1960 48' steel Ketch what did i just buy?!?!

Discussion in 'Metal Boat Building' started by oliverj, Aug 20, 2012.

  1. beernd
    Joined: Jun 2012
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    Location: Netherlands

    beernd Junior Member

    Yes it is that simple just cut out the bad pice and weld a new one in.

    What is happening with the leaks over the portholes and all that, maybe you just can find a few tubes of miracle something or other, smear it no and be happy.

    Remember you got your self a STEEL boat and that material is about the most repairable and forgiving material on this planet.

    As far as the rudder goes(or rather doesn't go) buy your self a tube of something miracle formula, spray and/or brush it on and be patient for a day or two, than try moving it again.
    If it does not move after that, start worrying.
    Or hope some body who really knows about these kind of things comes along.

    Anyway I bet dollars for donuts that you got yourselves a good solid old boat with some minor "issues" to solve.

    BTW those interior pictures look real good :cool:
     
  2. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    You need someone that knows what to look for have a look at the boat. As Wynand says
    Those interior photos show that most of the hull inside is inaccessible so you have no idea what shape it's in. At the very least, severely beat it with a ball peen hammer, you aren't going to wreck the patina on it. Start where you know the plating has to be replaced so you get an idea of what a bad area sounds like.
     
  3. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    Not having much luck finding someone knowledgeable in old steel boats...
    What about the concrete in the keel. Is it hiding/harboring/fostering rust? I had some yahoo walk buy n say that I have to remove all the old concrete and pour in new. Tell me its not so?

    Cheers
    Oliver
     
  4. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    As far as accessibility to the hulls int, I have access panels everywhere. The only out of reach spots are under the 4'x8' SS water tank , 4'x4' fuel tank and the above waterline area from head to mid V-birth, port side. To starboard everything opens up except area next to stove (3' or 4'). Oh and cabin top.
     
  5. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    Well, that's good that you have access. The area of real concern is the waterline on down as that's where the condensation forms.

    Here's a surveyor for the Chesapeake area...

    http://allboatsurveys.com/

    Here's a list of them, click on the "N. Chesapeake" button...

    http://www.boatus.com/insurance/survey.asp

    This guy does fiberglass surveys but he has a lot of online information on engines, running gear etc that you might find useful.

    http://www.yachtsurvey.com/

    You can google 'boat surveys' for more info.

    Call them up and discuss the situation and ask what it costs etc. That should be free.

    You can have a surveyor survey everything in the boat, all the systems etc or you can have him survey just the hull, which is your main concern right now. Without a good hull the rest is moot, and all the rest you or locals can figure out. If the hull is sound, I think you have a good boat, especially as you don't have to maintain a shiny, flawless work of art that you are afraid to use as you don't want to get some scratches on it. Getting the rudder loose and working should be pretty simple.

    You might get in touch with any welders in the area that can refer you around to whoever you need. Welders are the ones who end up doing the work, so they ought to have an idea on who does what, etc. I know in areas with a lot of houseboats, a surveyor isn't needed as the welders know enough about it that they just handle it all. I believe there is an electrical device that measures plate thickness and quality from the outside, I think it works using the principle of some sort of technical magic.

    In your case though I would want an actual surveyor in to give an opinion as to the boat and also possible references for good welders.
     
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  6. beernd
    Joined: Jun 2012
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    Location: Netherlands

    beernd Junior Member

    Hi Olicerj,
    how are things.
    Were you able to sort things out a bit?
    Just asking
     
  7. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    No not really. Rudder and steering gear are giving me hell.
    My 32 Ericson is at a standstill until I get the mast dropped.
    Running out of fun tickets.
    A lil under the weather.... And about to say $@#! It and scrap em both!
    Other than that... Things are great :)
     
  8. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    Beernd.
    Thanks for asking though... Very kind you
     
  9. beernd
    Joined: Jun 2012
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    Location: Netherlands

    beernd Junior Member

    Metal boats are patient creatures, just get well again and then get a look at, the questions at hand.
    Remember with steel boats there is no end to repairing possibilities, cut out and weld back in (on) at will.

    The overall impression I have got from your 48'er is that it is build like a tank!

    "Always look at the bright side of life", now where did that tune come from again?
     
  10. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    might be built of monel.

    Yesterday I met an doing some bright work on a boat next to my own. He asked if I was working on the boat for the owner. I told him that I was working on it and that I was her new owner. We only chatted for a short time before I had to leave but before heading out he gave me some insight to the boat and her PO.
    He informed me that the PO had told him that she was built of monel and not steel. This ment little to me as I had no idea as to what monel was. After some googleing I learning that monel was a nickel alloy that was very resistant to rusting and corrosion not to mention considerably more valuable than steel. The down side is that It's highly susceptible to galvonic corrosion when in contact to disimmilar metals.
    I have yet to test the hull to prove/disprove this possibility.
    The only thing I do know is that the rudder is in fact steel. Beyond that I'm slowly going mad with indecision as to the what to do with her. Do I keep her? If so will she come apart due to GC? Do I sell her or part her out and scrap the hull I just don't know anymore.
    Anyone want a monel tank?
     
  11. seadreamer6
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: helena,mt

    seadreamer6 Junior Member

    She doesn't look near as bad as I envisioned from your first post. She looks like she has great classic bones. Ya the welding on the hull isn't so pretty, but pretty doesn't necessarily make her more seaworthy.

    As far as the rudder goes, have you unhooked the hydraulics from the rudder and tried to move it by hand? That would give u a better idea of the real problem. That being said, I would still replace the rudder bearing and the cutlass and shaft bearing before i took her to sea since she has been sitting for awhile.

    Before you have your expert look it over open up everything you can to get access to the hull. These folks usually charge by the hour. This will also let you identify obvious rust locations.

    As far as your question about just cutting it out and welding in a patch...the answer is it depends. It depends on what the purpose of the rusted part was. Was it structural? Part of the watertight hull? used to attach rigging or other things that require strength? This is where you really want to get someone that knows steel boats to help you.

    Best of luck with your project.
     
  12. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    Ever heard of 'BLASTER'....PB Blaster that is. It is absolutely the best rust penetrate I have ever used.

    I was turned on to it years ago by an outboard shop in FL when I was having problems with a splined drive shaft in a small outboard. Nothing else worked (and I had tried 6 different things), This worked within a half hour.

    You can probably find it in any good auto parts supply house.
     
  13. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    Seadreamer6
    I've gone over her and all the repairs are fairly stait forward except the rudder. Have another look at the rudder pic. She has home made bearings and an external packing gland. The rudder is disconnected from the steering gear but still won't turn w/o a hydraulic engine hoist ram to move it. Bearings are rusted out or the shaft is bent. As for rust repair, it's a small section of the hulls skin that needs to be cut out and a patch welded back in. If any frames need replacing, that's easy because its just short sections of U Chanel (cut out and weld in new).
    My main prob is financial. I have two boat rebuilds going and am out of money. If she is in deed made of monel, the decision will be an easy one.... Look up scrap value of monel. I would love to keep her but would need backing untill the ericson project is finished and sold... Man this was written so mush better earlier before my comp crashed. Good night and I'll try and make more scence tomorrow :)
     
  14. seadreamer6
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: helena,mt

    seadreamer6 Junior Member

    I just looked up monel...over 4 usd per lb. Looks like you could come out real nice selling her for scrap.

    You will need to find out if it is monel before you do any welding because monel is very suceptible to galvonic corrosion if it is in contact with other metals.

    Here's a link that might help you identify if it is monel

    http://www.ehow.co.uk/facts_6371309_monel-metal_.html Of course the best way would be to ask a local metals expert.
     

  15. oliverj
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Location: Deale MD

    oliverj Junior Member

    Not monel
     
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