Requesting Small Sternwheeler hull design and analysis help

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

Both of your drawings show a vertical trailing edge to the submerged foil section, one at 0, the other at 2 ft.

I don't have the space, in the muck, to simply turn around that point and point the nose into water. This place turns into a mud-flat. I will need to be able to back out.

Even if my stuff is up, completely on the mud, I can use an anchor-point and block-and-tackle if I have to (god forbid), or cable to another boat, to slide out, backwards.

Yours is only marginally deeper that either one I've come up with, I just expect to have problems with that vertical trailing edge.

 

[WindRaf]

the draft of my model is 1 (ONE) feet

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

the draft of my model is 1 (ONE) feet

What if there was transition, say from 3 ft-4 ft forward of the trailing edge, to eliminate it, and raising the keel to the 6 in.-8 in. range?

 

[WindRaf]

Design length : 19.685 [ft]
Length over all : 19.685 [ft]
Design beam : 7.874 [ft]

Design draft : 1.000 [ft]

Displaced volume : 20.665 [ft3]
Displacement : 0.590 [tons]


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in your idea the electric engine is not protected:
and you remember? you don't want electric outboard

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

Prop-drive is intended to be temporary main drive, while electric drive-line and wheels are built. Keeping it above the lowest point of the hull affords protection. As someone pointed out, an outboard can be lifted out of the water, if necessary.

Electric trolling motors, fixed just below and forward the stern, but above the lowest point of the hull would be an ideal, hidden drive-line. and emergency backup power, as well.

As for electric outboard, the conversion can be done, either as outboard, or as an inboard, but I don't want an infernal-combustion engine, except as a generator, for hybrid power ability, when I need more range than available from the battery.

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

Scotch Drive?

Could use a Scotch Drive, off the gear-reduction units, to drive the wheels. Would look more authentic and I can plat with the crank-arm ratios, to get additional gear reduction, as needed.

 

[WindRaf]

for transmission to the wheel this way

http://www.magicmarlin.it/sr250.html

and for me the principal engin is not infernal...moreeeee!!!!

http://www.lombardinigroup.it/docum...ooled_diesel_engines_12.0-26.0_kW_Italian.pdf

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

for transmission to the wheel this way

http://www.magicmarlin.it/sr250.html

and for me the principal engin is not infernal...moreeeee!!!!

http://www.lombardinigroup.it/docum...ooled_diesel_engines_12.0-26.0_kW_Italian.pdf

I was thinking more like having this mechanism...

disguised something like this...

to drive each rear paddle wheel like this, but eliminate the Scotch Yoke...

The cranks would be at 180*, rather than 90, but I have a hidden electric motor... Instead of having pistons drive the mechanism to rotary motion, I'm simplifying a Scotch Drive. Instead of his weird double-hinged crank, inside the engine, use a constant velocity joint.

The majority is for looks, so pvc pipe and plywood, for most of it., with a simple valve arrangement, so the pistons act as bellows, for air to blow the steamboat whistles. That triangular swing-beam in the motor can be rigged any number or ways, simple, yet sturdy. Cut up an old motorcycle wheel and use the shaft and bearings?

 

[WindRaf]

you can do, but that is old and complicated

instead the hydraulic system solves all the problems, is produced in series for the fishing boats, is directly connected to the engine, reduces the number of revolutions, it is also reverser

 

[WindRaf]

ah ... important, with the hydraulic system you can put the engine where you want, and the connection to the wheel is with pipes flexible

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

you can do, but that is old and complicated

instead the hydraulic system solves all the problems, is produced in series for the fishing boats, is directly connected to the engine, reduces the number of revolutions, it is also reverser

A paddlewheel drive is old and complicated, I agree, but, for a boat that uses paddlewheels, the old and complicated looks right. Part of the appeal is the nostalgia. It all works together. Even the low, scow-like deck adds to that feel.

The electric motor is also reversible. This rotary to reciprocating motion linkage is more efficient than the old Scotch Yoke. The roto-tiller reduction drive lets me put the electric motor down low.

Admittedly, going from rotary motion, to reciprocating, then back to rotary is the long way around, but it looks right, at least in my head. I really wish I had the talent to translate it into pictures, without having to make it, to take pictures of.

I know of a guy that wants to use hydraulics, to drive a 40 ft sternwheeler. I don't think it's the right thing, or even as efficient as my complex linkage. Even a Scotch Yoke would be more efficient than pumping fluid to drive a motor, imho. My original idea to use a squirrel-cage/drive-wheel setup would be easier, but I have time, I can make it look right.

Interaction on here has really helped me solidify and integrate the various elements, at least in my head. Since I'm going to be testing model hulls, I can also hammer-out and test a crude, scale version of the drive mechanism. Simplify to one wider wheel and wobble drive, rather than two, just to get the method working, and figure out how to make it look right.

I really appreciate all the feedback. Going from a concept, to hammering-out details, will really help with the build. Looking forward to the whole process.

 

[WindRaf]

I get it.
To rest in traditional way is fascinating.
But you have to leave the V bottom idea.
With the traditonal way must follow back the traditional designe.
In the traditonial way all the the weight is behind.
If you make a V bottom in traditional way this is the result

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

I get it.
To rest in traditional way is fascinating.
But you have to leave the V bottom idea.
With the traditonal way must follow back the traditional designe.
In the traditonial way all the the weight is behind.
If you make a V bottom in traditional way this is the result


View attachment 96585

There were as many different hulls as there were designers, back then. I already discarded designs that already do what I needed, after the cry of 'speedboat' kept being applied, regardless.

Going flat-bottom is begging to be sunk, with this muck. No thank you. The originals didn't have anything resembling fiberglass, hydraulic motors, electric motors, etc., either. I'm not about to build a hull that I KNOW will get mired. Any old-timer would see the same problem I do, and do whatever he could, to prevent that problem, just as I am. She will have just enough v to help me get loose, and a bit of rocker, for the same reason. I expect her to be partially stuck, regularly. If she can wiggle herself loose, when I'm not able to be here, that helps, too.

Another concession I've had to make is length. She's getting longer, just to fit what needs doing. The wheels and wheel-arms will be cantilevered, but she needs more foredeck than I was allowing for. She's up to about 24 ft, plus the wheels and a short engine-deck, aft of the cabin.

If I was bound and determined to have every detail 'authentic', then she'd be a true steamer, not an electric. That said, even the dual paddle-wheel arrangement was done. Look up the Wild Goose sternwheeler...

I'm going for a certain nostalgic feel, but she had elements of dirigible gondola design, to the cabin and pilot-house. Not exactly like this, but the resemblance will be obvious... (USS Macon)

If you will notice the outward angle and ellipsoid conical section, it also resembles some boat pilot-houses, so, I'm still good, there... She's a flight of fancy, but so are most custom designs, whether it's fashion, a house, a boat, or whatever... Since she'll be mine, she only has to be true to what I expect, rather than, say, having a flat hull, out of stupidity following design-Nazi 'Authenticity'... When she's finished, I certainly want her to be as unique as I am, and an extension of my own unique character.

 

[WindRaf]

JL Frusha,

the extension of your pic is too big,
i can't see it

 

[phrogjlf@yahoo]

JL Frusha,

the extension of your pic is too big,
i can't see it

Edited. Sorry about that. That big one is the one I have saved, bookmarked and as my background image.