What Do We Think About Climate Change

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by Pericles, Feb 19, 2008.

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  1. mudman
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    mudman Junior Member

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123802514107642447.html

    I understand that the US government will tax Oil Companies 50% of their profit to give people green credit. They will not only tax the majors, but will also tax the independants. There are at least a hundred independant "mom and pop" oil companies that operate in the GOM area alone.

    The plan is to make all oil companies pay to get this green thing going. They will be taxed to pay for the green revolution. (notice in the article that the majors have 100 billion in profits, but thy spent 1.5 trillion. Yeah, trillion with a "T".) So 50 billion will be set aside (supposedly) to be given to people that buy hybrids (GM is now promoting more hybrids, the government does own them), windmills, solar panels, or what have you.

    Who cares about the massive ammount of lost jobs, not to mention 1.4 trillion (just from majors) spent within the economy.

    I believe that the whole global warming thing is a hoax made up by people with investments in green technology. We could argue it forever, but 97% of scientists agree is no way a real number. A few months ago when the global warming scientists had their little pow wow in houston, there was another group of scientists across the street having their own anti global warming rally. The numbers are more like 50/50.

    Heres a few links on the global warming subject.

    http://global-warming-alerts.blogspot.com/2008/12/scientists-make-anti-global-warming.html

    http://blog.heritage.org/2008/12/11/scientists-make-their-anti-global-warming-case/

    And here is a petition if anyone is interested.

    http://www.petitionproject.org/
     
  2. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Amen to that.
    We should be using all the waste anti-global-warming futile efforts and moneys in helping poor countries and undeveloped regions.

    Cheers.
     
  3. Jimbo1490
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    Jimbo1490 Senior Member

    You are correct sir as Fasteddy took the time to track down the original study that Punchinello B kept harping on about. A careful reading of that data resulted in a thorough debunking of this '97%' number turning it into nothing more than exaggeration, hype and deliberately misleading half-truth.

    The questions in that study were so worded that even I would have been counted in the 97%! :D

    What Punchinello B never bothered to tell you is that in that same study 54% of the scientists polled said that recent climate change was within historical natural variation. This puts the fraction convinced that humans are the cause of recent climate change and all that implies down into the low 40th percentile, not even a simple majority.

    I expect PB to chime in anytime and tell us how the study group was too small so that we should ignore those particular results. This after over 100 thread pages of PB telling how significant the poll is. :p

    Let everyone reading remember this episode:!: !

    Jimbo
     
  4. Jimbo1490
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    Jimbo1490 Senior Member

    Has anyone looked at this page?

    Here's the chart from that page. If someone already posted it, I guess I missed it.

    GTEMPS.gif

    Jimbo
     
  5. AmbitiousAmatur
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    AmbitiousAmatur Junior Member

    The global warming scare is a way for those at the top to get rich while redistributing the wealth. If Al Gore is so concerned with my carbon footprint, why is his power bill 10 times mine every month. In the UK they are proposing a carbon credit sale whereby wealthy people who can afford to travel have to pay poor people who cannot and the government takes their 30% cut off the top. Al Gore is now heavily investing in a company that makes 'Cap and Trade' tracking software and stands to make billions off of the deal if this legislation is passed. The earth has been cooling for the past 6 years and most scientist dismiss global warming, but of course you do not hear that in the mainstream media. The earth has existed for billions of years. 200 years of industrialization has not affected it enough to notice. Sometime in the fifth century B.C. there was actually a mini ice age. It is cyclical and just a way for some at the top to get rich while "helping" their poor constituants and making themselves feel all green inside at the same time.
     
  6. AmbitiousAmatur
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    AmbitiousAmatur Junior Member

    If this legislation is passed, companies will move American jobs to nations in which they are welcome to do business. Just as a side note, 87,000 farm jobs in the west were lost because of a minnow. That shows you just how far these people are willing to take this.
     
  7. AmbitiousAmatur
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    AmbitiousAmatur Junior Member

    Is the current administration using the government in 'Atlas Shrugged' as a blueprint because it almost seems that way. (ok, i'll shutup now.)
     
  8. fasteddy106
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    fasteddy106 Junior Member

    One of the really sneaky things the IPCC does in their 2007 report is change the way they report numbers. If the number look good for their bias, they call .12 - 12%. If the number look bad for them, they leave it as .12 to give it a minimal perception. They do this with their estimate of the economic impact the AGW dogma will have on the developed nations. The impact of the warmist plans could cause a 12% shrinkage in the U.S. economy and that of other developed nations. This kind of economic devolution could cause riots and anarchy unless the posse comitatus portions of U.S. law are removed. Perhaps that is the goal, as the only efficient way to accomplish their CO2 reduction goals is at the point of a gun. Then they can accomplish the rest of their social engineering agenda. If you were to follow Bostons posts throughout the rest of the forums on various issues you will find the logic of a very dangerous man, he never fails to promote the most extreme position on any issue of social policy.
     
  9. fasteddy106
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    fasteddy106 Junior Member


    Read up on the Waxman bill, that should give you enough details to make you just a teeny bit uncomfortable.


    http://www.heritage.org/news/cap-and-trade-global-warming-bill.cfm


    Estimates are that the bill if implemented will withdraw 2 trillion dollars from the economy. Thats a scary number.
     
  10. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    I tend not to trust this kind of statements:

    "We at Harris-Mann Climatology, www.LongRangeWeather.com, believe that our prolonged cycle of wide weather ‘extremes,’ the worst in at least 1,000 years, will continue and perhaps become even more severe, especially by the mid 2010s. We should see more powerful storms, including major hurricanes and increasing deadly tornadoes. There will likewise be widespread flooding, crop-destroying droughts and freezes and violent weather of all types including ice storms, large-sized hail and torrential downpours.

    We are already seeing on virtually every continent an almost Biblical weather scenario of increasing droughts and floods. In both the southwestern and southeastern corners of the U.S, there are severe water shortage problems associated with chronic long-term dryness. In some cases, the water deficits are the worst in at least 400 years."

    These guys seem to me to be just another type of alarmists, trying to make money out of it.

    I think I have learned a couple of things along this time we have been discussing these matters:

    1.- Predicting future climate is a risky business due to the still low level of knowledge of natural processes and intervening variables.

    2.- If something, talking short term, the highest probability is global temperature will slip slowly towards cooler times, counting from 2002 to around 2040. But now apply point 1.

    Cheers.
     
  11. fasteddy106
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    fasteddy106 Junior Member

    I think one thing we can agree on is that the models used by the alarmists are about as valid as the Vaticans old theory on Earth being the center of the universe. Except the Vaticans dogma didn't threaten to bankrupt western civilization.
     
  12. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Holy cow! Is it not Earth the center of the Universe...?

    Cheers :D
     
  13. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

  14. AmbitiousAmatur
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    AmbitiousAmatur Junior Member

    Did anyone see the History Channel special on the Mini Ice Age. This is all cyclical and I do not believe that we have the ability to cause major impact on the climate either way. The "artificially produced" CO2 accounts for about 1-2% of total produced in the planet. We gotta get those evil trees to stop polluting and the politicians to stop indoctrinating our children in government run schools. It has been going on since I was in elementary.
     

  15. Ekaiztea
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    Ekaiztea Seagoing Ships Master.

    Dust in the sky

    Hi all and congratulations. Quite an interesting topic.
    May be the greenhouse effect is increasing the min temp. of our planet. But at the same time the solid pollutants (smoke particles) are working as a solar filter preventing solar radiation from arriving to the surface. Which of those effects is more relevant may be a matter of discussion as nobody seems to agree aboyt that.
    In my opinion we have been living in an atipicall stable period. The weather in the earth has never been so regular than from the last Younger Dryas episode around 14.000 years ago. (Studies of Greenland's glazier ice columns ). The tipical interglazier periods have last around 11.000 years. So, in my opinion, it's not extrange to observe some extreme phenomenons. As we could check in places spreaded all around the world, last winter has been the coldest in the last 60 years. Surely this summer on nothern emisphere, we are going to have slight low mean temperatures but with extremely hot days mixed along the season.
    The studies I've checked and some were I have been part, lead to a climate cooling after a critical level of warming. Due to? Natural causes accelerated by human impact. Yes, a compromise, we really are sure of nothing.

    Regards.

    Jon
     
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