AC 45 World Championship Cheating??

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by Doug Lord, Aug 10, 2013.

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  1. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    [​IMG]


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    [​IMG]

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    and 8% less forestay sag,
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    [​IMG]
     
  2. Corley
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    Corley epoxy coated

    Wow! I always knew Coutts was all style but his latest outburst is quite laughable. It's pretty unbecoming for the head of a major syndicate imho to pay out on the International Jury in this manner.

    From Sailing Scuttlebutt:

    Coutts Blasts The Jury Decisions

    Oracle chief executive Sir Russell Coutts has labelled the punishment meted out to his syndicate in the wake of a cheating scandal as "outrageous".

    Coutts broke his silence on the decision by the international jury that has cost his team points, sailors and fines ahead of Sunday's opening America's Cup race, and suggested the New Zealand media "had a win" out of the jury.

    Coutts offered little more than a three-paragraph statement after jury yesterday delivered the heaviest punishments in the 162-year history of the cup, saying his syndicate "disagreed" with the penalties.

    But he opened up to the local San Francisco Chronicle today, clearly angry and worried about the precedent that had been set.

    "I'm astounded, to be honest with you, that they penalised the whole team for this," Coutts told the city's biggest newspaper.

    "It sets an outrageous precedent for the future. Imagine an Olympic team, and one member infringes a rule. Does that mean the whole team gets penalised?"

    The paper also felt Coutts thought the jury might have been swayed by the New Zealand media, which, he said, "had a win out of all this."

    www.stuff.co.nz/sport/americas-cup
     
  3. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    ^^^

    On Tuesday when the decisions were released, Scuttlebutt quoted Coutts saying this, bold type added:

    The richest America's Cup team in history is found to have cheated in the America's Cup 45 one-design class which they themselves launched and campaigned with great fanfare around the world. Coutts delays the jury's handling of the case as much as he can; there are finally glaring inconsistencies and shortcomings in the Oracle Team explanation of the case; there are obvious conflicts of interest which protect the Oracle Team, such as Stephen Barclay's roles as ACEA CEO and the director of Core Composites.

    But Coutts thinks it is an 'absolute atrocity' that the jury decides that this has damaged the reputation of the America's Cup.

    Go to Ebensee, Russell, the next time you're partying at Austria's Lake Traunsee with the RC44s. That was the scene of what you can call an 'absolute atrocity'.
     
  4. SteveMellet
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    SteveMellet Senior Member

    "I'm astounded, to be honest with you, that they penalised the whole team for this," Coutts told the city's biggest newspaper.

    I'm astounded he is astounded.. Did he really think that he could throw 4 members of the team under the bus and it would all go away quietly ? The only reason the IJ didn't give a harsher punishment is because that would prevent the event from happening altogether, and do irrepairable damage to the image of the AC event.

    "It sets an outrageous precedent for the future. Imagine an Olympic team, and one member infringes a rule. Does that mean the whole team gets penalised?"

    Ok, put it this way, in the Olympics or a World Champs, if one member of an 8-man sculling team THAT ARE ON THE SAME BOAT is found guilty of doping, I'm pretty sure that the entire team would have their results stripped, as the cheating affects the performance of the whole team. This is the part that perhaps Russel is battling to grasp - the cheats have tarnished the image of their whole team, their sponsors, the event, and the sport of sailing. The irony is that the IJ could well have booted Team OR out of the event altogether for 'actions harming the image of the event' which is a rule they wrote. In my opinion the punishment is rather lenient, given what could have been if there was not so much at stake financially.

    I am really surprised that their sponsors haven't asked them to re-skin the wing in black, without any logos. Would happen in many other sports. Perhaps they don't really mind being associated with this scandal, since no-one is watching anyway :D.
     
  5. Leo Lazauskas
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    Leo Lazauskas Senior Member

    Maybe Coutts has realised that there will forever be an astersisk next to
    the results of this AC and his name will be associated with those of the
    cheats. Not much of a legacy, and definitely not a good ad for Oracle.
     
  6. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    ...

    Here are a few lines from Richard Gladwell's article after the Skipper's press conference yesterday:

    excerpts:

    ...

    It is more likely that Spithill and Kostecki were instructed before the press conference to make no admission of anything, much less apologize for anything.

    If Spithill were to talk about being sorry, the next question might be 'What are you sorry about?'

    Following his boss Russell's example, Spithill might try this:
    “We're sorry that it certainly was misguided for some of the team to alter the boats without referring to the one design class rules.”

    Next question:
    "Is that an evasive way of saying that some of your team cheated?"

    At that point Spithill would need a lawyer from Boies, Schiller & Flexner at his side, but he only had John Kostecki.

    :(
     
  7. cavalier mk2
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    cavalier mk2 Senior Member

    Maybe the Americans should get the Italians to step in as their proxy defenders and leave Oracle at (or in) the dock. They seemed to be good sportsmen....
     
  8. jehardiman
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    jehardiman Senior Member

    Pity the US team didn't have all US members....if they did then this would be about ETNZ and not OTUSA.

    There is way too much money being flung around to trust anyone's motives in this and just another in a long list of individuals willing to subvert a sport for personal gain.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2013
  9. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    ...

    You think the US Guild of Ambulance Chasers are happy to sit back and allow matters to be decided on the water?

     
  10. Leo Lazauskas
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    Leo Lazauskas Senior Member

    Why not? There's a lot of money to be made just by reading boring paperwork.
    And they can ask for very high fees because of the massive egos involved.
     
  11. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    ^^^

    I have what I find is an effective way of dealing with their fees.

    I wait for a good while, a year at least, before paying whatever they bill.

    Drives them nuts, because they never want to divulge that they might be needing cash.

    Try it!

    ;)
     
  12. Leo Lazauskas
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    Leo Lazauskas Senior Member

    Only idiots and crims need lawyers ;P

    In commercial cases in Australia we ask for money up front. If you don't have it then represent yourself (in the knowledge you have a fool for a client.)
     
  13. Blackburn
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    Blackburn Senior Member

    ^^^

    It sounds as if you're a lawyer yourself,
    but I was sure this forum is inhabited by practical people who actually know how to build and fix things!

    ;)
     
  14. Leo Lazauskas
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    Leo Lazauskas Senior Member

    Not me. I just find people who need lawyers quaint and amusing, like teenagers
    who can't yet fend for themselves adequately.

    You sound like someone who has frequent need of lawyers. Have you spent the
    equivalent of their childrens' college fees yet? ;)
     

  15. Leo Lazauskas
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    Leo Lazauskas Senior Member

    Back on topic...

    Do you think that the legal team were able to reduce the penalty by any amount?
    For example, I can't see that they were able to convince the IJ to reduce the
    penalty from 3 races to 2, or that they had much effect on the monetary
    penalty. IMO the IJ listened to the legal arguments and mitigation and
    imposed the penalty they had already decided.
     
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