Aero-Hydrodynamics of Sailing - C.A. Marchaj

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by Dutch Peter, Sep 16, 2004.

  1. Dutch Peter
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    Dutch Peter Senior Member

    Can anyone tell me the subjects covered and give me a book review!
    Thanks.
     
  2. Robert Gainer
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    Robert Gainer Designer/Builder

    You might try http://bookstore.myboatcenter.com/n_1888671181.htm for a short review. It is a very good and comprehensive book but the math is more then I could comfortably handle. It covers everything that makes a difference to the speed of the boat. Both hull and sail plan.
     
  3. jehardiman
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    jehardiman Senior Member

    Marchaj covers all the basics and most of the specifics of the interaction between the sail and the hull, and the sails themselves. He presumes that you can handle the basic NA and math and discusses theroy and actual test measurement results. The book is much like Hoerner, with about the same level of detail, but with a more focused scope which makes it more useful to the NA.

    Topics:
    Part I: Fundamental factors
    Geometry of sailing to windward
    sail/hull interaction
    Centerboard or fin keel efficiency
    optimum course to windward
    stability
    All-round performance
    High speed sailing
    Land & hard water sailing

    Part II: Principles of Aero-hydrodynamics
    Elementry Concepts
    Drag-Viscosity phenomena
    Reynolds Number and scale effects
    Three dimensional foils

    Part III:Research on sails
    Speed/performance Prediction
    Sail design
    Sail forces
    Wind Tunnel results

    On the whole, I'd have to say that the book is a little dated, but it is still a wealth of information, especially test data. In a world where more and more is being based on untested CFD (most of it incorrect/limited IMHO), the test data is nice. Like Hoerner and Theory of Wing Sections it belongs on the NA's bookself.
     
  4. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    I found Pierre Gutelle "Design of sailing yachts" to be a much better book. Better organised better explanations and includes material Marchaj does not.

    Aero-hydro is a bit disjointed, if you have Marchaj's latest "sailing theory and practice" you may find that Aero-hydro is not much more use.

    Cheers
     
  5. Eric Sponberg
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    Eric Sponberg Senior Member

    According to Tony Marchaj, in a private conversation I had with him some years ago, Tony believes that Gutelle stole a lot of information and material directly from his "Aero-Hydro." I personally believe that Aero-Hydro is the most complete discussion of sailing yacht dynamics ever written--nothing else compares. In Gutelle's book, I do like his discussion of stability--very good.

    Eric
     
  6. ErikG
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    ErikG Senior Member

    Well calling it stealing might not be totally accurate...
    IIRC (cant find the book at the moment) Gutelle stated in the foreword that most of the info existed already, he just published it in one book trying to present a full picture of the theory behind yacht design. Pretty much the same as Larsson Eliasson did in their book. For me, both of theese books are bedside reading all the time :)

    Wether reprinting stuff in this manner is alltogether legal I don't know. Morally I cant find a problem with it. Gutelle spends a relative small part of his book explaining what Marchaj uses quite a lot pages to do originally (as I haven't read it i'm not sure about this, but the book is substatially thicker than Gutelles and has to have a lot more info on the specific subject I guess)

    Marchajs books I have yet to find at a reasonable price, but they are at the top of my list of "must haves".
     
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  7. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Even if you regard Pier G. as an editor and re-presenter of Marchaj's work his book is a more concise and a much clearer presentation for the budding naval engineer.
     
  8. mmd
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    mmd Senior Member

    Price doesn't matter - buy the book. It is as fundamental a tool in your library as a wrench is to a mechanic. I have Gutelle's book as well, and think highly of it, but it is not as thorough as Marchaj. Consider placing Marchaj's book, "Seaworthiness - The Forgotten Factor" on your reading list as well, if not on the purchase list.
     
  9. 8knots
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    8knots A little on the slow side

    In a major strike of luck I purchased Aero-hydro and Voyaging under power at a used book store for $3.00......I figure we only get a few good finds in life and this is one. As stated above the math is a little above me but provides plenty of info on foils and such. I am glad to have it and anybody with the disease I think would find it usefull.
    8knots
     
  10. Dutch Peter
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    Dutch Peter Senior Member

    Thanks guys for the replies!!


    mmd, got "seaworthiness,..." and "sail performance". Wanted to know if "aero-hydro" would really add something, guess it does. Specially sitting next to Gutelle's book. Gotta put that on the list too.


    And the list goes on and on!!!
     
  11. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    Aero-Hydro vs Sailing Theory and Practice

    I also found Aero-Hydro a bit 'disjointed'. A lot of material there but just in a bit disjointed fashion.

    Didn't Sailing Theory and Practice precede Aero-Hydro?? Thats how I remember it. Just not as much hydro stuff in the first book.
     
  12. Guest-3-12-09-9-21
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    Guest-3-12-09-9-21 Senior Member

  13. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Brian

    There is a newer edition of 'Sailing Theory and Practice" . Have you tried Guttelle's work ?

    cheers
     
  14. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member


  15. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Brian
    The first book is

    Design of Sailing Yachts
    Pierre Gutelle
    ISBN 0 948646 54 3

    Warsash publishing Southampton
    orders@nauticalbooks.co.uk

    It is a translated black and white bound photocopy but the material is an organized and even expanded continuation of Marchajs work.

    Tony posted some of Gutelle's second tome (which he had translated) this dealt with rig and appendage design. But It is only available in French.

    The first book is worth buying, mine took about 5 days to arrive by post.

    Cheers
     
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