advice on Thai Longtail boat project

You should consider that properties of wood they use in Thailand are different from ones on Gerr's book. Local woods like 'maitaken' are about 800 kg/m3 density, and strength is also very different.

 

Gerr lists Thai woods (not Takien-Merawan, but Lauan, Meranti, Apitong and Teak off course). I may say that Takien it is much better than many other US Gerr listed woods. Takien it is also commonly called Yacal (commercially Merawan) and with 753 kg/m3 density (when dry), it is one of the best woods for traditional boat building and marine environment and one of the most durable high-class construction timbers, resistant to quite all marine decays (more than Teak). Some of the oldest wooden boats existing in the world are built with this wood (some over a 100 years old, some in the UK). All earlier wooden Grand Banks had their frame in Yacal. This is the reasons why historically it was reserved only to boat building and denied for house construction in Thailand with the pretext to be house of the guardian spirit Nang Takien that bring bad luck or even be the harbinger of death (realy because it's too good for boats). How ever, it is not as good for modern epoxy West System building as its oil release works against good epoxy glueing-penetration, high content of tannin (that turns it black under sun). And the high silica content is an issue as well. It has excellent strength properties, very low shrinkage and movements with age. It also is one of the few woods that can be find in long planks until 13 mt of lenghts (max. transportability) and is very fast to season (the Thais use it just after 30 days of natural dry, but it is recommended to wait at least 80 days for a board with more than 2 inches thickness). It is just an ugly wood when turn black under sun.


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Common name Yacal - Merawan





Scientific name:Hopea odorata
Names :Thingan, Sao, Khen, Ko ky, May ken, Koki, Giam, Takien thong, Yacal, Kien kien, Sao trang, Sao xanh, Xao den, Takien, Takhian, Thong, Andaman thingan, Gagil, Khen, Koki, Luis, Mai takien, Manggachapui, May ken, Merawan, Merewan, Sao, Takhian tong, Takien tong, Thingan, Thong, Xao den, Yacal
Location:Burma, West-Malaysia, Singapur, Thailand, Kampuchea, Vietnam, Indonesien, Philippinen
Density in kg/cbm:750

 

Long tail

Hiya, I was interested to read all the comments on the long tail. I have been interested for some time to take 2 or maybe 3 longtails from Phuket to Brisbane! yes on their own bottoms. I think with some modifications they are probably safe enough. I have had some experience with these boats over the years and owned a '23 framer' (30 footer)

I lived in the area for a couple of years about 10 years ago as captain of the Royal Yacht of Malaysia. I probably drank too much Sang Thip and came up with this plan to have one built so when I next went home to New Zealand I came back with a 10 kilo sack of silicon bronze screws and found a guy in Krabi to build me a long tail using the screws (they use low grade mild steel boat spikes) he did a great job and I test drove it all about the place with my Yanmar 10hp. after being hassled by the local around phuket as they thought i was going to steal their business I drove it all the way down to Port Kelang in Malaysia, took me 7 days to do 465 n.m. Im still a bit deaf in my port ear as at that stage had no exhaust!

I then shipped the boat in a 40ft container and sent it to Auckland where it was much admired during the 2000 Americas Cup.

I made some modifications that enormously improved her sea keeping qualities especially in a folloing sea where they are a ***** as they love to broach! I wont drag on unless someone is interested.

Anybody want to do a 4,500 mile trip in one??!

cheers
Fred

 

Hi Fred

Tell me more.
Do you still have your longtail here in NZ and are you still using it?
Could you describe the engine/drive unit in a bit more detail, particularly the construction of the shaft and prop and how they are attached to the engine. I'm interested in making one up and putting it on a pontoon boat or something. Any thoughts?

Paul

 

Hello Fred,
I remember that Royal Malaysian Yacht and also sitting with you in the bridge of a motoryacht when the "Royal Yacht" was struck by lightning.
Kind regards
Gypsie

 

Lots of Photos

As a cross reference I just posted a lot of photos of longtail boats here:
http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=20398&page=3

 

Thai Longtail in alum

http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-design/panga-longboat-aluminium-plate-alloy-27935.html#post281365

 

help

Hi All,
I am looking for help on a smaller scale than those noted and hope that you can help me.
This winters project is to build a r/c model of a Thai longtail boat between 18 and 24 inches long.
Does anybody know where I can get a set of plans as I have drawn blanks with UK shops and sites.
Regards,
Geoff Jones.

 

Thai Longtail model

Hi Geoff,
It's not likely that you'll find any proper plans for a longtail, although as soon as I say that sonmeone's going to come up with a set.
I built 114 of these boats (well, participated in building, more accurately) over a three year period after the tsunami in 2204, and every single one came straight out of the heads of the Thai builders. Not so much as a scrap of paper. Pretty amazing to see.
I have a model sitting in front of me that is exactly 24" long, but I'd be loathe to part with it as it was a parting gift to me from some of the fishermen we helped by building them boats. But I'll re-post here and give you a few pictures, as well as the dimensions from the scale model. It does not have the longtail drive on it though, just the hull.
Keep an eye out here, I may get to it this evening.
Scott

 

Hi Scott,
Thanks for your offer of info. Your photos combined with those I took in Thailand, but most importantly, the dimentions should get the project underway.
Take care,
Geoff.

 

anyone know where to buy a longtail in thailand, preferabaly around chiang mai area. i would be looking for one around 30 foot, new or used, also some idea of what to expect to pay. thanx.

 

If you're in chiang mai then any local wood yard would be able to refer you. If you're not in chiang mai then maybe Alik (who posts on this forum) can help you out (he's in Thailand). Maybe send Alik a message.

 

The boats we built in 2005-2007 our cost was in the ballpark of 120,000 TBH in Southern Thailand, but we used a lot of Takien Tong in the planks for rot resistance, and I paid my builders fair wages. You could get a new one built for around 100,000 but I would expect some less preferred wood species, like Takien Sai. A used boat though can probably be had for around 20,000 TBH.

 

Yes, but note that the price 120,000 bath for a new one is without engine / 'drivetrain'.

Don’t know the price of the Yanmar TF diesels but a converted pick-up diesel engine with turbo (often Nissan) is a bit over 100,000 bath.

Used stuff in Thailand does often not drop as much as we would expect comparing to Europe and America. I don't know about long tails but I think that a decent 2nd hand one is 50,000 or above. 2nd hand prices has surprised me (negatively) many times...

Mikey

 

Our prices for the drive train were slightly "preferred" because of being able to order them in increments of 5 at a time, but the longtails (4 meter and 4.5 meter) were 20,000 TBH (welded carbon steel with epoxy paint), and the new Yanmar TF115 engines were 35,000. I forgot to mention that the prices I'm talking about are for a 23 rib boat. 21 and 25 rib boats were built too, but the most common was 23 rib, with ribs at 16" on center. The 21 rib boats used a slightly smaller engine, but the 115 was acceptable for 23 and 25 rib boats.
For those that aren't familiar with the units of length used in Thailand, it's usually a mix. For example, when buying wood at a wood yard, I would specify inch x inch x meter (no kidding). Then pricing was done in TBH/cubic foot. Once I got my head around it it was no big deal and it became second nature really (cringe). Generally, small distances/measurements were done in inches, and anything "bigger", whatever that means, was in meters. So a 23 rib boat with ribs at 16" on center gave us a 9 meter keel.
Re. the second hand price, like anything, you get what you pay for. Those boats don't generally last decades, and get worse for the wear quite quickly. So a 1 year old boat and a 5 year old boat may have dramatically different prices. And, not to be crass, the color of your skin has a lot to do with the price you get. If I were shopping for a second hand longtail in Thailand (or really an anything in Thailand) I would, without hesitation, have a trusted Thai front person do my bidding.