SK 2--18' Canting Keel

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Doug Lord, Mar 4, 2012.

  1. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    At least one major difference: the CQ 6 is electric and the keel does not appear to retract: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyMEO5TgpRg
    Also, CQ-6 appears to require 3 crew rather than the two of the SK-2.
    The SK-2 definitely fits a different "niche" market being tailored to two people with a manual canting keel.
    =================
    CQ-6 specs:
    LOA-19'
    Beam-7.44'
    Draft-5.44'
    Weight-1067lb(sailing weight=525+1067=1592lb)
    Keel Bulb-440lb.
    Main-228 sq.ft.
    Jib-89.3 sq.ft.
    ====================
    SK-2 specs
    -
    Hull 5.62m / 18.4'
    LOA 7.59m / 24.89'
    Beam 1.56m / 5.1'
    Sailing weight 380kg / 836lb.(includes crew)
    Dry weight 190kg / 418lb.
    Ballast 80kg 176 lb.
    SA upwind 19.62sq.m / 211sq.ft.
    SA downwind 53.62 / 576.9 sq.ft.
     
  2. susho
    Joined: Dec 2006
    Posts: 88
    Likes: 6, Points: 8, Legacy Rep: 78
    Location: the Netherlands

    susho Composite builder

    buttons are a bit less in the way than lines, haha. CQ6 keel is retractable for transport, and is held in place by a bolt when sailing.

    SK2 is a nice concept too by the way. But i'ts a lot of money, boat and tech to go fast. A skiff or cat, or even wind/kitesurf can reach speeds much simpeler and cheaper. Sailing one design with a canter could be fun, but I wouldn't.
    I've never sailed SK2, but the CQ6 was mainly an easy boat to get to speed. You don't have to work that hard to go faster than a lot of boats. The keel really is a turbo, even on these small boats. No doubt it is on the sk2 too, even if it's only 80 kgs.

    (cq6 is designed for 3, I'ved sailed with two in moderate winds. Not as needy as an F18, keel control is electric, but headsail is not selftacking, so about the same handling when manouvering with the sk2 I guess.)
     
  3. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ==============
    Thanks for the info on the CQ 6, Susho-fascinating....
     
  4. sean9c
    Joined: Jan 2011
    Posts: 289
    Likes: 4, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 35
    Location: Anacortes,WA

    sean9c Senior Member

    Also, CQ-6 appears to require 3 crew rather than the two of the SK-2.
    The SK-2 definitely fits a different "niche" market being tailored to two people with a manual canting keel.
    =================
    CQ-6 specs:
    LOA-19'
    Beam-7.44'
    Draft-5.44'
    Weight-1067lb(sailing weight=525+1067=1592lb)
    Keel Bulb-440lb.
    Main-228 sq.ft.
    Jib-89.3 sq.ft.
    ====================
    SK-2 specs
    -
    Hull 5.62m / 18.4'
    LOA 7.59m / 24.89'
    Beam 1.56m / 5.1'
    Sailing weight 380kg / 836lb.(includes crew)
    Dry weight 190kg / 418lb.
    Ballast 80kg 176 lb.
    SA upwind 19.62sq.m / 211sq.ft.

    Thought about the loads to cant that SK-2 keel, Assumed blade length below pivot of 5ft and lever arm above pivot of 1ft, cant angle of 45D. As I see it it takes about 450# to pull the keel to 45D, that's a lot to do mechanically. Figure 20/1 tackle, you have to move keel top 2ft for keel to swing 90D so 40ft of line to haul. hydro/elec with a little battery might be easier
     
  5. Silver Raven
    Joined: Oct 2011
    Posts: 437
    Likes: 12, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 67
    Location: Far North Queensland, Australia

    Silver Raven Senior Member

    Gooday Sean. I've noticed over the last 'few' years - the fitter the sailor the faster the boat speed. Yes/no???

    I'll back the guys sailing without the batteries - probably @ 6 to 1. Fittness isn't everything but it sure gives A or THE winning edge. Ciao, james
     
  6. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Sk-2

    As to moving the keel:

     
  7. sean9c
    Joined: Jan 2011
    Posts: 289
    Likes: 4, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 35
    Location: Anacortes,WA

    sean9c Senior Member

    Or,when you're tacking/gybing, would you rather have your head out of the boat or be madly pulling 40ft of string? It is a doublehanded boat, lots to do.
     
  8. Roel de Groot
    Joined: May 2012
    Posts: 2
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Hampshire, UK

    Roel de Groot I cant! Can you?

    Sk2

    The canting keel on SK2 is very much a turbo buster allowing a large sail powerfull sail area to be carried whilst only requiring two people to handle it. With a 6:1 purchace to cant the keel there is no need to be pulling handfulls of rope to work the system. In conjunction with the jib being self tacking the only thing the crew needs to do is tack the keel.

    More information is available in the latest issues of both Seahorse and Yachting World magazine.
     
  9. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Sk-2

    ==============
    Roel, welcome to the forum! Thanks for the information-it seems like a really well done boat that would be exciting to sail. Good luck with it....
     
  10. Roel de Groot
    Joined: May 2012
    Posts: 2
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Hampshire, UK

    Roel de Groot I cant! Can you?

    Sk2

    Doug
    Many thanks for starting the tread on our micro canting keeler (or the mantlepiece sized Volvo 70 as we like to call it).
    The tooling is now set up in the shed and June should see the first production units coming out.
     
  11. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Sk-2

    -----------
    Your welcome-it is a fascinating and very interesting design!
     
  12. twrch
    Joined: Jun 2005
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Europe

    twrch New Member

    I am not sure about the concept, the addition of an 80kg canting keel on a 1m30 or something keel will add about the same righting moment as an extra crew.
    On small boat I think it is much better to use trapeze or wings. Also with this system, you nearly double the surface of the fin, it will make a lot of drag as soon as you begin to go fast. (on the video under spinnaker it seems the boat do not accelerate).
    Seahorse publish the righting moment of the boat, and it is quite low, how do you go fast in any breeze without righting moment? with light wind it will have the handicap of the wetted surface of the double foil.
    Also I am sceptical about the weight, 390 kg ready to sail with the crew, it means around 230kg with sails, mast etc, possible but expensive.
    I still think around 30 ft is about the limit for canting keel except for specials requirement (mini transat, where crew is limited and draft is huge).
    Much to complicated for me, better to try a DSS.
     
  13. Andy
    Joined: Aug 2003
    Posts: 279
    Likes: 13, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 45
    Location: Edinburgh

    Andy Senior Member

    Be interesting to see how this goes against the VX One Design:

    VX One:
    LOA = 19′/5.79m
    LWL = 18.83′/5.74m
    Beam = 7.17′/2.19m
    SA Main + Jib = 215 sq ft./19.97 sq m.
    SA Gennaker = 280 sq ft./26 sq m.
    Draft, keel down = 4.33′/1.32m
    Base price $28,950

    SK2:
    Hull Length 5.62m
    LOA 7.59m
    LWL 5.59m
    Beam 1.56m
    Draft 1.35m
    Dry Weight 190Kg
    Sailing Weight 390Kg
    Ballast 80Kg
    SA Upwind 20.55 sq.m.
    SA Downwind 58.45 sq.m.
    Base price $40,000

    Looks expensive in the performance per $ ratio...interesting boat though. Edit: seems the VX doesn't come with sails which narrows it down a tad...
     
  14. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,679
    Likes: 349, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    =========================
    It would be very interesting given that the minimum crew weight for the Vx is 390lb(2@ 195 each). And I'm very curious why neither you or VX list the weight of the boat ,ready to sail? Or did I miss it? Also, the downwind SA of the SK2 is 1.6 times the VX One design downwind SA......
    http://vxonedesignracing.com/vxodr/specifications-and-features


     

  15. Andy
    Joined: Aug 2003
    Posts: 279
    Likes: 13, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 45
    Location: Edinburgh

    Andy Senior Member

    From Intensitysails website:

    VX One :
    LOA = 19′/5.79m

    LWL = 18.83′/5.74m

    Beam = 7.17′/2.19m

    SA Main + Jib = 215 sq ft./19.97 sq m.

    SA Gennaker = 390 sq ft./36 sq m.

    Draft, keel down = 4.33′/1.32m

    Dry displacement = 450lbs/204kg

    Crew Weight tolerance = 380 – 450 lbs (2-3 person)

    14kg difference, and similar sail areas up and down. Now I'm not saying I don't like the SK2, as I do, but the VX is cheaper (a lot, and in case you didn't notice there's a recession on), probably around the same speed (will be interesting to see if they ever meet), and simpler. If the SK2 was a lot closer to the VX in price it might stand a chance. As it is, you could spend the same on a Shaw 650/Leech 6.5 that will blow the doors off either of these boats, or save yourself 10K and get the VX. Just sayin'.
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.