Ok This is the boat

I have decided too build this boat. So that's that!
Now i have a few questions.....

1: In keeping with Atkins plans, how would you
protect the bottom of this boat for tropical water sailing?
If it's a new build, should i epoxy it, or glass the hull ect ect....
I really don't want to spend $$$$ on a boat that is going too rot
or be a lunch in these warm waters..

2: What is the best source you know of for ship lumber?
Im thinking white oak


3: Any guess on the price for the lumber too build this boat?
JUST a educated guess will be fine at this point.

4: Looking for cool ideas on home made kilns too season wood in.
Any links suggestions would be great!


Thanks everyone!


http://www.atkinboatplans.com
For An' Aft Is the name, under designs.
Im sure a few of you have seen it!

 

Wow. Thats a big undertaking. Painting works, antifouling works. There are many many wood boats that are over 50 years old that are not suffering at all with simple antifouling paint on the bottem. As others have said its a matter of how often you want to do your bottem.

For a guess, dont know how educated this is going to be, but I would guess that boat in white oak, rigged with sails ready for daysailing will be in the neighborhood of $120,000 to 200,000 USD. This isnt including labor, but dose include portholes some interior, and basic systems. such as aux engine, bilge pumps, MSD toilet devices and plumbing and electrical.

For a source there are a lot of them on the web, but you might try marring the daughter of a lumbermill......just kidding try here: http://www.timberwright.ca/boatlumber.html

K9

 

Wow Starfish. What is really mind boggling is how you can make a decision to build a big boat like that, and *then* ask questions about how much and from what.

The logical approach is to calculate the materials, the costs and THEN say "I am going to proceed". But as more than one person has said in these forums - whats logical about boat building.

Since its an Atkens design - surely they are in the best position to advise you on materials and treatment. have you had any advice from them at all?

 

Thanks for your suggestions, Ill check out the link.
The picture is a little mis-leading, the boat looks like
a 100' schooner, but its really only around 28'!
I have some unique idea's on how too get this project going.
And i will be posting them up tommorow (more full details and ideas too come)

I will be looking for 3 other people that

1: Want too do a 2 year cruise.
2: Have the money too add 15000 USD over the next one year (matchng mine) 60000 budget for boat.
3: Be able too relocate, or offer a building place too build boat. With housing.
4: Have the same drive i do too build this boat. I plan on 30 hours
a week. One year w/3 others spending equal time.
5: 4 person equal ownership, boat too be docked in Annp. MD after cruise.

So in a nut shell, its work, eat, work on boat, 7 days a week for a year.
Not easy too find people for this type thing these days, but 3 should be
do' able! Imagine sailing this thing for 2 years. I have many more ideas.

So if anyone has the same type of dream, Pm me with your ideas.

 

I have posted on the Atkins group (yahoo)
As for the Mind Boggling comment, I feel the same way as you do!!
Its mind boggling to me that you think this 28' boat is big! LOL!
It's all good, we "boggled" each others minds!

 

Blimey - it goes from impulsive to not even doable by the ideas guy!
You will need two rich girlfriends if 3 of you are going to live on a 28ft boat Starfish. You are going to be living in each others armpits (and other places).

$60,000 without labour sounds about right though for money - but having three people do the building and living on board? heck - major multimillion dollar rock star groups cant handle that kind of closeness, let alone penniless boat hippies.

Print this advice, and pin it to the workshop wall - then you cant say you werent told.

 

Here is an idea. USe 30K of the 60K you have to buy a slightly used boat thats ready to go now. Spend the other 30K actually sailing around the world. Then get back sell that boat for 15K and start building the Atkins.

K9

 

Well 1st, 4 people on this boat can travell without problems
2nd who says people are hippies? I'm not????
3rd: i would't think 4 people that spend 15k and another 10k
for the trip are broke...
4th: Small minds can't bring down forward thinkers...

I came on this site looking for two thing's

1: suggestions about building this boat
2: like minded people that do rather then talk....

So i will ask the Mod's now, too watch this thread for trolls and flamers.
I want too talk to people that can give postive feed back on the topic,
not narrow minded people that dont have the gut's too think outside the loop.
O jeeze' is that the hippy coming out in me!
Rather that then some old, drunk in a country club.

"rockstars cant do it"
I dont know, the Gratefull Dead did it over 30yrs........(more hippy dribble)
I could go on, maybe the Navy?????? Ever been on a sub? They do ok...
Ok




A quote

"To modern eyes accustomed to long ends on a boat, the nearly plumb stem and short counter of Fore An' Aft may appear old-fashioned. But old-fashioned or not, I know of no better profile for a small cruising yacht. How else, I ask you, can any room be gotten below if the ends are pulled out and the forefoot cut away? Despite her modest overall length of 28 feet 8 inches, this little ship has a remarkable amount of room, not only below but on deck as well. And then in a short-ended boat like Fore An' Aft, accommodations can be nicely managed for a party of four, which is all that should ever be aboard a boat of this size."

Ill take Mr Atkin's word about the room for 4 people, this is when men where men! I need too find 3 more, yuppies need not respond!

 

K9, i have thought about that allot. One of the boats i have
thought over ALLOT, is the Pearson Vanguard. Love the lines,
the design is of classic look, and it was built very good. (interior is a bit crappy) another one is the Pacific Seacraft Flicka 20' (solo boat)
Both can be had in nice shape for 20k or so.....
But what can i say, i want too build it right so i start from scratch.
Plans will be here in a week or so. I am looking for a school local,
too get training on wood boat construction. i have the room too build it,
HUGE barn on family's equestrian farm. (kinda rules out the hippy crap from that guy up there huh!)
But i 100% agree, the sane idea would be too buy a used boat. But what can i say that this picture can't?????
Just look at those two guys faces!

 

LOL,
Starfish you're a nut! But maybe the world needs a few folks like you. If you haven't already stunbled across it, look up a book by George Bueler.

He may be just the inspiration you need. Who knows maybe you'll even pull it off. A word to the wise though, this site more or less is the varsity, you're not going to impress anyone and a little humbleness will go a long way.

 

Starfish - didnt mean to put a splinter in your tough hide with the 'hippy' reference.
So I will let you suggest a more appropriate word for a guy with 10% of the capital, who has never built a boat before, who is going to build a classic timber boat in 12 months using a lot of other peoples money, contributing 30 hours a week while earning money for the yet to be purchased materials.
And the other two people are going to be just as inspired and congenial enough to fit right in like a jigsaw puzzle.
Thats right - the words is .... genius, a true leader of men or women, real presidential material, hell - you will ace this project and go on to even bigger and better things. go team go!

 

I am with K9, buy a used boat and go out there and really find out what you want mate.

 

Starfish, go for it and don't pay attention to the voices behind the curtain.

Though this project is a very ambitious one as a first build, with perseverance and organization you can get it done. This is a yacht of over 8 tons (light) which is directly related to the effort and building costs. Most experienced builders can estimate their building costs and time from a simple calculation of how much displacement they can assemble in an hour. Of course this is entirely dependant on knowing what you can do.

Your materials list, which came with the plans, will provide you a fairly accurate idea of costs. Add 10% (if you're good) to 25% (if you're a novice) to the lumber order for waste and mistakes (you will make bad cuts).

She's a carvel build so epoxy use will be minimal. It could be used as an adhesive, within joints, but there are other glues that could serve as well, with less cost and mixing effort required. Follow Billy's instructions carefully and as he indicates in the plans, don't be tempted to change things other then the "gingerbread" items.

Carvel builds can be encapsulated, but frankly the planking dimensions for this old gal are such, that epoxy will be asked to do more then it's capable (too thick of planking). You could laminate planking, which would eliminate butt blocks or scarfs, but this is an added bother and the carvel build is well proven. Don't think about sheathing the hull unless you've encapsulated everything under it.

To answer you questions about durability in the tropics, proper maintenance and timely up keep will serve the hull well. There's a great deal of expense in owning a craft of this volume in order to address this issue. Annual haul outs are a must in the tropics as is bottom paint up keep. Having literally plowed my way through every single sand bar in the windward chain of islands of the Caribbean, I can assure you the keel and bottom needs to be repaired every year and painted.

Using the best planking material you can afford is also a wise investment. Not only does it keep your socks dry, it lasts longer and resists the issues that can haunt lesser quality material. The hull planking is generally the best on the boat, for obvious reasons.

Do yourself a favor and set up a fund, establish a budget and schedule. This is a large project, just figuring out how to handle a 2 ton casting for the ballast, let alone getting it off the truck from the iron foundry will require clever problem solving and considerable planning. Personally, I'd use lead on the outside as will as the internal trimming ballast, which would permit you to cast it yourself. This will require you do some calculations concerning the 30% heavier material, which of course needs to be smaller, but still have the same CG as the iron hunk does. It's not difficult, but will make you dig out a calculator and draw up a new profile for the casting.

It will be necessary to make some material substitutions, as Billy drew up that cutter several decades ago and some of the stuff will be unavailable or replaced with different species or products. An example would be plywood, which was in it's infancy at the time, others would be adhesives, sealants and lumber types.

Go for it and stay focused (the biggest cause of failure in a big first build), then come back with some photos for the nay sayers, so you can stick it up their none speaking orifices. Good Luck . . .

 

Starfish, even though you asked for a private message, there is no clear way to send one, so PM back at me, I have some ideas for you.

Especially since I am doing a similar thing!

See if you can PM me back and we can share notes.

Oops, I just turned on my email accept option, it should work now.

 

In line with Pars comments - it would be great to start a blog, and also do videos of it.
A project of this scope for a new builder is very newsworthy, and you should document it thoroughly. It might even make a good commercial documentary when tied to a two year sailing trip - could pay for the whole lot.
I know a lot of people in this site would be very interested in how it goes.