a job. How much money you make, well thats a whole other story. If you are looking to get into industrial ship building then Guest is right, you will need a degree from a credited university....Thats America. I wish you the best in your ventures and dont let a message board determine your future! Follow your dreams.......

John

 

FABULOUS LETTER THAT

 

The best boat designer I know is a 70 year old man, No schooling except experiance. But he will tell you " In todays world you need that paper, It dont matter what in as long as it has those fancy words in it" He Means a BS degree. He doesnt like engineers he said he has to fix to many of their mistakes. I do know that he has used them in the past for tech. questions..
You have to go for your dream which ever road it leads you down.
My degrees are in Environmental health and Industrial hygiene. I work for state and local goverment. This pays my bills. But I build boats on the side and that is what keeps me happy and sane... So good luck
Ben

 

Amen to Russ Bowler or Farr Yacht Design

Amen to the Farr office but lets not forget if bruce didnt have Russ Bowler the office wouldnt even exsist. He needs Russ's education along with the other ivy league graduates, he's just the one with the shortest name, thats easier to write on boats

 

Fede,

as would say some of the guys here, it is really difficult to make a living of yacht design. I was graduated from YDI schools College ot Marine Technology in march 88, it took me 8 years to complete the home study course.....I was part of the time working on the course, part of the time for people such as Martin FRANCIS naval Architects, BOUVET / PETIT yacht design, Espen OEINO naval Architects, Jacques FAUROUX, to name but a few. And in 1998 as I had no more work in the pleasure craft business, I have decided to move and work at the ALSTOM Shipyard in Saint-Nazaire, but even now there is no more work for people like me.

One thing I do regret in my life, is that I didn't know that Southampton program was more or less "free" if you were from the EC countries, you just had to pay for food, renting a small studio, travels, having a drink with chaps at night and passing all your exams.

One thing I would like to tell you is that none of the Schools nor universities will WARRANTY YOU TO BECOME A COMPETITIVE DESIGNER when you get your Diploma...this will depend on you, and you alone.

Apart from this, if you look at people such as Olin Stephens, or Bruce Farr, they never went to the university......well, it could be more precise to say that M. Stephens went 3 monthes at MIT, but fell ill because of a jaunice and gave up University to draw a famous DORADE with his brother......so, things to say is that it is as difficult now maybe as it was in the '30s with proportionnaly more people interested in yacht design. If you really wish it, you will do it

Let me know

Vince

 

hai
i have completed bachelor of engineering in naval architecture(india)
2 years back. i wantto know
whether any training is provided for ship designing?

 

You should ask some informations from Westlawn or YDS:

http://www.westlawn.org/
http://www.macnaughtongroup.com/school.htm

this is the best I can tell you.
Best regards

Vince

 

Yacht Design School Director

It is interesting how different perspectives can be. Our perceptions both as designers at MacNaughton Yacht Designs and teachers at Yacht Design School are very different. The impression that we get is that, at least in the United States, it is tough to get work in large ship naval architecture and that there is a shortage of people to work in the yacht design field. Even though we run one of the major schools of yacht design and probably have an easier time attracting designers to work here than other firms would the limiting factor for us is not how many projects are available to us but how many good people we can get. From the fact that our students tend to get grabbed up long before they graduate I would say other firms must be in the same position.

I have certainly heard before that the "large ship" naval architectural schools look down on yacht and small craft naval architecture as a profession. They very often even seem to despise the idea of teaching their students to draw! However I do not know any older yacht designers who have failed to have a comfortable old age and everyone I know is doing fine.

Further I very much question "Guest's" perception that "large ship" degrees are more sought after in the yacht design field than Westlawn, Southampton, Landing School, or YDS. If that were so, why do we have so many graduates of the "large ship" courses coming to us to take our course because they have been specifically told repeatedly that the firms they wish to work for will not hire them unless they've taken one of these yacht oriented courses as well? This extends to students who have worked many years at very prestigious large ship firms yet when laid of and deciding to transition to yachts are told they must take one of the courses above before being considered.

I hear a lot from people working outside the field that these "large ship" degrees are desirable but it is most definitely not what we are hearing inside the field. This is not to disparage that type of education, just that people seem to have unrealistic expectations for it.

 

If people are really interested in an neutral assessment of the scope of the field, and the currently sought credentials, look at the help wanted ads in Professional Boatbuilder, and contact the recruiters in the industry; Bryan Spencer, Tom Casssidy, Todaro and Assoc. and RSAMarine.

 

Any contact info for these recruiters? I did a google search and only found info on Tom Cassidy. Thanks....

 

Recruiter Contact Info

Contact info (phone and mailing address, no E-mail or Web site) for Arthur Pollan of E. M. Todaro Professional Recruiting Services can be found at the Professional Boatbuilder Web site, in the Industry Jobs section:

http://www.proboat.com/position.pdf

and RSA Marine Employment, a division of Robert Sage & Associates, an engineering and technical oriented recruiter, can be found at:

http://www.rsamarineemployment.com/

and at www.rsarecruiting.com
(Note: They also have jobs related to RVs, modular buildings, etc.)


Hope this helps!

Don Gale
South Salem, NY

 

Some Additional Possibilities for Recruiter Inroads

Two other recruiting firms from whom I’ve received positive feedback:

Mr. Bill Wright, CadCamRecruiters, in Charlotte, NC, frequently has contact among the production boat companies - email bill@cadcamrecruiters.com; Web site www.cadcamrecruiters.com.

Quality technical Services, Inc. works mainly among the commercial and military oriented firms and some builders of large yachts; visit www.quality-technical.com.

Good luck!

Don