3D laser scanners

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by fpjeepy05, Aug 8, 2019.

  1. fpjeepy05
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    fpjeepy05 Senior Member

    I've seen there are some threads about this in the past, but this tech is evolving so fast I thought it could use an update.

    I'm looking for a scanner (preferably handheld) that I can scan boat hulls up to 70ft as well as the accompanying software to produce a point cloud that can be imported into Rhino.

    Maybe it would be helpful to discuss all options, or best option under $1000, $5000, $10000 etc.

    I have seen some of the work produced by Faro and was very impressed. I've read good things online about Shining 3D Einscan.

    Also if there is any Photogrammetry software worth mentioning please include in here. Thanks.
     
  2. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    The results of the 3D scan are impressive but what should really impress us is the software that allows you to move from the points cloud, not very useful for practical purposes, to the surfaces. THAT is what we should analyze more and better. Any scanner will take thousands of data, millions, which then must be debugged, selected, and arranged to obtain surfaces, whose geometric properties allow us to calculate something.
    Do not be impressed by the cloud of points that, by itself, only serves for visual effects.
     
  3. wet feet
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    wet feet Senior Member

    I am fairly sure that the scanners from Leica and the Faro arm will both exceed the $10,000 upper figure.You can probably buy a Proliner for a good bit less.Photogrammetry i know very little about and have doubts about finding a clear all round view of a boat as most boatyards and marinas have other stuff getting in the way.It isn't a quick job to create a full surface model from a point cloud,but I would rather do that than stand around in the rain measuring from strings that are fluttering in the wind.
     
  4. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    No need to suffer from the wind and cold. You paint it as a terrible thing the fact of taking measures "in situ". It can be done with laser meters, very cheap, taking several cross sections, the longitudinal profile and some other data. Just in case, buy a rain suit and a good waterproof hat. Oh yes, and pencil and paper!
     
  5. wet feet
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    wet feet Senior Member

    It has been my experience that boats are only lifted out of the water in the winter months as their owners like to enjoy using them during the summer.I'm also about a thousand miles nearer the North Pole than Spain is and don't relish working on a boat outside during the winter months.In the OP's position I would probably find a scanning service and ask them to provide a cleaned up file of the hull for the first few projects.For a 70 foot boat the file is likely to be huge and you can extract as may or as few points as you think suitable.You will also have the task of re-creating those parts of the surfaces that are on the ground or hull supports,as the scanner won't be getting to those.For speed of taking sections-and only sections-you probably won't beat a Proliner running along a batten stuck to the hull.
     
  6. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    Nobody likes to work in winter, that is clear, but I would not like to talk about the inclement weather but of the real possibilities that any person, who does not want to invest much money in that, has to get the shapes of his boat. The clouds of points and all that paraphernalia are amazing, but who can afford them?. And, once you have been given the cloud of points, what do you do with it, how do you handle it? Yes, I know, analyze it with software, very difficult to handle and very expensive. That is why I propose, what I have done many times, to use a low-cost laser meter and a little common sense to organize the job right.
     
  7. fpjeepy05
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    fpjeepy05 Senior Member

    I guess a lot of what you use has to do with what you are scanning. I am a designer for a custom boat builder. A lot of the boats are "stick-built" meaning no 3d modeling from the beginning. But then I have answer questions like "Is that going to work?" "Is that going to fit" Usually I get hull jigs, house jigs, towers, engines, exhausts, etc from the Nav Arch, manufactures, etc but how they are positioned relative to each other, and if as-built is within tolerance of the model is really tough to confirm with a tape measure, its not square like a house. If a bulkhead is in crooked, a jig racked on the strongback, the deck saged, or it took a lot of fairing compound in one spot, etc. it can throw things way off. I feel like having even partial scans of certain areas would make my job of solving the puzzle a little easier.

    I have used a Proliner a lot. It works, but I'm not in love with it. And at $20k+ it's not a killer deal. Since in most cases I already have pretty surfaces that I'm working with, a point cloud will probably work for me, because I'm just using it for positioning.
     
  8. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    I have used Photoscan, now called Metashape, photogrammetry software on boats up to 60 feet. Output is a point cloud and textured mesh, typically with millions or tens of millions of points. The point clouds and meshes are imported into Rhino CAD software.
     
  9. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    I have successfully used photogrammetry for boats with very limited access. One was a 20 foot boat at the back of a storage shed with only 4 feet clearance on the side. Another was a 60 foot boat with an observation platform along one side which I worked under.
     
  10. fpjeepy05
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    fpjeepy05 Senior Member

    Thank you. Expensive? I’ll look into it.
     
  11. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    The Standard Edition of Metashape which I use is $179. Online Store https://www.agisoft.com/buy/online-store/ The Professional Edition is $3499 and has several features which would be nice to have but not essential.

    Advantages of photogrammetry include the required equipment is a digital camera and a suitable computer. The results include the surface appearance.

    Disadvantages include the object needs some random visual "texture". Clean monochrome surfaces such as metal, paint or fiberglass usually won't work but will if they are sufficiently dirty. Processing time on the computer can range from 10 minutes to hours depending on the size of the job and computer. The results will usually have some noise around the edges.
     
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  12. baeckmo
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    baeckmo Hydrodynamics

    Very interesting David; what formats do you use for transfer of geometry for further processing?
     
  13. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    Export from Metashape textured mesh in .obj format and import directly into Rhino.
     
  14. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    Excuse me but this mesh allows you to perform any calculation?. Thanks a lot.
     

  15. fpjeepy05
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    fpjeepy05 Senior Member

    Something like masking tape work for adding texture?
     
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