Build A Power Boat , Powered By Wind

In that case your education was wrong, I'm afraid. Automotive motors are rated for a duty cycle that is quite low, typically they have a peak to average power rating of around 5:1. If you look at the specifications for any electric motor you will find that it has a peak rating (that typically has a run time limit of a few minutes) and a continuous power rating. As with pretty much all electrical machines, the continuous power rating is determined by the ability of the motor to dissipate waste heat, the peak power rating is determined by the peak current handling capability of the windings and the peak power time limit is determined by the winding thermal time constant (how long the peak current can flow before the windings overheat).

The solar river boats that you linked to are similar to my own boat, but larger and heavier. Although they may be fitted with 20kW peak power motors, I am near certain that the average power they use will be much, much lower, probably no more than 5 to 10kW total. The higher peak power is needed for manoeuvring, I suspect. Generally, the power requirements for slow speed inland waterway craft are quite low. Here a typical 20 metre canal boat displacing around 18 tonnes will often be propelled by a 15kW peak engine, with typical cruise power of around 4 to 5kW.

As we keep repeating to you, you really do need to do some proper calculations using realistic data. You cannot proceed with a project like this with figures that are so much in error, unless you just wish to make an expensive mistake.

 

For what it's worth, I did a quick and conservative calculation about those Kaohsiung electric catamarans and the result is, with all the uncertainities realated to not knowing the details of the hull geometry, around 12-15 kW at declared max speed (9 kts) and less than 0.5 kW at 3 knots, at 8t max weight. Speeds taken from here: http://www.bairdmaritime.com/index....-boat-&catid=76:marine-environment&Itemid=212
So, though my max power estimate is numerically a bit higher than yours, it takes nothing from your observation about motor power ratings, and actually reinforces it.
Cheers
Slavi

 

this wind gen powered boat makes me think of a direct coupled setup with windmill turning some pulleys and belts running down to the propshaft below and the boat running into the wind, I assume that would not work, so neither will this.

 

Why would you assume it would not work? It does work and has been demonstrated many times. You can find videos of it on Youtube - just search under "Windmill Driven Boat".

 

does work as a novelty but is not practical. I am sure most understand this just wanted to point out.

And as to the plants 99% etc... It was earlier in this thread stated that plants can produce new plant at 99% efficiency.
And as I stated - there might be part of the process that is 99% efficient but as a whole not even close.
I wouldn't be surprised if even the "detail claim" is optimistc - happens even in science.

 

So who has done these tests to prove its "not practical"?. Windmaster has done tests to prove it IS practical. How can something be "not practical" when it's never been tried? You admit it works, so how does a "novelty" differ from anything else?

 

I am familiar with windmasters project. Unless I have missed some new development.

1st of all his cart was a downwind cart - and it works well in those narrow parameters. His cart also does not have a wind generator but a propeller. Different thing though similar topic.

For going upwind tacking on a sailboat is likely to be more efficient and practical. Benefit of the more traditional sail boat is that it does work pretty well in several points of sail.

there are several boast (image of one is posted ion this thread) that do exactly what is suggested - gears transmit wind turbine power to a propeller. I say novelty because it can do something a regular sail boat can not do. But overall it does not outperform sails.

I am not saying it does not work but I am saying it works well in narrow set of conditions and that conventional setup is more robust and flexible and thus superior.

English is not my 1st language but isn't it pretty clear what my point is?

 

I'm sure Windmaster would like to be credited with going downwind faster than the wind. But it wasn't he who did it.
You are trying to compare apples to oranges, it's not a question of which one is superior. Like the aeroplane and the helicopter. It's not a question of which one is the best. They do different jobs. A windmill boat can sail directly windward, so is clearly superior to a normal sailboat IN THAT RESPECT. A normal sailboat can (probably) go better off the wind, so IN THAT RESPECT is superior. I am not saying that either is better than the other in all ways. It's not a competition to see what is the best. It's just a different way of doing things. You don't have to vote and say which is best since each has it's good points and bad points.

 

My bad - Windmaster was very active on the down wind discussion so I mixed him up with ThinAirDesigns.

I think we mostly fiercely agree. I am not opposing building such boat and I am not saying it will not work . And I agree that studying one can be worthwhile. But I don't see it beating a traditional sailboat in typical use. And I do like diversity and "just because" projects - I think they are crucial for development of new. But in relation to this topic - I do not think its practical. Neither to charge batteries or directly drive a propeller with the suggested windmill.

And OP really is in no position to make assumptions of the price/performance of the boat he is suggesting.

 

thats the point here.... the OP needs to realize the following;

increase budget at least 10x,

change batteries to a more suitable Lithium type chemistry,

reduce motor power from a ridiculous 100Kw,

Make the vessel a catamaran to get anywhere near his desired 14kt speeds, otherwise choose a more realistic speed below the hull speed of his proposed monohull,

otherwise forget it, give up, aint gonna happen... i mean how much more help can we give this guy?

 

BAVARIA CRUISER55 HAS 81KW/110PS auxiliary MOTOR

Would you explain why BAVARIA CRUISER55 HAS 81KW/110PS auxiliary MOTOR as most sailing boats in similar motor size?http://www.bavaria-yachtbau.com/segelyachten/cruiser-55/technische-daten.html

Do you think 10KW motor is enough for Our project (as the main engine) ?

A 10kw motor may push the boat, Is the market will accept the slow
acceleration boat ( turtle boat)?

 

Because they can? because their extremely dense energy storage (diesel) allows the the luxury of excess?

You inisist on big power based on guesses but have no answer for any of the obvious faults in your basic assumptions.

 

Direct wind trubine driven boat

About 15 or 20 years ago in Eastern Canada there was a professor who built an "egg beater windmill" direct drive gadget on a small boat.

Note, the eggbeater design made the wind direction of small importance.

It "kind of" worked, but have you ever seen one on water?

The name of the game is energy density and this is why nothing even comes close to gasoline (petrol if you are a Brit.) or diesel.

Some incredibly good technical advice from eminent people was wasted on some deaf ears here.

Look at this very high power density motor and controller. Coupled with Poli-lithium batteries, charged from a very large bank of photovoltaic panels it might make some difference, but not as a stand alone propulsion system.

Regards,

Stephen I. M.

 

This is the last time I'm going to say this. DO SOME CALCULATIONS FOR YOUR HULL DESIGN. You simply cannot expect to guess the right size of motor for an application that is as power-critical as yours by comparison with gasoline/diesel powered boats. The electric motor has to be optimised to the hull requirements so that you can then size the batteries and wind generator to match.

You should also note that the vast majority of gasoline/diesel engines fitted to displacement leisure boats are larger than they need to be, and may also not be fitted with the most efficient propeller or gearbox. There is no real need to get maximum efficiency from a gasoline/diesel powered boat, as it is easy to fit a bigger engine than is really needed.

Your boat will need to be carefully optimised, because you do not have much energy available to power it. This means choosing the most efficient propeller you can, something up around 80% rather than the more typical 60 to 65% fitted to many leisure boats. The propeller will need to be a large diameter, and turn relatively slowly, which may impact on your hull design.

You need to start this project with the hull design, determine the power needed to overcome hull resistance at your chosen cruise speed, design the propeller to match the thrust requirement given by the hull resistance data, select a motor and drive system that will drive your chosen propeller at the correct rpm and torque and then go on to select the battery and wind generator system.

 

NO
Kerosene pretty much nailed it
as did Jeremy

deal is your just not listening