ultimate 20 to 26' bouy racer

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Many of us in this thread like-even prefer-multihulls but the original poster specifically referred to monos. Nice mind exercise....

 

I know that but some one has to let him know what he is missing.

 

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He owns a Gougeon 32! http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/multihulls/gougeon-32-catamaran-38809.html
Glad to see another multivangelist around here though!

 

I don't believe the OP is actually considering anything. This thread is a big "what if" with no real purpose.

I believe the Viper website claims a 9 second delta. In reality a well sailed M24 is probably faster than that compared to a well sailed Viper. It is simply a bigger boat of a similar type.

If I was rating them I would probably start with a 12 sec delta and then look at how they were going against one another on the water.

As for PHRF SoCal, you need to understand the Chief Handicapper here owns a poorly sailed (being generous) Olson 30, and if the Melges 24s were rated correctly here he would never be able to beat anyone sailing one. Therefore they will never have a decent rating out here and no one will race them in PHRF.

 

what IF!

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A big "what if" on a sailboat design forum??!! An exalted purpose-getting people to think while having fun doing it, while learning things they may not know, while dreaming of new concepts, while considering the ramifications of the various choices etc. A fun, educational thread that draws on wide experience to think out of the box.........

 

I suppose he does have a a point... this thread has about as much purpose as this forum

single handed boats tend to be very small, or down wind drag racers... I thought a conversation about a breed of boat that doesn't really exist would be a good topic for a boat design forum... scheesh...

and yes, I own a G32, and a laser 28 that is currently getting a full blown refit and a new set of dress whites...

see, being on lake michigan, sunfish and lasers, well, the water is cold! so noone races them.. around here they race keel boats....

So, I just wanted some folks to chime in on what they thought a single handed rocket would look like...

but this is quality of the responses? Just so you fellas can rate your responses against some other people, I'll share what a friend of mine sent me when I asked him the same question...

 

Hi James Silver Raven, I designed and built the Cox's Bay skimmer for a friend at very cheap mates rates and I think total cost was around 7.5 grand NZ. Boat measures 5.5 x 2.25m and weighs around 130-140 kgs, wing masts are 6.5m, sail area around 20m2. There is a water ballast tank below the cockpit floor but we always sail with it empty.

 

That really is an interesting boat. The dual wing masts have all kinds of advantages:

Lower COF for a given sail area,
Both sails are for the most part self tacking
No downwind sails means an easier boat to sail..

It is an interesting and viable single hand solution. The water ballast is also interesting... So, I take it is an "Unleaded" design?


How much sail area would you put on a 7.5 meter version?
Would you use only water ballast on the 7.5?
How would a well sailed 7.5 stack up against a well sailed Melges 24? I'm just trying to get an idea of how fast the boat would be compared to the rest of the local fleet.

And Gary, thanks for posting the design BTW

 

I was trying to answer the original question - and I had proposed altering the Viper 640 as stated below:

Adding ballast to "compensate" for missing rail meat, simplifying sail handling and making sure the boat could be trailered and dry sailed by one person hits the mark. Just to keep my critic quiet, adding ballast to the bulb on a Viper need not change the all-up sailing weight - just add the weight you are losing in the missing rail meat for no net change.

Bulb ballast doesn't improve righting moment till the boat is heeling, so I would think this type of boat would be reefed earlier than a fully crewed boat. No matter how you try to fool with things, a crewed boat with three or four people will be faster than a singlehand version of the same boat with RM tricks & ballast compensation. More hands makes for faster reaction and strength. More eyes helps watching for shifts & favoured tacks. Higher proportion of moving ballast helps keep boat trim optimal.

I'm not certain about Rapscallion's desire for sailing without getting wet - Vipers, Melges 24s and the like aren't for hydrophobes, and without warm spray-deflecting bodies in front of the helm to take the brunt they will require proper wet gear. The attractive Truc design he's posted sure won't be dry.

--
CutOnce

 

planing rockets

It ought to be well remembered in considering any boat from a viper on up especially if it is a planing hull that adding former crew to the keel in the form of lead only helps when the boat is heeling! Thats why DSS is hands down the best system for adding RM to an already fast boat or to a design from scratch: it develops RM w/o heel and w/o weight. It is an ideal system for larger singlehanded boats and/or for any singlehander designed from scratch......

 

So what is it that makes this design you are showing a good choice for singlehanded buoy racing?

 

G'day Gary. THANKS for the insight. Greatly appreciated. So about $15K to $20K NZD - in round figures? Fab value for what 1 would get out of the end-result - IMHO Sure does look the - full-monte!!! I just gota get over there & sail it - oh - & play with that big red-stick in the background. WOW + +

Now to something that I really want to know about. Maybe in the wrong place here - 'thread drift' but - I notice the 'very pretty' rocket-ship in the background - I need a 'wall-screen' (4' square) c/w 3 mil mega-pixels - but how is that beaut machine going? - notice a nice wing on it now - WOW. More info Please. You sure have been a busy 'lill-vegamite!!!!

23*C above here, raining 'wheely-bins' - the wet season might have arrived. Notice Denver, Col @ -2 to +10, Moscow -12 to -6, Montreal, Qeu - -11 to -6.
How do you guys manage to stay alive?? I'd just curl-up & die, for sure. That's why I moved from Vancouver, BC (@-14 to -4) to sunny, WARM Far North Queensland. Keep well & close to a BIG heater guys. Ciao, james

 

I don't mind getting wet... I just want the boat to be fast

 

Ultimate 21' Singlehander,no, really: The Ultimate!

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Comrade, grab a beer(or diet coke) sit yoself down and read this and check out da pix. Scroll down past the German and the pictures:

 

There is talk of putting a prod on the skimmer and a masthead reacher. Actually sailing solo, there is plenty of power and sail area for one person and you have to reef the foremast rig once over 12-14 knots. The skimmer planes very easily, beginning at 8 knots wind. With two aboard the boat beats to weather better in waves than when sailed solo, even when shifting your weight forward as far as you can - but that could be changed with shifting water ballast. Not worth it on the 5.5 but would be excellent on 7.5m - if determined to sail solo.
Melges 24's are rocket ships but a WB 7.5 (or maybe a DSS 7.5) would go okay. The bow volume of the skimmer is large, tending towards a scow (to carry foremast rig) but in moderate wind and reaching/planing, the skim boat would be hard to beat (because it is so light). But the 5.5 is designed as a knockabout, different, but fast boat; if seriously meant to attack M24's and the like - go to same size multihull and you win easily.