career prospects very limited??? read this link provided!

LOL....at my age I suppose that is mostly what there is anymore. I try to only share them over suds.

 

Guinness goes well with sea stories, I find.

It goes well with most other things too.

 

Gentlemen,
Wow, penthouse to outhouse in one thread!
Is this honesty or pesimism?
I hate this guy is unhappy, been there. Don't want my bubble burst before I get to inflate it. Don't want to piss up a rope either.
I am a boat captain and have made arrangements (financially and otherwise) to devote 1 year, starting in February to the Macnaughton YDS full time. I am 43 years old and as I am sure you can imagine it is somewhat TERRIFYING to make this career change at my age. And this tid bit has taken a bit of the wind out of my sails. I have not posted before because I wanted to wait till I was actually there, although I have already submitted my resignation, am committed totally, and already studying (devouring the required reading). But, I will pipe up now and ask for a little more input from you guys on this subject, if you wouldn t mind taking the time. This is not a spur of the moment decision and has taken much planning as I have a family and bills and love what I do, blah, blah, blah,.
Also, if you don t mind, your opinions on the school.
Thank you in advance for your valuable time.

 

Cap'n Clay;

Forgive me, I haven't had a drop of coffee yet and it's 3 am...

I think you'll find alot of kindred spirits on this forum.

I was thinking the same thing when I saw this post a month ago, and responded in much the same sentiment.

I'm at "the other" design school, just starting out, and not wanting to hear about trouble in the industry. I have noted what the man was saying in the first post, and will try to avoid that situation. I note his advice just like you might note the casualties in the back of professional mariner. I did this same type of thing in the equivalent publications of the aviation industry, and it works pretty well (gives you a pre-loaded game plan if a similar situation arises).

I take what he said as a snapshot of his experience alone in the industry. I know from a small amount of personal experience that this one post doesn't speak for the entire industry. At any rate, it's not stoppin' me. I need some coffee!

--Matt

 

Please do not be discouraged, just be sure to go into something with your eyes open to reality rather than the schools' hype (remember how they make their living). I think that there is a need for small boat designers and always will be. In my previous career as a Controls Engineer (something I loved doing in many ways) there are many people making very good livings. I got burned out by the long hours, time away from home, and scumbag company managements and then decided I did not want to live what is left of my life that way. I think many people arrive at this point despite whichever field they have been in. I still do controls engineering work on a contract, small job, basis only.

My recommendation is to live your dream and go with it as long as you can. Tom will teach you a lot and get you started on the path. I am currently taking the Rhino course from YDS as I have ways to make money from those skills. I am uncertain at this point whether to pursue the designing education from YDS or anyone. I like to build small craft and work from existing plan sets more than I like designing of boats. I also like to understand the designer's perspective with boats I build, ergo the probable later taking a COI for small craft design.

Good luck and keep in contact as you pursue your new field/dream
Greg Luckett

 

MacNaughton is tops

CaptainClay, I'm a vessel master also and there is a great need for designers of commercial vessels. Most of the Gulf Coast yards would snap you up in a heartbeat once the course is completed. The money is better with commercial vessels also and state of the art design is continually moving forward in creating more efficient vessels for the commercial world.. It's a great place to get experience.
I've known Tom MacNaughton and his family for years since he lived on a schooner in Hilton Head and he is at the top of the heap in yacht design.
Captain D. Lang

 

Capt. D. Lang,
Your post is very inspirational and provides hope. Thank you.

What yards on the Gulf coast are you speaking of? It would be great to know who to send the resumes and job applications to.
Thanks again,
Greg Luckett

 

Design employment

Greg, one of the best resources for getting in to the commercial design field is WORK BOAT MAGAZINE. This is a work boat trade journal and it's free. You could try Halter Marine, Engles Shipbuilding and several others. Cruise the internet for shipbuilding companies and make a list. Another good academic resorce is the Seamans Church Institute in New York. I took a shipbuilding course there several years ago and it was excellent.
Being that you have a captains license, get your STCW and radar endorsements. If your license is for 100 tons or higher, you can also work on some of these commercial vessels in the Gulf and make $250 per day plus expenses (starting pay) while you're taking your course. This is excellent exposure to the actual commercial vessel design, powerplants and drives such as Voght Schneider, Z-drive and others. I am on my 6th license renewal and still learning. Almost all deck officers study on their off watch to accomplish higher educational requirements.
The world of yacht design is harder to break into due to the number of people going in that direction. Almost all potential yacht and small boat designers are working at some other job while they're learning. Why not work in the trade that you are also studying for. You'll get to the goal quicker and with a lot more practical experience and knowledge.
With probable plans for starting your own yacht design office in the future, it's always better if you have contacts established in the trade. As an example, DeJong and Lebay Naval Architects in Jacksonville, Florida do a great business in both yacht design and commercial vessels. Commercial vessel design generally brings in higher income than boats or yachts unless you get a contract for a large yacht, and those type commissions are few. I can justify this statement by the yacht market today. Look at only one source, Yachtworld.com, and you will see almost a 104,000 boats and yachts for sale and few being sold. Conversely, the demand for commercial vessels has created a big back log at almost all of the yards for offshore supply vessels, pushboats, tugs, security RIBs and many other designs.
D. Lang

 

Susie Bush is a recruiter at Sirius Technical Services, Inc. in Mobile, http://www.siriustechnical.com which recruits into the marine industry.

She would probably be willing to give you some information about what is needed and what is available in the Gulf.

 

Jobs

You might contact John Dane, CEO of the Trinity Shipbuilding Group. Vince Almerico is the Chief Naval Architect. They also own Moss Point Marine and some other yards. Lockheed Shipbuilding in Seattle also employs several Naval Architects and Engineers as does Electric Boat Company. You have to exert some personal effort to compile a list of shipbuilding companies and contact them. With a desire to work in the field of ship and boat design, the very first step is to find out if there's a market need for the profession before spending a lot of time and money achieving the educational goal. While the forum can be helpful, personal effort usually pays larger and more meaningful dividends.

 

US/Asian connection

Marine Trading International, Toms River, New Jersey, has been working with Taiwan for over 20 years in building Marine Trader Trawlers as have many other boat buildong companies. The opportunities are there, you just have to look for them and develop a network within the industry.

 

Having pondered these last msgs, I suppose no one is really "snapping up" designers? It sounds like the normal job searching in a limited market at this point. Thanks for the leads, they should be really helpfull to those looking for the work. An interesting fact that has come up here is the demand in the commercial market for designers vs. the non-commercial market. This thread has been very enlightening.
Thanks,
Greg Luckett

 

Yes, experienced designers in the commercial field are being snapped up big time, especially NAs or ME with engineering degrees or trade designers with CAD and ShipConstructor/Tribon/Rebus/Foran etc. There's also some need in superyachts, especially.

But they want experience/degrees or both.

See the job board on www.sname.org

 

Here is the Bureau of Labor Statistics page for NAME.

http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes172121.htm#nat

It probably mainly represents commercial NAME, not yachts

 

Sorry it has taken so long to say thanks for the replies, info. and encouragement. I have been offshore for a bit.
I have decided to take this poor guys words with a grain of salt, appreciate his opinion and wish him the best.
I have run bare boat sail charters in the caribbean, live aboard sail/dive charters in the Bahamas, a mini cruise ship in Alaska, N.Z. made jet boat thrill rides, sport fish boats, a head boat, crew boats, utility boats, lightering boats, supply boats,including D.P, in the oilfield, (never did find the gravy boat). I have lived aboard on and off for over 5 years on both power and sail. His post says that you need to have a background in boating or be from a well heeled family... I guess I'll just try and make a go at it with my measley 50 per cent worth of prerequisites and hope for the best.
I am very much looking forward to learning from Mr. Macnaughton and I actually think his "steaming cups of coffee" are a nice touch.
Thanks in advance for everything I am sure I will learn from you all as well.
Captain Clay