Scow with a hint of bow?

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Terje Dahl, Nov 22, 2022.

  1. Yves Pfister
    Joined: Jan 2022
    Posts: 5
    Likes: 5, Points: 3
    Location: Switzerland

    Yves Pfister Junior Member

    Paul Scott likes this.
  2. wet feet
    Joined: Nov 2004
    Posts: 1,391
    Likes: 433, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 124
    Location: East Anglia,England

    wet feet Senior Member

    Congratulation on creating that model in Freecad!It can't have been easy and looks credible.Might we ask if there are plans to add the rig and foils?You may find criticism for the shape and concept appears but it looks like a smaller Class 40 boat with all that goes along with the concept.Which may cause some people to question how well it might suit their particular location.Which is true of almost any boat because there is no boat I know of which is perfect for every place,so you might as well design something that works where you plan to use it.I would think a 28 foot hull is a bit small for the canting keel concept,am I right?
     
  3. skaraborgcraft
    Joined: Dec 2020
    Posts: 374
    Likes: 112, Points: 43
    Location: sweden

    skaraborgcraft Senior Member

    Canting keels are used in the Mini 6.5 21ft type boats, so no real limit on size.
     
  4. skaraborgcraft
    Joined: Dec 2020
    Posts: 374
    Likes: 112, Points: 43
    Location: sweden

    skaraborgcraft Senior Member

    I think there is a trade off point in having very bouyant bows and then having a deck that scoops green water. Realistic in that you could build a boat like this, for sure. Flattish water is where it would work best IMHO.
     
  5. wet feet
    Joined: Nov 2004
    Posts: 1,391
    Likes: 433, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 124
    Location: East Anglia,England

    wet feet Senior Member

    Indeed they are in use on mini-Transats .Where there is usually enough height within the hull for the mechanism to reside.The preliminary design linked to seems to be mainly an open boat,with very little depth of hull below the cockpit to accommodate the hardware.I'm still in awe of anybody able to create a hull in Freecad.
     
  6. skaraborgcraft
    Joined: Dec 2020
    Posts: 374
    Likes: 112, Points: 43
    Location: sweden

    skaraborgcraft Senior Member

    Given strong enough hydraulic rams, the lever arms do not have to be long.

    I never progressed beyond "Plyboats", and though dabbled with Freeships, its a long learning curve and i still enjoy using pencil and paper and scale models. Kudos to those that have the time and patience for modelling inside the computer world.
     
  7. Dolfiman
    Joined: Aug 2017
    Posts: 1,515
    Likes: 667, Points: 113
    Location: France

    Dolfiman Senior Member

    The shape looks good and effectively in line with the current trend from the class 40, the mid-scow bow itself being the result of this class rules. Is this also a good trade off to avoid too much slams when upwind ? that is the question.
    It turns out that I also did an early stage project of a 28' day-boat with such mid-scow bow, as one of the examples to illustrate the new version 3.3 of Gene-Hull in preparation, here attached for your information. This includes the sailplan, the hydrostatics and the equilibrium at heel 20° , and a mass spreadsheet estimation compatible with a DLR of 168 (an average value, not very light but a priori easy to reach with non exotic expensive materials).
     

    Attached Files:

  8. valery gaulin
    Joined: Jan 2017
    Posts: 215
    Likes: 20, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 7
    Location: Montréal

    valery gaulin Senior Member

    I got convince to build this boat with this video and got a set of plan and started building. So Just get the plan and build this sailboat David Reard Rocket 800.

     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2023
    Terje Dahl likes this.
  9. Paul Scott
    Joined: Sep 2004
    Posts: 584
    Likes: 106, Points: 43, Legacy Rep: 84
    Location: San Juan Island, Washington

    Paul Scott Senior Member

    CT, there were some scows back around the turn of the 19C that did have half scow bows- I can’t find the pic, perhaps you have it? Anyway, didn’t catch on, apparently, but for what reasons? (This is what you get for being our official historian-:))

    Anyway, I’ve sailed a Y flyer and an E scow some on Lk Washington, which, because of the floating bridges, develops a 3-5’ chop in 12k, and the problem with the scows wasn’t so much slamming into head seas ( the heeled slender bow took care of that) as cross waves slamming into the length of the heeled flat bottom, knocking the bow downwind, and in some cases, when a puff and a bigger wave hit at the same time, knocking the boat over. In other words, it was the entire flat bottomed hull shape, and not just the bow, that was the problem, in my experience at least. But this isn’t that different from our U20 in the same conditions, except that the U20 had a 5’ keel. Still slammed a lot. Has anyone actually tried, say, an E class Scow shaped hull, or Y Flyer shaped hull with a keel? (And E Scows are on the slender side…). Or is it more accepted wisdom that slamming will be a problem, and the bow will fall off a full scow hull, so no one has tried? ( Windurfers slam like crazy, anyway, with scow bows or pointy bows and a few bows have fallen off :confused:)
     
  10. Paul Scott
    Joined: Sep 2004
    Posts: 584
    Likes: 106, Points: 43, Legacy Rep: 84
    Location: San Juan Island, Washington

    Paul Scott Senior Member

    valery gaulin likes this.
  11. skaraborgcraft
    Joined: Dec 2020
    Posts: 374
    Likes: 112, Points: 43
    Location: sweden

    skaraborgcraft Senior Member

     
  12. BobBill
    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 873
    Likes: 25, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 157
    Location: Minnesotan wakes up daily, in SE MN, a good start,

    BobBill Senior Member

    Scot's first pic +1


    To reiterate, methinks most who own a sailboat like convenience and low cost.

    Fast is relative and win or lose a drag with another class is as relative. Ten knots is to me fast but 40 knots with wing, swing keel, etc. is not without its worries…

    Scows are keen and fast(fat)…their poundings, and non traditional looks are not as heart-rendering as leaving a winged wonder at a bouy….

    Give this dodger a soft sail and fat bow for fun and for commercial use.

    Go-fasts are nice when simple! Too bad US Uboats in WW II were not like ugly blue whale shapes...so much fer old politics...
     
  13. valery gaulin
    Joined: Jan 2017
    Posts: 215
    Likes: 20, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 7
    Location: Montréal

    valery gaulin Senior Member

    @skaraborgcraft

    Just so you get the point that it is better than a Fantasia 27, speed in 25 knots of wind was 17 knots boat speed with "Trinquette" and main only! Nothing gets close to this speed in a small coastal cruiser...

    Hull is plywood epoxy covered with with one layer of biaxial. Roof and deck is foam sandwich construction.

    So far I think it is the best compromise in this lenght...
     
    Paul Scott likes this.
  14. skaraborgcraft
    Joined: Dec 2020
    Posts: 374
    Likes: 112, Points: 43
    Location: sweden

    skaraborgcraft Senior Member

    Im sure a Fantasia can do 20+ knots if you can find a steep enough wave to surf down. 17 knots is a good speed, it does give an ability to cover some distance. I prefer the look of the bow on the Ace 30, it appears to lift more. Fun project for sure. Wull you be documenting your build?

    A quirky plywood rocket with sawn-off scow bow - can the Ace 30 disrupt the IRC racing scene? - YouTube
     

  15. valery gaulin
    Joined: Jan 2017
    Posts: 215
    Likes: 20, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 7
    Location: Montréal

    valery gaulin Senior Member

    The ACE 30 is a very nice sailboat. Like the look alot!

    Will I be documenting? Don't think so because it is alot of work to film and take pictures, editing, etc... The only thing I will do is to take pictures along the build and post them on my facebook.

    It will be a long process... I decided to start with the most technical part of the build first, Rudders, Keel, lifting keel case, rig, spar and mast,etc....

    Tha last will be raising all the bulkhead and build the hull.

    Right now I am at my second rudder....
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.