40 ft Cruiser

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by albert72, Aug 6, 2012.

  1. albert72
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Lisbon

    albert72 New Member

    Three crazy guys finally decided to build a boat.
    It will be a 40ft fiberglass cruiser, intended to sail the Atlantic (we have this passion for the Azores, and go there almost every year), and maybe someday do something a bit more ambitious.

    On our first survey we came up with two designs:

    Van de Stadt's Caribbean 40
    http://www.stadtdesign.com/designs/stock_plans_sail/caribbean_40/1

    Dudley Dix's Didi40cr
    http://www.dixdesign.com/didi40cr.htm

    We would very much like to read your comments on these designs or others you might want to suggest..

    Thanks in advance, All the best,

    Albert
     
  2. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    Buy a good used boat.

    It'll cost a fraction,you'll still have your friends (boat building partnerships RARELY work out),and you can go sailing ASAP instead of years from now.
     
  3. albert72
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    albert72 New Member

    We are well aware of that.

    It's just that for us that the (long) building is part of the trip.

    Txs for your reply,

    Albert
     
  4. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    The two boats you listed are dramatically different so comparison is like asking to pick between a Corvette and a Camaro. Both are sporty and nice, but they are sufficiently different that direct comparison is difficult at best.
     
  5. capt vimes
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    capt vimes Senior Member

    ... and non of the two is a "fiberglass cruiser"...
    the vd stadt design is either metal or cold moulded - the dix is plywood epoxy...

    i'd go with the didi 40cr - easier to build, lighter (less material hence less costs), faster, the plans are not even half the price of the vd stadt ones and dudley is known to be very cooperative and helpful...
     
  6. Manie B
    Joined: Sep 2006
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    Manie B Senior Member

    my 2 cents

    go for Didi 40 - no question about it - great boat - good plans - nice build
    but as you know building is very very expensive - better to buy used
    you are close to the "used markets" dont build
     

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  7. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    He wants a 'glass cruiser, likely has limited sailing experience and you all are telling him the plywood semi racer is the way to go . . . :confused:
     
  8. Knautical
    Joined: Sep 2011
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    Knautical Junior Member

    Your original query is in regards to the opinions of the designs. They are both solid designs and both designers supply decent support. There are many other things you will also have to consider in acquiring your dream vessel with your mates like builder experience to multi-owner "wish lists". Either way you look at it, it will be an adventure.

    Best of luck in your new venture.
     
  9. capt vimes
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    capt vimes Senior Member

    well he did ask about our opinions, didn't he? ;)

    @albert:
    marc lombard has also some interesting plans like the 1200:
    http://www.marclombard.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=42&Itemid=82&lang=en

    for the didi i know one company in turkey selling the whole plywood kit precut (no lofting and such required):
    http://www.kitsandboats.com/kits_EN.html

    btw: i do not think that fibreglass is a method for the amateur-, home builder...
     
  10. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    'Glass certainly is a method for the amateur and there are a few one off methods, that can make this material a little easier. I think a 40' ocean going yacht is a pipe dream, without a fair bit of building experience, but we don't know of the original poster's sailing experience, nor their yacht building abilities.
     
  11. capt vimes
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    capt vimes Senior Member

    you really think so?
    glass requires a plug - be it positive or negative - and the construction for a plug alone requires time and money...
    by the time you have build the plug, you might would have finished a lapstrake hull alltogether...

    GRP is a very strong and durable material - properly laid, BUT if you do not have much experience with it, you might get a lot of weaknesses in it without even noticing it...

    why not do it in metal where the only possible weaknesses are in the welds (which you can check afterwards and correct them) or wood where your only concern is - in the end - the encapsulation?

    i am absolutely with you in this regard!
    been there, seen it... but still dreaming... ;)
     
  12. viking north
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    viking north VINLAND

    Reality check --- Sailing vessel --- 40ft.--- Inexperienced builders ??--- Inexperienced sailers ?? ---A partenership of friends --- equals "A Total Recipe For Disaster" both for the completion of the vessel and continuation of the friendship. Please guys you asked for advise. Two very wise pieces have been given here (1) This is far too big a project for beginners (2) Buy a used vessel instead. Adding to this advise, Prior to even making these moves, rent a 40 footer take her on a one month off shore cruise. Hopefully you'll run into a reasonable storm as a test of the three "ships" (1) Your rented ship (2) Your seamenship (3) Your Friendship. Visit the forum again and let us know how you made out. I post this not to discourage --not to be mean --- but out of experience ---Geo.
     
  13. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Viking North has hit a nail, but is that hammer blow the real question?

    Have you considered say a multihull? Have you determined what you intend to do when you have a boat? - Design is heavily influenced by where you intend to cruise, how often and for how long...

    I spent years going on various "adventures" starting with canoes Home made out of plywood, bits of corrugated galvanised roofing iron and pitch to seal the ends, small sailing boats, Hobie and other brands of beach cats, deep V powerboats 18ft? from Rabaul to Bougainville - 250 miles - and racing competitively in WA sailing a "Court 650: and later upgraded to a "Court 750" assisting in delivery of a variety of vessels and so the adventure goes...

    My cruising region is the northern Coral Sea (Queensland, PNG, Solomon Islands and ?) where I determined shallow draft and light weight was advantageous so I selected a design by Bob Oram, Who has retired and websites closed) . . . His design "39C" met my need very well - even without mast and sails it does extremely well as a cruising home for me... achieving 10 knots on a pair of 20 hp nanni sail drive engines at 3000rpm burning 3 litres/hour each, (or 6 knots on one engine)...

    http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-building/my-little-piece-peace-25962.html read this thread of part of my build... I also got epoxy poisoning on 3 occasions and now have a mortal fear of any exposure to the vapours given off during the mixing of the hardener to the epoxy base... I also had a fall and broke my bum and was laid up for 16 weeks... and ran out of money...

    What I am suggesting is that you bare-boat charter, and recognise that this option is the cheapest if you do not intend to live permanently aboard... Also this option will allow you to sample monos and cats as well as the occasional trimaran... It is a buyers market and excellent deals are available just look around and keep your eyes open... Know what is needed for what you want to do...

    CHECK carefully for the permanent live-aboard operating costs are many, unrelenting, and more expensive than you think... - - - Many a bedraggled and dilapidated boat is there to demonstrate the failed dreams of many would be cruising sailors...

    Put "bareboat charters" in your search engine and change the search area to Caribbean, Mediterranean, Australia, Vanuatu, Fiji and French Pacific etc, - - also modify the search to "crewed charters" as some areas are quite dangerous as regards uncharted reefs, few safe anchorages and other hazards of nature... Be cautious about diving in "at the deep end" as you may find that the unseen shallow end inflicts severe pain too...

    Image - my boat almost ready to depart on the next cruise...
     

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  14. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    One off 'glass builds don't need a mold, nor a plug, though a jig might be necessary for most methods. You'll need the same type of jig for a wooden build too. Station molds with some stringers, is about all you need, which sounds just like the beginnings of a wooden build to me.
     

  15. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    masalai masalai

    Precut ply and precut Balsa cored grp sheathed sheets (usually 8 ft x 4 ft) use simple locator frames I had 6 which were spun around on the spot to do the other half of the hulls... http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-building/my-little-piece-peace-25962-7.html#post272028 the 40 ft lengths were screwed in place, then glued 'coving', (to give the tape a bend rather than a tight corner), done then taped with glass then when cured, ALL the screws are removed and sealed... ALL "too easy" and then the hull is rolled over to have the joints filled with epoxy mix and micro spheres and then taped over and allowed to cure... follow on the pictures from there... DuFlex is NOT water tight and needs grp & tape below waterline and epoxy & stuff to seal the hull sides before painting... I missed part of the action with several bouts of epoxy "poisoning"... A competent builder would get to lock-up stage in about 9 months with minimal outside labour for about $90000 in 9 months including shed space by a professional... well worth the expenditure and finished result... I sometimes wish I had done that...
     
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