Global Warming? are humans to blame?

What you mean didn't have any? I'll have you know that Frosty is the biggest tit in the whole of Thailand (he actually thought it was 'Titland' which is why he moved there), accuracy never was a watch word with the Snowman

 

Can someone explain to me how ground level ozone is pollution, but pollution is causing a hole in the ozone layer. And if ozone is pollution, why are we buying "Ionic Breeze" air purifiers that make ions out of the oxygen in our air. (Ozone again) And bottled ozone is used to purify smells and sewage and such. I'm so confused.

And sceptical.

There are a lot of ways to decrease pollution and waste without trying to take away other people's freedom. Some are fun and even save money.

I choose not to smoke tobacco, but I resent a dope smoking hippie type telling me I can't.

Don't you just love the smell of a big bakery at 2am? Sorry, but that's pollution, don't you know?

I strongly disagree that all hydrocarbon emissions are pollution. All plants do it. Will we tax smelling flowers? Or outlaw having flowers to smell.

Just how ridiculous do they have to get before saner types cry "ENOUGH!"?

Lance.

 

Ozone (O3) is triatomic oxygen. It is not absorbable as 'breathable oxygen' the way O2 is absorbed, and is rather a poison.

Ozone is produced when high energy rays from the sun strike the atmosphere at high altitude. It does not do this with as much energy at lower altitudes since the atmosphere filters the higher energy rays out at the lower strata. Thus we see that ozone is progressively more present the higher the altitudes, with the highest altitudes having oxygen almost exclusively in the form of ozone rather than the diatomic O2. There really is no such thing as the 'Ozone Layer' since it is a continuously varying proportion of O2/03 from the lowest to highest altitudes. The poles are also less impacted by solar radiation , thus less ozone is produced there, which is the MOST LIKELY cause of the 'hole'. Note that the 'hole' was predicted by scientists decades before the introduction of CFC refrigerants.

Now if certain ravaging elements (specifically chlorine) were causing damage to stratospheric ozone, then why don't we see a more uniform reduction in the high altitude ozone all around the earth rather than just at the poles, and especially the south pole? After all, very little anthropogenic chlorine is/was ever released at the poles, right?

Also, while it has been demonstrated (in a laboratory setting) the high-level solar energies can break CFC's and HCFC's down to release their chlorine molecules (whence they allegedly 'damage' the ozone by converting it back to O2), no one has suggested a plausible mechanism for transporting the CFC's (which are after all several times heavier than air) up into the higher stratosphere, whereupon they might be struck by that high energy solar radiation to become broken down to release the chlorine in the first place

Almost 20 years now after the ban we are still waiting for the 'hole' to heal, a hole which some scientists suspect has always been there. I predic we will be waiting a LONG time

Jimbo

 

and still it goes on! What a waste of time! just wait until somebody notices that the internet is probably polution, well radio waves are!! That'll bugger the system won't it?

 

Although Walruses posting did not destroy a single tree or use a ounce of water nor pollute any air.

No animal died or was hurt or harmed in any way from the results of his post.

However trillions of electrons were extremely inconvenienced.

 

Some interesting excerpts from testimony before the US Congress:

"CO2 is not a pollutant. In simple terms, CO2 is the lifeblood of the planet. The vegetation we see around us would disappear, if not for atmospheric CO2. This green world largely evolved during a period when the atmospheric CO2 concentration was many times what it is today. In other words, carbon dioxide means life itself."...

"Fundamental processes, for example heat transfer, are not adequately described in the [climate] models,

"show much less warming, less than half, observed at the surface. The real world shows less warming in the atmosphere, not more, as models predict."

"Our country is often criticized for producing 25% of the world's anthropogenic CO2, however, we are rarely recognized and applauded for producing, with that same CO2, 31% of what the world wants and needs; its food, technology, medical advances, defense of freedom, and so on."

"large temperature swings have been common in the past 1,000 years, and that temperatures warmer than today were common in 50-year periods about 1,000 years ago. These studies suggest that the climate we see today is not unusual at all."

"Any of the proposals to reduce energy consumption by mandate (promoted in the state legislatures and the Congress) would do nothing measurable to reduce the climate impacts of CO2."


Dr. John Christy,
Lead Author, United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, Testifying on May 13, 2003 before the US House of Representatives'

You can read the testimony unabridged here:

http://www.co2science.org/scripts/CO2ScienceB2C/articles/V6/N22/EDIT.jsp


Jimbo

 

Hi Lance,

It's all about money. Every now and again someone comes up with this scheme and cry wolf. Ever since I was a kid I had heard the end is near due to human whatever... depending what was fashion and what the people was ready to buy.

There are polutants but please do not tell me my fridge's gass that escaped last month is the cause for the 'hole in the ozone layer' because there is no 'ozone layer'. Ozone is O3, and it gets broken down very quickly (in seconds) with simple air turbulance back into O2 (oxygen).

Same with the lead free solder that is now compulsary in many countries. Lead btw is MUCH LESS POISENOUS than the fumes the lead-free stuff emmits, but since a LOT of money is to be made out of it it gets enforced.

The earth has it's own biorythm as it travels through the cosmos... we just happens to be in a phase where it picks up a bit more heat. Some years ago they feared there was another ice age comming. Theory had it then that it was a similar ice age that ended the dynosours. Now they theorize that a meteorite colided with the earth and put so much heat, dust and smoke in the air that it was too dark for the dyno's to survive.

A single lightning strike generates 1000th's of tons of ozone killing lots of bac and teria in it's area and generate maga amounts of O2 air. So I don't think we will run out of air just yet.

Do you realize that hydrolysis hydrogen would probably be our next and most powerfull energy source... you're sailing on it every day. and sea water is considered just the right mixture for it. You come up with a working thing and the oil co's will have you taken out before you can blink your eyes...

 

I hope this global warming thing is true. My home is 310ft above sea level and I will also have my floating home finished before everyone starts to cry that the sky is falling in.

All my preparation is co-incidental to the climate change thing - it is my "so they lived happily ever after" sea change/retirement thing.

Who gives a s..t about being a billionare, cant take it with you, nor will it buy entry tickets to heaven. Don't be deluded, Stalin saw that it was only an "opiate for the masses" and also saw the present trials & tribulations in ther "economic marketplace" but then I am not a communist either. but I think Jesus may have been one.

 

My biggest fear on this topic is that one day someone will be able to prove, without a doubt that we HAVE changed the climate...
Once humans figure out they can change something, they will try to fix it...
In trying to fix the climate...humans will fuggitup...beyond all repair....
Cheers

 

A multi-nation conference in Bali is trying to do that now. 17000 ? delegates from many global Governments and the "big end of town" corporations and other media junkies.

Learn to be self sufficient, do not depend on going to the corner store to get replacements etc. Learn to live like a pacific islander - at peace.

A UN development specialist was in conversation with an islander saying if you got motivated you could grow produce, mine gold & other minerals to generate good revenue, then expand by franchising your successful systems making lots of money....
What for says the Islander as he stretches out under the shadey tree becoming even more comfortable....
Why then with lots of money you could afford to sit down and relax under a shady tree....
Are you really that stupid? retorts the Islander, I am doing that now!

 

Global Warming? are humans to blame.

Has anyone seen anything that remains static? Everything changes and it is called time.

 

Static, I get to feel a bit of it when I get out of the car after a long drive on a hot dry day. Real hard to get a second jolt. Better than Kola.

 

I recently saw a news magazine where they visited the Antarctic research station where they measure the ozone thickness. In recent years the layer has become thicker, in fact thinker than is was in the 1950's.

The researcher they were interviewing was actually taking credit for the recent thickening by saying that all the efforts they took to warn about the hazard of ozone depletion and to outlaw CFCs actually paid off.

So they do not know what causes it, what role in plays in the atmosphere, nor what can affect its thickness, yet they still take credit for it. There was not even any proof that CFC actually harmed the ozone layer.

The only reason that CFCs were outlawed was one company had a patented replacement for the refrigerants in air conditioners and refrigerators. That was DuPont, who was making many campaign contribution to law makers who would vote give them a monopoly on all refrigerants.

Makes one think of the global warming issue. Should the climate swing back and cool off in the next few decades (as it is likely to do, as it has always done), rather than being proved wrong, the fools will take credit for it.

 

time

It's that things seem to change more rapidly since monkey's learned how to play with fire.

Many of the pacific islands sailors are dreaming about are just a few feet above sea level. Some of them have been abandoned by the "pacific islanders" already as their trees refused to produce shade from salt water.

 

Ah **** some people are sooo full of conspiracy theories! Next you will be saying "W" topped JFK so in due time he could start WW3 as Pres. of US!????

The Drivel thread is appropriate for dopey climate change denying fools. But then this is full of drivel so I hereby christen it "Drivel 3"

Long may the verbal diarrhoea flow, and in their own pontification, fail to let them see the evidence, as the water rises up their legs, while they sit at home arguing on this thread.