Possible contract for Composites Engineer

[HakimKlunker]

Originally Posted by Alik

Hakim, look at this - quite good, isn't it?
[Just need to know were to go

Hi Alik,
I knew that you will respond
This is why I mentioned the 'insiders'...
To put things right: If Thailand would be more picky to allow boatbuilding only to those who are provenly certified, then we would see more movies like this.

I pay all due respect to Austhai marine, SEAT boat and the like.

[HakimKlunker]

Originally Posted by rwatson

Makes no sense to me at all.

Trying to start with the laminate schedule is a silly idea.

Oops, maybe I was not exact enough with my words.
I did not think to set up an exact laminate schedule. Alik's reply comes very close to what I had in mind.
The earlier we include ALL influencing factors, the faster we can round up the initial idea.
Making things heavier than required is a pityful waste.

[tunnels]

I havent laid a yacht hull with just solid glass for more than 20 years or longer .
Every ozzie boat i have come across just uses 2 types of glass ! ,chopped strand matt and heaps of it and woven roving .
I do remember when i lived and worked in Brisbane i asked a sales rep for FGI for unidirectional glass and he looked completely blank and didnt know what the hell i was talking about .
Even to this very day i have never seen a cored ozzie boat sail or power !!.
Sail boat owners are always weight conscious and what strength without weight .

There is only one way to fit core and thats vac it down . !! if you dont vac it you are asking for trouble !!

And vinylester resin is the best resin to use and wont break the bank . Easyer to do any repairs if the boat ever gets damaged !.

[tunnels]

Originally Posted by apex1

What a bold statement Tunnels.

So, in your opinion the majority of the industry is too dumb for their business?

And you would make a sailboat hull lighter below waterline (and add the risk of water intrusion and failure), just to add more ballast then?

Well, you are a real expert...................

Regards
Richard

Think what you like ! I spend the first part of my glassing days in the 1970s making solid glass hulls , it didnt take to long before cores were being used and out performing solid glass boats .
Recently I spent a good amount of 2007/8/9 in South Korea making 36ft Match racing yachts .
Dont have to use more ballast just do your home work on the lead keel design and its strut and had boats that were like wind blown rockets . Just a matter if interest the whole boat was cored including all the ring frames and longtudinal stringers , plus the deck every where .

You always love to knock cores as much as you like but like all things there are does and donts , Yes there are places for solid glass hulls but there are places for cored hulls as well .
All and every bit of what i do is beyond the specs required for any survey standard .
If you build to a spec laid down by any survey organization you are being lazy . They are giving you a basic acceptable guide line ,simply a mimimum standard that they will accept !! If you build better than what they have laid down you will find after a very short time you will have set you own standard .

Water intrussion from where and how ?? how does water ever get anywhere near the core ?? explain !!

[raw]

Originally Posted by tunnels

Even to this very day i have never seen a cored ozzie boat sail or power !!.

Not looking very hard I think. They are everywhere over here.

Originally Posted by tunnels

Water intrussion from where and how ?? how does water ever get anywhere near the core ?? explain !!

Claiming to be a expert (which obviously is not the case), this question sounds a bit mad.
Have some fun reading Pascoes survey results:
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/sinking_o...Absolutely.htm ......and related.
sure not the bible, but informative for a beginner like you.
And here you find some "amateurs" repairing your "experts" crap!
http://www.proboat.com/morris-yachts-core-repair.html

And please, stop telling homebuilders VE is the way to go. By all means Epoxy is the far superior resin for a homebuild.

Don´t worry about the quality of my products, I´m fine with GL rules and build accordingly.

Regards
Richard

[rxcomposite]

Alik,
We all have our share of dark moments in the design.

We had a successful hull design before as a lobster fishing boat. A proponent came to us asking for a conversion to a passenger ferry, 3 level deck to accommodate the passenger and the pilothouse. After the conceptual design our NA ran the initial stability simulation. In a worst case condition where the fuel is empty, the water empty, the 1st level deck passengers have moved up, the second level deck passengers deck on one side, ready to disembark, the vessel is stable except when broadsided by a wave where the stability will be negative and capsize. Solution was to place 10 or 15 ton ballast in the boat of 50 ton displacement boat.

The proponent refused as he argued that it will consume extra fuel. He pleaded that he will make sure there is cargo on the bottom, or fuel, or water ballast, and make sure the captain will be responsible for it. Further argued that he can register the boat.

We said NO, lost the contract, but have been sleeping peacefully ever since.

Another time, a proponent with a conceptual design of his own ferryboat design. We ran the analysis and informed him the boat will ride high in the bow. He will not change the design as he needs the passenger public space in front. He agreed to fixed ballast (about 2 ton of it) in the forward void. The boat trimmed, ran perfect, but carried the unnecessary weight. No lives in danger here.

But in the ferry business where fuel consumption could mean a make or break. He sought a solution. We moved the engine forward including the battery, moved the fresh water compartment forward, and removed passenger seats at the back. That cured the problem. Longer shaft, longer electrical cable, extra money spent but fuel consumption improved.

I think you lean the same way. Our advice is needed but we cannot force it to the proponent. There will be times we will have to stand our ground so we can sleep peacefully.
Rx

[bobothehobo]

[quote=tunnels;375804]I havent laid a yacht hull with just solid glass for more than 20 years or longer .
Every ozzie boat i have come across just uses 2 types of glass ! ,chopped strand matt and heaps of it and woven roving .
I do remember when i lived and worked in Brisbane i asked a sales rep for FGI for unidirectional glass and he looked completely blank and didnt know what the hell i was talking about .
Even to this very day i have never seen a cored ozzie boat sail or power !!.

Never heard of these guys huh.

http://www.cooksonboats.co.nz/

[tunnels]

[quote=bobothehobo;379389]

Originally Posted by tunnels

I havent laid a yacht hull with just solid glass for more than 20 years or longer .
Every ozzie boat i have come across just uses 2 types of glass ! ,chopped strand matt and heaps of it and woven roving .
I do remember when i lived and worked in Brisbane i asked a sales rep for FGI for unidirectional glass and he looked completely blank and didnt know what the hell i was talking about .
Even to this very day i have never seen a cored ozzie boat sail or power !!.

Never heard of these guys huh.

http://www.cooksonboats.co.nz/

Yeah they are not far from me here in New Zealand !!!!!!! New Zealand is not a part of Australia !Never has and never will be !!!

[daiquiri]

Originally Posted by apex1

Have some fun reading Pascoes survey results

OMG, this series of design and manufacturing errors, all at once, sound nearly unbelievable!
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/bad_news_for_Bertram.htm

[bobothehobo]

[quote=tunnels;379408]

Originally Posted by bobothehobo

Yeah they are not far from me here in New Zealand !!!!!!! New Zealand is not a part of Australia !Never has and never will be !!!

Oh, so you meant no one uses core or laminates well in Australia. My bad, there are so many good builders in both countries I get them confused.

So, Australian builders that are pretty sharp...

http://mcconaghyweb.com/newsite/mainsite/
http://www.boatspeed.com.au/

Originally Posted by daiquiri

OMG, this series of design and manufacturing errors, all at once, sound nearly unbelievable!
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/bad_news_for_Bertram.htm

Sure Slavi,

hard to believe, but just the examinations of ONE single surveyor over a couple of years.
When we scale that up in the right way, we have to assume, that at least every other core layup is screwed up one or the other way.
That can only mean:

Stay well away from cored hulls! And thats regardless of the reputation of the builder.

Regards
Richard