Seaswirl Tempo 17 sole, mounts, stringers?

I'm not entirely certain why. It's hard not to point to my inexperience with 1708, and my failure to at least try it out on some scrap pieces before going right to the transom. Lord knows that would have made infinitely more sense than to just charge ahead blind. But - I made my bed now I gotta lie in it. It's really not that big of a deal. I have so many cutting and grinding tools and disks and stuff I can probably have that ground off and ready to try again in a few hours. It's more frustrating than anything else, and most of that frustration is directed toward myself. I KNOW BETTER. I'll get back to it in a few days; I'm taking a break to catch up on some other stuff

 

its much much easier to lay any fabrics in and over a soft squishy layer of wet glass as I said it brings resin up from under as you wet out the top layer!!.
Another way is to lay csm first again wet fit the 1708 and fold one halg over the top and wet the back then place it back down and do the same with the other side fold , wet and lay down This is also a easy way to make sure the edges are completely wet out !!
Have done all these things so many times never give it a second thought !!
the other advantage is the soft layer below acts to fill and level the top layer if the surface is not completely flat !!

 

Back at it today. WOW what a mess! I was able to grind off almost all the 1708, which is good news. I have to get out the dremel to get the rest of it, but it's almost all out. Also more good news, it wasn't too hard to tell the difference, while grinding down, between the dry 1708 and the healthy pink CSM. I did nick the wood in 3 small spots, but I'm not going to worry about that. I was wearing my tyvek suit and everywhere I wasn't kneeling or otherwise leaning against something, the suit protected faitly well. Judging by the amount of FG I cleaned up and how little I itch, I'd call it a success! I'll have some pics tomorrow. I'm in a better mood now that I got that 1708 out of there. Tomorrow will be finish grinding, and laying up 2 clean successful wet layers of 1708. I'm going to have lots of rollers and brushes at hand, 6 containers of 16ozs un catalyzed polyester at the ready, and yes a hard laminating roller as well. Learning is SUCH a pain in the tookus. Stay tuned.

 

Ok remember you need a couple of layers of 450 csm down on the wood first wet out thoroughly and quickly rolled with a hard roller !! for all these layers lower your catalyst ratio just a whisker to allow a little more time to work with it !!
Then put the 1708 over the top of that rolled out wet layer and really saturate it well with resin and make sure its shiny wet and 100% no dry patch's any where specially and including the edges , now roll it out starting from the middle towards the outside edges press firmly to light !! not heavy with the hard roller !!. that hard roller can squeeze the resin out of the glass if you press to hard and then you have problems of getting rein back into the glass again ,like I said press firm but at a constant speed !!.
Now after that the second layer of 1708 as I said keep the catalyst ratio down just a little and get the 1708 on , wet out and rolled .
Because of the thickness and amount of glass you have on its will get warm when it starts to gel so keep a eye on it that its warm to the touch of you hand not really hot ! wet towels are a way of drawing the heat away and it only lasts for a short time IF IT DOES HAPPEN !!

REMEBER make sure the glass is wet all over and no dry patch's any where!!
Make sure you used the hard roller and quickly roll out the two layers of csm , get the 1708 on and thoroughly 100 % wet out and gently but firmly roll it into the csm soft wet layer below . same with the second layer !! wet, roll and then at the end use your paint roller and gently roll over the whole surface this will mop up any wet places and wet out any not quite wet places and make the whole surface look really good squeeze the resin out of the roller and roll over again just to make sure the surface is uniform looking every where !! Don't forget the edges needs to be wet out rolled and no signs of dry glass any where !!
On a job that size you should be able to breeze through it in 30 minutes no problem so you first layers of csm should be starting to gel and there warmth will set off the layers on top .

When laying thick layer ups keep the catalyst a little lower than you would normally used , wet on wet layers makes a really neat job , the plus to all of this is in reality you will have used a little less resin . may not be noticeable at the time but you have a much higher glass to resin content than if it was done bit by bit !! And the other plus is the warmth it creates helps to cure the glass much better !!

You should not have to move away from where you are working for any reason, so once you start it all go till its done and finished . AGAIN like I said 30 minutes tops for the total job !!

Hope you had a good break away !!

 

I had a great break, it's summer vacation season

Made some more progress today. I sanded the new 1708, and added a tab all around the transom to kind of fair it in and add some strength.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/gnn_S0PlJZljb3pPnwvlqKHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

Pretty far from perfect. In fact, I should technically grind it off again and do it again, but I'm thinking I'm going to move forward.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/eqXX2euShZSMj-ZqPsGBHqHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

This 1708 is in my opinion, difficult to work with. It soaks up lots of resin. That's not a bad thing, but it's difficult for a rookie like me to know how much area to work with, how much resin to have on hand, etc.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/aNFxK8J0itB9p76pvCKvnqHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

I think in hindsight, I would have had better luck just layering the CSM and cloth one at a time. Hard to say.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/DQOO8VADMH2eYNy0_bsZD6HCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

Lessons learned while in "the fire" are for me, 100% more effective that those learned by any other method. MUCH more painful way of learning, but much more "my style".

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/sTvHBKgA0if3BR645wbhzKHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

Tomorrow night will be some clean up and maybe start on a former for the stringers. I'm going to take them all the way to, and tab to, the transom. Unlike the original construction where the stringers stopped short and let the floor be the structure that bound them to the transom.

 

the advantages of using peel ply could have helped you a lot and made a much nicer finish that you wouldn't have to sand grind or what ever !! . Next smallish job you have try it but tell me first . so all went basically to plan??
Good and onto the next bits !!

 

I wouldn't say it went exactly to plan. I would say it went. I'm glad this part is done, it was a challenge. I don't see the next parts being this bad. What's left is extending the stringers to the transom, making the engine mounts, the bulkheads that I pulled out, and the floor. I'm going to install the gussets after I install the engine to make sure I don't put em in too close. I think the hardest part is behind me, but who knows in situations like this?

 

personally the gussets I would give them a miss . With a transom as thick and as big as you have there's no way its going any where , you will be tying the stringers to the transom anyway and maybe just a smallish knee would be suitable the engine beds and motor mounts I would concentrate on and get them in down and glassed over but pads of glass under the beds and glass over is important .
2 layers of 1708 coming out onto the hull 100mm if its possible one layer slightly smaller than the other .Pads under loads against the hull will distribute that load over a wider area , its the same as basic engineering principles !! but its glass and not metals !!

 

Made a good bit of progress today. Stringer extensions, engine mounts were today. Have a look:

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/CdPenl0RWJbuT_S8cOazCKHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

It's not finished, I still have some trimming and tabbing to do but I got alot done.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/aSBRFKUlPh1dZ47BNjHwJKHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

I put in the stringer extensions last night. I made a former out of cardboard, and layered 2 layers of glass tape on em to give em some structure; something for the CSM and 1708 to grab on to.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/KsDLmoHUgzQxYIIb4NCKQ6HCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

I had to do ALOT of buildup to get the stringers dimensionally correct. I couldn't get the contour of the new stringers to match the original. There's mucho glass in there though. I think it will be ok.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/jdeyuchLjepeXp9t7bH2eqHCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

The stringers are tabbed into the hull, transom and original stringers. Then the engine mounts went in. 2 layers of 1708 tabbing them to the stringers and hull. When it's done, the transom, hull, stringers, and engine mounts will all be tabbed into each other.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/fd0q8qfFhK-Q3opB_thI26HCuTx9N85ff0vacwuIzpg?feat=directlink

I'm thinking I'm going to have a fairly string structure when I'm done. I have to trim the ends of the mounts, tab them in and put in the new bulkhead thats already laminated and ready to go.

I also have my left and right floor halves cut and fitted. Laminating them right now. A few days and a few layers of CSM front and back on those, and they'll be ready to go in. Then it's a few middle pieces, tab everything together, and the structure is done. It'll then be time to rob the parts off the donor vessel! Getting closer every day!

 

Do a Dumby run would be my choice real soon ,like now !!

before getting to far ahead of you self I would be getting the hole cut in the transom and a couple of bolts to hold in place then hanging the motor in place to do a alignment and length check and doubly checking the placement of everything is 110% "A" ok then remove it all and carry on again !! its got to be done any way so now is as gooder time as any . if you get all the glassing done and then find its not right its a tear out and rebuild doctor up and repair job !!
Me I would rather be sure than sorry !!. doing these kinds of jobs there always the unforeseen that catch's you by surprise even just small things like the oil filter removal and replace or something that's really close to the frame and could make vibration and noise .
Is also a good time to check the steering and its coupling up and exhaust etc etc and the placement and the mounting of the power trim and till pump and routing of hoses etc !!
!!:idea:

 

Good points all around. I read somewhere its better to get the engine in place and the center marked before any drilling happens to assure the keyhole is in the right place. I'm running into trouble with the floor boards and bulkheads. I can't get anything to stick to the edges. I tried CSM and 4" tape. I wanted something to wrap around the edges before I layed my 2 layers of CSM. Would you have any pointers on how to deal with the edges of boards in general?

 

What thickness of plywood are you talking of ?? 12 mm thicker or thinner ??
Ok glass never likes to go round corners specially external edges and the like and just wants to straighten out and so you get bubbles all along one edge or even both ,top or bottom !!edges will have to have a radiused edge !! the bigger the radius the better but on ply thinner than 12 mm impossible just paint a few coats of resin on the edges or get some real thin boat cloth and wrap a couple of layers of that first and let it go hard and then glass the flat surfaces top and bottom and lightly sand . you can use Mylar plastic and put that over the glass and roll it down then masking tape in place both sides and hold tension on the Mylar so the glass cant push back out . The light glass is possibly the best and easiest option but it still has to have a radiused corner both top and bottom !!can also try thicken the resin!! :idea:

 

Half inch. So that's what 12mm? Something like that. I think I'm going to just put a few layers of resin around the edges and let it go at that. I kind of thought that was going to be my only real option. When the floor rots again in a few years it'll be easy to pull up now that I have it in a few sections not just one giant piece.

 

This is starting to look like my boat again. Most of the floor is in (pics tomorrow), tabbed to the hull with 2 layers of 1708 along the sides and rear. I used PL to attach the pieces to the stringers. It was hot today and wow did that PL flow fast! I could have solved my transom filler thickness problem if I would have done it today instead of back in April. Ah well. I still have some detail tabbing and filling to do but the keyhole and engine will be next. I have a template I downloaded from Volvos website. It printed up in real size, so all I had to do was tape the 6 or 8 sheets that came out of my printer together precisely and I have a template! It looks like its the same as the Merc but I'm going to pull the donor drive to measure and be sure before I start cutting my new transom. I think I will cut it then gelcoat it. The donor vessel already has controls, cables, etc installed so it'll just be a matter of moving that stuff over it would seem. I'm going to build a gantry crane out of Habitat For Humanity lumber to do the swap and use a come along as the hoisting device. By the way, so far my entire budget for this project has not exceeded 2000 dollars and that includes the donor vessel purchase,so I'm happy about that. I'm about to go on another break and won't be back until late July. I am determined to splash in August!

 

ok
I to will be away end of July for 3 weeks !! taking my wife and going nz ! she never been out of the country so will be a huge adventure for her !
Anyway good luck and will try to watch for you posts !!! Will be interesting to hear all about it and how it goes !!
See ya