Anti-skid surface and painting fiberglass

Discussion in 'Fiberglass and Composite Boat Building' started by bashley, Sep 24, 2010.

  1. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    Hi,

    Just acquired a 70s vintage 14-ft sailboat (CL-14). Plan to paint. The forward deck has a textured anti-skid surface in the gel coat. Gel coat condition is, well, errrmm...not great. Time to paint. Looks like the antiskid pattern was probably the imprint from the original mold. The texture/pattern is not terribly deep.

    Any tips? Can I sand the textured surface completely away as part of the prep work without inflicting damage?

    Thanks,

    bob
     
  2. alan white
    Joined: Mar 2007
    Posts: 3,731
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1404
    Location: maine

    alan white Senior Member

    Yes. The non-skid is only gel coat and it has no structural strength. There are many ways to create a new non-skid using sand, ground up walnut shells, and so forth. You'll get lots of input for applied non-skid if you ask.
     
  3. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    Simplest is polypropylene short pile carpet ! Non slip , has a good color and pattern range ,is soft underfoot,can be stuck to the surface using Clear silicone (exterior grade ) cut to any shape and when you get sick of the color or pattern simply cut it off with a sharp knife and replace .
    Ok for smallish areas not big places . Have used it on the deck of a runabout for 5 years and its still as good as the day it was installed !!:p

    Molded in non slip dates the product and is not all that good anyway . As mentioned sand in the painted surface is better and more grippy , and doesn't
    Hurt so much if you fall ,was always a place that gets grubby over time and not that easy to keep clean . :(
    For the floors of surf boat we use sand but painted over !! Has lots a grip and wont tear your skin if you trip over on it .:idea:
    :D:p
     
  4. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 476, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Sand is the worst material you can use as texture, though admittedly it is an effective texture material. All paint stores will sell a ground up polyurethane granule intended specifically for texture in paint. Some will mix it in with the paint, which can save time, but often produces a blotchy pattern. The best way is to apply your topcoat then immediately sprinkle sifted texture granules, into the wet paint, completely covering the area with a thick coating of the stuff. Let this dry, then vacuum off the excess. Apply more topcoat and you're done. This is the most uniform way I know of getting home made texture without using a mold.

    The reason sand is the worst is you can't remove it easily and all paint jobs need to be redone eventually. With a texture job, particularly if the granules are fine, like sand, you can't over coat and still have serviceable texture afterward. This means you got to take it off and reapply texture. Ever try to sand off sand? It doesn't like it, nor will your tools. Yep, you can use heat and scrape, but this is more work then necessary, especially when other types of texture material (like crushed walnut shells or polyurethane granules) can be sanded right through without eating up belt sander belt like candy. The last texture job I did I used sugar, yep, house hold sugar. Well, actually it was the big hunks of sugar, the natural stuff, not the bleached and finely ground stuff used on your Wheaties. I use this stuff on clear coats, when they need texture. It looks a little odd, but it works. It's applied the same way, but after the excess is vacuumed off, the sugar is washed out with warm water. The sugar melts and leaves the paint or varnish lots of little caves and bumps. This can be over coated or left as is. Salt also works well if you're going to wash out the remains.
     
  5. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    Thanks Allan, Tunnel, PAR for the input on anti-skid. My impetus right now is simply to remove the existing anti-skid imprint as part of paint prep.

    Since standing, dancing or working on the foredeck of such a small boat should never properly happen on the water and next-to-never on land, I have a hunch that the prime motive for the antiskid is more about aesthetic than safety. As it has been designed, it's roughly the outline of a pair of lungs or pair of symmetrical, roughly triangular, shapes separated by a wide border by smooth gel coat. I should take a picture of it.

    It does do that aesthetic thing of breaking up a large, otherwise, flat surface area of deck with a design. And I suppose it probably hides surface defects that would otherwise show up proud on an uninterrupted, plain surface.

    So, the final result might be a two-toned color scheme or two different surface treatments to retain something of the aesthetic. I'm not convinced the anti-skid has a compelling safety function, really.

    Re-finishing, a factor PAR points out, is important to me. With this paint job I want to show compassion for whoever does the NEXT paint job.

    Thanks!

    bob
     
  6. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 476, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I think you might be surprised with the CL-14's stability if you happened to be on the foredeck. I can also see reasons that might have you on the foredeck, like a fouled sheet, painter, to fend off or something, so texture wouldn't be a bad idea.

    Use the sugar or salt trick and tell your friends about the "green" techniques employed in the paint job and the renewable resource texture grit.
     
  7. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    Yeah, come to think of it, PAR, you're probably right. The only other dinghy I've owned was an Albacore. Quite a different hull shape. Pretty stable when it counted on heel, but I'd guess that the CL-14 might have more initial stability, placidly tied to its hitching post?

    I gotta admit that the sugary solution does have the sex appeal of an ice cream cone to a kid! If I'm going high-and-mighty on the moral ground of "green solutions", I'd better make sure it's also "fair-trade" sugar.

    I assume I can get pretty aggressive with the initial removal of the old anti-skid pattern in the gel coat, like an 80 grit + elbow grease?
     
  8. anthony goodson
    Joined: Mar 2007
    Posts: 438
    Likes: 17, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 256
    Location: Dorset UK & Murcia Spain

    anthony goodson Senior Member

    Mix some waxed gelcoat {flocoat }with light white filler powder until it is the consistancy of porridge ,add mekp ,mask up and then stipple it on neatly with the end of a brush.Remove masking whilst wet,when cured knock the sharp peaks off with coarse paper. Very quick, minimum of preparation ,covers a multitude of sins, non stick ,non slip.
     
  9. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    Thanks for weighing in, Anthony. Is MEKP readily available? Given a "porridge" thickness, would I expect the non-skid surface to be raised significantly above the surrounding smooth surfaces?

    Also, will this surface happily receive marine paints? When time comes to repaint, will this anti-skid solution be easy to knock down flat with sandpaper?

    Thanks,

    bob
     
  10. missinginaction
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 885
    Likes: 123, Points: 43, Legacy Rep: 512
    Location: New York

    missinginaction Senior Member

    A few weeks ago I painted my new decks and cabin roof. I used interlux Perfection, but Perfection is really slick so I wanted some kind of non-skid.

    Since I've been happy with Interlux I looked to see what they might recommend. As it turns out they make a non-skid called Intergrip. I purchased a 1/2 pint container and mixed it in with my finish (2nd) coat of paint.

    PAR is correct that this method can leave the surface a little blotchy but I found that keeping the non-skid in suspension by stirring the paint a bit before loading the roller minimised imperfections :)eek:).

    I had enough material to easily do 140 square feet of deck/roof. Very pleased with the results.

    Here's a link.....

    http://www.yachtpaint.com/MPYACMDatasheets/Intergrip_Noskid_Compound eng-usa A4 Y 20100614.pdf

    MIA
     
  11. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    Thanks missinginaction for introducing another tack on non-skid. Appreciate the link. I'll check it out.

    I have only a small area to anti-skid, probably not more 8-10 ft/sq. Pints and half-pints will do me fine!

    bob
     
  12. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    anti-skid choices

    I found this site which compares several different types of anti-skid applications.

    http://www.boatus.com/foundation/findings/nonskid2.htm

    Might be useful to someone. No exactly aligned to my original question aimed at dealing with OLD anti-skid molding in the overall preparation for a paint job.
     
  13. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 476, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    That Boat US article is 16 years old, include several advertisers (which happened to fair well, imagine that) and all the textures were applied in suspension.

    As MIA has suggested, if you employ this technique (adding texture to the paint) you need to constantly stir or the texture will fall out of suspension, which makes for a blotchy result. If you happen to have an indentured servant or child handy, having them continuously stir the batch as you apply the paint will help a lot and give the little one something to do as well. Now, not only are you green, but "engaged" as well. You'll get a few extra spontaneous nookie credits for that effort, which you can quickly remedy, by forgetting to take the trash out, before she asks you to take it out.
     
  14. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    anti-skid ideas skid outa control

    Thanks PAR for pointing out that the article I linked is getting rather long in the tooth. Sweet sixteen, of course, brings us back to your sugary solution.

    Conscription of young family to stir sounds okay until it gets to the part where achieving an anti-skid hull becomes the secret quest.

    :)
     

  15. bashley
    Joined: Sep 2010
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

    bashley Nova Scotia Bluenoser

    thickness of removed anti-skid vs surrounding areas

    It just occurred to me that complete removal of the anti-skid texture would effectively result in a deeper "grind" than would be needed for sanding the surrounding smooth areas of gel coat. I'm imagining a hollow where the anti-skid used to be unless I'm aggressive in removing gel coat everywhere else.

    But I need to test my assumptions here.

    1) total thickness of gel coat in smooth areas doesn't need to be removed to paint, just enough to get "tooth" for paint

    2) the total thickness of gel coat in all areas is the same, smooth or textured/patterned.

    3) an old anti-skid pattern/texture must be completely removed to be as smooth as surrounding areas before applying a new anti-skid

    Is this three-strikes-yer-out? Or, two-outa-three-ain't-bad? Or....what?
     
Loading...
Similar Threads
  1. Jeffery Carson
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    1,886
  2. container
    Replies:
    8
    Views:
    375
  3. Tom Mckinney
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    607
  4. andy47
    Replies:
    7
    Views:
    2,966
  5. midcap
    Replies:
    16
    Views:
    24,745
  6. pierreuw
    Replies:
    12
    Views:
    3,954
  7. flyineagle
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    1,177
  8. kane_new
    Replies:
    9
    Views:
    1,977
  9. simon
    Replies:
    17
    Views:
    7,213
  10. vincent9993
    Replies:
    6
    Views:
    3,535
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.