1967 48' ChrisCraft Constellation Restoration

Discussion in 'Wooden Boat Building and Restoration' started by robster, Aug 12, 2008.

  1. robster
    Joined: Apr 2008
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    Location: Seattle Washington

    robster Junior Member

    There was latex paint on my Chris from the waterline up. The water had soaked right through it. I am not sure how long the previous owner had been using latex paint on the boat but I can say one thing for sure, I replaced 95% of all the original planking, ribs, battens, deck bows, all the bulkheads and inner framing of the boat because it was all rotten and water-soaked. Latex paint should never be used on a boat, it cannot handle the weather conditions, movement and moisture.
    There is one thing about letting the wood breath, but I would rather have bare wood, than wood with latex on it.
    There are some professional "Waterborne" paints that are design for marine use and some automotive paint that can be used for topside.
     
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  2. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member


    Gonzo..YOU ARE STUCK ON STUPID...this is a batten seamed.. NON COTTON CAULKED HULL...REPEAT...NON COTTON HULL.
     
  3. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    Michael Pierzga: you have been insulting in several of your posts. If you put aside your asinine attitude and read what the question to my response was, you would realize the poster said he caulked the BOTTOM. I have extensive experience with Chris Crafts. You read a couple of obsolete books and think that gives you the right to talk down to people that actually work on boats and know what they are doing. Grow up!
     
  4. robster
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    robster Junior Member

    I agree, even if we dissagree which we will on sertain issues, this forum should not be used for namecalling and insults. Dissagreement is ok, thats how we learn from eachother. The reason that I started this thread is so that people can have input and get ideas from eachother. if I dissagree with anyone then I should be able to state my opinion constructively.

    As far as cotton in th seams of my battens, I saw some cotton but was not consistant through out the hull when I was taking all the planks off. I am not sure if it was origional or someone repairing it from the past.

    Interesting enough I saw some cotton on the bottom where it is double planked. Given that my boat is a 1967, it could have been done at the factory.
    My advice is that if there is cotton on your boat seams, and you are just doing repairs, then repair it with cotton so that the movement and expansion will stay consistant, the only way you could change systems is if you are stripping it down completely and converting it to a different method such as I did.
     
  5. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    All the diagonal planking I've seen on those boats had some caulking in it. I think that cotton may be needed when the the plank edges have been crushed which makes the seams too big and the swelling won't take up the gap. Sometimes that happens from using hard compounds. Age, and many wet and drying cycles, will also make the seams wider than what swelling can take up.
     
  6. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    A common trick employed by all of the era manufactures in batten seams, double planked builds, even lapstrakes (typically at the rabbit seam) is they would lay in a length of cotton string, usually at back and bottom of a joint. Even if the joint was to be clamped tight and fastened without traditional caulking (fibers and compound). The idea is the string (usually fairly small in diameter) would crush down when dry, but swell when wet, pressing against the faying surfaces of each plank and making a seal.

    As far as real pounded in cotton, this isn't very common, but sometimes was used to fix irregular seams as an economic option. The alternative would have been to remove the plank and make a cheater or better fitting plank, which of course is a much more costly, even if proper, approach.

    Michael Pierzga has been challenged in dozens of different threads to explain his many claims and suggestions. With rare exception, he has proven he "over speaks" what he actually knows and has become more then a bit helpless (or maybe hapless is a better term) possibly feeling rebuked, once too many times. Personally, I'm sorry the forum has to suffer from his incessant dribble about things he knows little off, but hey it's a free discussion board and this freedom to speak, may be more then he's accustomed to.
     
  7. Tobin
    Joined: Jan 2011
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    Tobin New Member

    lotta work

    Robbie, that sure is a lot of work you are putting into that old boat! I think your ideas are pretty sound and interesting. I have a 63 42' CCC big pile of junk I have been working on for years. I have been restoring old stuff for a while..I built my first boat when I was twelve to fetch golf balls out of the golf course lakes for my pops...well it floated and didn't take much effort to keep it that way. I think the way the ribs and battens are originally designed in these old woodies give you a bit of room for improvement. Look at at how much technology has changed in the last 50 years...I think she'll run longer than we will if your motors are sound! I've got twin Lincoln 430s..they are sitting in my machine shop right now as I am a major gear-head...I've spent the last two years debating a re-power with some small v-8 diesels (Just put a crate 502 in a 69 z-28, but I don't think it'll float!!) ...something compatible to my personal needs and desires...gas too in-efficient..parts tough to find. Its a bare hull now and no hurry, sits inside year round. "What the hell am I doing!!!" I wonder sometimes...but it sure is a fun escape!
     
  8. robster
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    robster Junior Member

    48' Chris Craft update

    I thought I would give you guys an update on my Chris Craft. My wife and I have been living and cruising in it for 2 years now in Puget Sound with zero issues with the hull. It has been completely dry, except for some caulking I missed around one of the exhaust exits which I fixed :)

    We were in a small accident when a motor boat rammed into the side with its steel bow and punctured a hole in one of the planks. The seams around where the hole was did not crack. so I just repaired the local damage with my same system.

    I built out the interior with full teak and mahogany exposed wood and built in seating areas. The engines are the original (Rebuilt) 534 Ford industrial Seamasters that run awesome. All the other systems on board are new. I am trying to attach pics on here but its giving me issues.

    I now have purchased a 56' Rosborough Schooner. this time for all my traditional friends I will be re-planking it traditionally with 1 1/2" Honduras Mahogany :)
     
  9. robster
    Joined: Apr 2008
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    robster Junior Member

    My blog

    If anyone is interested, I have a blog that I started from the beginning of the project until now, you can follow it at the link below.

    http://myboatjournal.blogspot.com
     
  10. ned L
    Joined: Nov 2008
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    ned L Junior Member

    WOW!! you and your family deserve a world of credit! I'll have to say that I saw this thread a number of years ago and thought that you were giving it a valient effort but would be surprised if you finished. ... Well I think you proved a whole lot of people wrong and deserve a ton of credit. Beautiful job!!!
     
  11. robster
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    robster Junior Member

    Thanks Ned,

    It was a lot of work but worth it. I still have to finish the forward head area and some little things on the exterior but should be all done before winter hits. After that I will put her up for sale as I have purchased a 56' Rosborough Schooner that we will restore and sail to the South Pacific with :).
     
  12. ned L
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    ned L Junior Member

    Best wishes & good luck on your Rosborough schooner. (I hope she needs a bit less heroic work!)
     
  13. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I did a complete rebuild on my 37 Egg Harbor wood hull.

    All bottom planks off and replaced-repaired many frames. New bronze screws stepped up one size to number 12, square drive from Mc'Feeley's.

    No cotton, I totally encapsulated the wood in Sanitred Permaflex.
    The caulk between planks I used PL Premium Polyurethane Construction adhesive.
    Both of these products are HARD rubber, not soft.

    Basically remove all bottom planks
    Repair-replace curved frames.
    Clean off the structural wood.
    Coat with Permaflex.
    Reattach Planks
    Caulk between planks with PL Premium Poly CA
    Filled all screw hole with PL Premium
    Does not matter how big the gaps were, typically they were about 1/8 to 1/4 bevel showing on the outside.
    PL will harden up to 3/8 inch thick without help. BUT mix with sawdust to get a quicker set and thicker usage.
    I would mix PL with sawdust 50-50, then pack it into wider seams. I had one wide seam above the water line of 1/2 inch. Worked fine.
    I reused ALL the old planks. The planks next to the struts, the edges had worn a little wider from years of use, so I packed with PL and sawdust.
    PL will NOT stick well to oily wood.

    It was a lot of work.
    I know about the cotton keeping the hull stiff and the wood planks swelling to make a rigid panel. I did not want to loose that by using a soft caulk and also read that the planks could spit it out. So I went with this approach. The PL cant spit out since it is also covered over with Permaflex.

    It has been 6 years now and the hull is perfect.
    [​IMG]

    This shot shows the shaft tube relined from lead to liquid tight non metallic gray conduit. I glued this into the shaft log with PL Poly Black roof caulk, worked extremely well. It was a bear drilling the hole bigger. Used a hole saw and extension.

    The permaflex has stuck on to the hull very well with no delaminations. Permaflex DID NOT stick to the SS trim tabs, eventually peeled off after 3 years.
    Permaflex HAS also stuck to the bronze struts and even the prop. I was surprised it has not come off the prop.
     
  14. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Here is a typical inner appearance of Permaflex where I had costed the shaft log.
    [​IMG]

    What I do not like about the way Egg Harbor made this boat is all these inside hull areas hold water like from the rain.
    For example the frames run pocketed into the keel.
    This creates a little lake between every plank frame.

    Can you fill these with something?
    I have thought about cement as it is cheap, but would add weight.

    Roof tar but that seems like a messy thing to use.
    I could go crazy cutting small wood wedges. The ideal substance would be light weight water proof and self leveling, so clean inner hull, pour in let settle and set.

    Floor leveler?

    It took me about 2 years to finish the project. For a long time rain water sat inside the hull with the boat on the hard and nothing swelled, cracked, broke, rotted as I worked on other parts. Part of the problem was the yard put the boat leaning back bow up , but on an Egg, the hull has it's lowest part at the bow, so I had a lake in there. I thought about drilling a drain hole never did. I just forgot about it. Some people were telling me the hull would split open, crack, be ruined. So it was an interesting experience, but I will never do it again, way too much work.

    After I finished, I realized I could have embedded a fabric in the Permaflex like Dynol which stretches. Maybe could have used kevlar or something. Like what would happen if hull ran into underwater metal, rock etc... With kevlar maybe hull would be bullet proof against that.

    There is a polyurea coating called Dragon Shield which is truly blast and bullet proof.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGlMK0KWOJ4

     

  15. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    the nearest thing to miracle "GOO" I know of is Portland cement.

    I have put many cement patches on old steel boats.

    Temporarily repaired plumbing, engines, hulls, all with cement which magically expands as it cures and cures harder if kept moist.

    Now cement isn't what the topic is about. But, it is the nearest thing to a "miracle goo" I know of.
    These were "patches" until a haulout and real repair could be made.

    :D
     
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