16' deep V center console build

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Deadeye, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Deadeye
    Joined: Jan 2009
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    Location: BC, Canada

    Deadeye Bender of Nails

    Hey all, got kind of a neat project on the go and could use some input.

    I'm finally starting on a build that's been a few years in the making: like the title says, it's a 16' salmon slayer. I mooch for salmon and jig for cod on the BC coast, so I want a deep V for the waves but also want some beam to smooth things out when I get there and sit at anchor for a few hours. My fishing grounds are only about 5-20 miles away, but that can be a pretty tough slog in the winter. It's well worth it when you've got all the best spots to yourself though, amirite ?

    Generally, the layout is 16' X 6' with a flared bow and a center console with T-top (it rains A LOT in the winter here !) It'll be about 38 degree entry with about 18 degrees at the transom. I should still be able to keep the transom to 20" (with a well) so it'll always be easy to find an outboard to repower. It'll have a bit of a bow deck enough for a windlass, and a pot puller back in the cockpit for traps. Probably not going to bother with downriggers but the sockets will be wired in and the gunwhale will be cored to take them.

    I'm starting on the strongback and formers right now and will need to make up the transom core pretty quick, so naturally I'm thinking about power. At this point I'm thinking 75-90hp Merc, but more power is always better until it needs more boat to float it. If I'm going to step up to the 115-125hp bracket, I'll want to lay up a 1-1/2" transom instead of the 1" I'm planning and the knees will come further forward as well (I'm using knees and stringers instead of loading the hull sides)

    I don't really have enough progress on it to share yet, but if you've read this far I feel like I need to throw out a pic, so here's where the bow flare is coming from. It's a whole lot easier to find a donor boat than to develop the flare from scratch, so this will become the bow of the plug. I have already cut off the gunwhales and the hardpoints so the curves will be fair when I wrap the hull sides over the formers. The transom is next to go and the hull will be gone from the chines down since that's where the V will start. The beam on the dinghy is only 4', so I'm opening that up to ~6' by the time it's about 7' aft. I'll finalize that once I lay some battens down and see how it looks.

    Thoughts ?
    Opinions ?
    I'm nuckin' futs for building another boat ?

    dinghy.jpg
     
  2. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    You really can't use the bow of that dinghy, to help make a plug for your 16 foot boat, that I can see. making plugs and moulds is an awful lot of work, and in the end you have virtually made three boats to have one that can be used. You don't see anything on the second-hand market that fits your requirements ?
     
  3. Deadeye
    Joined: Jan 2009
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    Deadeye Bender of Nails

    I agree that building this way isn't for the beginner, but I built boats for a living for many years. I enjoy doing the layup and fab work but don't get much chance to do anymore so I take on something like this every so often to keep the skills from getting rusty.

    Thx for the feedback !
     
  4. JSL
    Joined: Nov 2012
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    JSL Senior Member

    have you also been designing boat for many years?
    Increasing the beam by 50% (4' to 6') is quite significant
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2019
  5. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Still reckon it would be easier to do without trying to use that dinghy's little flared bow. This is certainly an unusual approach, and not one you'd normally think could work out well.
     
  6. KeithO
    Joined: Jul 2019
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    Location: Michigan

    KeithO Junior Member

    Im surprised to hear that someone wants to build such a tiny boat for that purpose. Given the rough seas, relative remoteness, time to rescue, load capacity etc, I would have thought that something more like 24-32ft would be in order. Up to 8'6" wide is also legal for towing and I would go as wide as possible for good stability. There have even been power cats of that width that performed very well in adverse conditions. 2 modest 4 stroke outboards and you would have a fishing machine...
    Example 2001 Used Leader 200 Cat Power Catamaran Boat For Sale - $21,000 - Batesburg, SC https://moreboats.com/boats/leader/200-cat/238734
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2019
  7. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    The cost of making the plug, the mould, then the boat, (assuming it is a fun thing and your labour value isn't factored in) is such, that it makes no sense. You end up with a small, no-brand boat this is worth next to nothing, and as indicated above, a boat too small for confident offshore use.
     
  8. Deering
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Deering Senior Member

    The bow looks flared on that tiny skiff, but once you tack it onto a 16’ long, 7’ wide boat it’s going to look kind of pointy. I wouldn’t want to be in it in a following sea. Why not just buy cheap plans for a ply/epoxy stitch and glue boat that has the correct proportions to begin with. It would be less monkeying around with a much surer outcome.
     
  9. KeithO
    Joined: Jul 2019
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    Location: Michigan

    KeithO Junior Member

    Here in MI where the boating season is about 4 months long, we are covered up in small boats.... Surely has to be faster and cheaper to buy something on the west coast and send it up on the ferry....
     
  10. Deadeye
    Joined: Jan 2009
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    Deadeye Bender of Nails

    Thx for the feedback, gents.

    JSL, while a few of the small boats I've built have been S&G from plans, most have been layed up from strips from scratch to try out an idea. I'm not just stretching & widening the little boat.

    Mr E, while I would agree that this isn't the easiest way to do it, this isn't about fast, cheap, or easy. Nor is it about resale value.
    If it turns out to be a failure, so be it - that's why I'm building it.

    Keith O, while I am on the west coast, my fishing grounds are in fairly sheltered water between some islands and the mainland. Open boats are the most common dayboats (from 12' tinnies and up) and 30ish is a large cruiser by local standards. Typically we see a short, steep chop in the winter when the winds backs to westerly and 3-4' is about as bad as it gets. In that weather, there's too much motion to sit on the hook. A long, narrow deep V takes out the pounding from that shop so we can carry a little more speed, at the expense of more power to plane it. Beam is a compromise between that and stability at anchor. the lower freeboard of an open boat makes it easier to bring in a salmon while staying low in the boat (seated)

    Deering, nothing's getting tacked on to anything. The bow flare I want can't be developed from a flat panel, hence the reason for pulling it from a donor boat. From the chines down, this will be a completely different boat.

    I understand and appreciate the constructive criticisms - they are far more valuable than empty praise and encouragement.
     
  11. Deering
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Deering Senior Member

    I guess I’m not understanding the dimensioning here. How wide will the flared portion be relative to the overall beam of the boat? Making that transition seems like it’d be a headache. But if your time is ‘free’ and you can live with whatever results from it, then you have nothing to lose. Post some pics as the project moves along.
     
  12. Deadeye
    Joined: Jan 2009
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    Deadeye Bender of Nails

    That transition is one of the questions in my OP: at this point, I'm thinking max beam will be about 7' aft of the bow but I'll mock up the curves on the forms with battens and see how it looks.
    The only part of the dinghy that will be used is the hull sides and stem. The bottom of the hull and the gunwhales will be gone and the hull sides will be kept full length so I can fair them into the rest of the hull. The seat in the bow will also be cut out so I can open the stem up a little. Again, I'm NOT just sticking this boat onto the front of a box to make it boat-shaped. If that's the impression I gave, that's on me.
     
  13. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Hollow flare at the bow really isn't that great an asset on a small planing boat, even when designed in, rather than attempted to be "grafted" off another, smaller boat. the production of spray is largely the doing of that part below the chine, the best insurance against it is a well-raked stem/forefoot, whereas plumb bows, and especially with the fullness needed on a planing hull, does tend to be wet. Reliance on hollow flare high up to compensate for slender waterlines lower down, is poor practice. You get a boat that will bury the bows down-sea, and get unwanted bow lift going up-wind, especially if there is little or no forward cabin structure that is aerodynamically tending to depress the bow. Hollow flare catches the wind more than is desirable, on light, short boats.
     
  14. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Further to your idea of a centre console with a t-top, in your climate that seems a recipe for "frozen assets", and especially if the boat is wet. I know dedicated fishos like the idea of a walk-around deck, but in wintry conditions, an open boat pushing in to a bit of breeze, sounds like an ordeal. More the province of this chap:
     

  15. KeithO
    Joined: Jul 2019
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    Location: Michigan

    KeithO Junior Member

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