TP52s

[RHough]

Originally Posted by TP 52 Defender

69.1 - really hard to use in this case (or any due to the penalties). However the internet is not the race course and those comments would be statements of oppinions and do not violate RRS 2.

I would doubt any judge would call for a 69 on this one.

Soundlike the driftathon got the better of both boats ...

Yep, I wouldn't expect a 69.1 ruling to stand under appeal, but the threat of it might just keep a civil tongue in people's mouths. It would for sure send the message that talking trash in public labels you a poor sport.

I'm old fashioned, I don't approve of calling a competitor's boat a POS. Anyone that spoke that way about another racer would be off my boat permanently. Ego's and attitudes are left at the dock. I would like to think that yacht racing is still a sport that demands good manners.

I also believe in Santa and the Easter Bunny

[marshmat]

Originally Posted by RHough

Ego's and attitudes are left at the dock. I would like to think that yacht racing is still a sport that demands good manners.

I second that.

[SailDesign]

Originally Posted by RHough

Ego's and attitudes are left at the dock. I would like to think that yacht racing is still a sport that demands good manners.

I'll third that, but cite the fact that I refuse to race any more.....

[jam007]

It´s very important to take 69.1 when 2BW and POS flying the flag of RRS 2 DSQ.
LOL

Anders M

[mfqrdf]

mighetto, who do you think you are???

I am just simply perplexed at how this, now 97 page, diatribe has any relevance to anything. I started reading, thinking that there might actually be a cool discussion of the TP52. Its an awesome boat, we raced them at the STC's IRC Mid Atlantic Championship; and while we beat Trader on corrected time once in 8 races, Rush and Trader passed us at every start like we were parked cars. They are ludicrously well concieved designs that are totally fast.

Alright, so I was taught in my Introduction to Naval Architecture class (at one of this nation's most renound institutions of higher learning) that a boats stability is easily increased by lowering the center of gravity...last i checked bulbs are probably the best way to do that.

Thankfully you've helped me see the light though...I now know that it is all an East Coast conspiracy. The NYYC, STC, Bruce Farr, German Frers, USSailing, J-Boats, Sparkmen Stephens, AYC, LYC, Nautor, Cookson, ILYC, CCA, the whole !@%#ing state of RI--they're all trying to get us to buy boats with keels, its their evil plan.

As a result of your revolutionary ideas, I started to consider revamping other parts of my life. I recently started reading Marx and Lenin's theories on government. I now know that I hate this whole Democracy, Liberalism, Freedom thing; I want a unified society, one where I will get the same food, car, healthcare, computers, et cetera as my neighbor even though I won't do any work. I realized that in the perfect communist state we would all be issued Mac26s, they'd be the ideal boat--ugly as sin but not giving into the conspiracy.

Now, while I may jest and put down your boat, I understand that it is a sensible choice for many people just entering, or looking for that segment of the sport. But don't trash my style of racing, where we sail fast boats of over 40 feet, where teamwork is a major factor and where I feel I get a better experience. Don't try and tell me that the laws of Hydrodynamics, and basic principals of phisics dont' exist at SSSS and you guys know that water ballest is best.

Some random advice which you probably couldn't derive on your own--don't show up to a gun fight with just a knife--probably not the best plan.

-Out

[Rolltacker]

golf clap.......................well played mfqrd

[mighetto]

Originally Posted by mfqrdf

mighetto, who do you think you are???

I am just simply perplexed at how this, now 97 page, diatribe has any relevance to anything. I started reading, thinking that there might actually be a cool discussion of the TP52. Its an awesome boat, we raced them at the STC's IRC Mid Atlantic Championship; and while we beat Trader on corrected time once in 8 races, Rush and Trader passed us at every start like we were parked cars. They are ludicrously well concieved designs that are totally fast.

Alright, so I was taught in my Introduction to Naval Architecture class (at one of this nation's most renound institutions of higher learning) that a boats stability is easily increased by lowering the center of gravity...last i checked bulbs are probably the best way to do that.

Thankfully you've helped me see the light though...I now know that it is all an East Coast conspiracy. The NYYC, STC, Bruce Farr, German Frers, USSailing, J-Boats, Sparkmen Stephens, AYC, LYC, Nautor, Cookson, ILYC, CCA, the whole !@%#ing state of RI--they're all trying to get us to buy boats with keels, its their evil plan.

As a result of your revolutionary ideas, I started to consider revamping other parts of my life. I recently started reading Marx and Lenin's theories on government. I now know that I hate this whole Democracy, Liberalism, Freedom thing; I want a unified society, one where I will get the same food, car, healthcare, computers, et cetera as my neighbor even though I won't do any work. I realized that in the perfect communist state we would all be issued Mac26s, they'd be the ideal boat--ugly as sin but not giving into the conspiracy.

Now, while I may jest and put down your boat, I understand that it is a sensible choice for many people just entering, or looking for that segment of the sport. But don't trash my style of racing, where we sail fast boats of over 40 feet, where teamwork is a major factor and where I feel I get a better experience. Don't try and tell me that the laws of Hydrodynamics, and basic principals of phisics dont' exist at SSSS and you guys know that water ballest is best.

Some random advice which you probably couldn't derive on your own--don't show up to a gun fight with just a knife--probably not the best plan.

-Out

I am a fellow running for any and all offices as a write in candidate at both US Sailing and SSSS. Does this help you accept me? It is a brave thing that I do, posting here, but there are many like me. I am known as He Whose Name Should Not Be Spoken (HWNSNBS) but I am a real person. Frank L. Mighetto who has been a boater, all be it power most of the time, all my life and of course I fathom myself an amature boat designer. I have held officer positions at more than one boating organization. Does this help. Now on TP52s.

The climate of corruption that is prevalent in the US Federal Government is also prevalent in those who we can call the lubbers on the big boats like the TP52s. There is a reason good folks who love sailing do not join clubs that are overly influenced by these lubbers and instead join clubs like SSSS. SSSS is the only US sailing organization with a continued record of growth in membership that I am aware of. It is our reluctance to support the TP52 lubberly culture that sets us apart from other clubs. That culture is now being called a culture of corruption.

Open your news paper. See what east-is-least thinking has done to the US nation. Think what it has done to the sport of sailing.

TP52s represent a burden on the sport. They are also a burdon on the marinas and on the sea ways. Are you aware that permission to race the big boats on a course suitable for them was denighed by Federal officials controlling the Seattle area waterways. Everyone who has had to deal with these big boats is aware that they cause trouble, probably not because of the boat design itself but the arrogance of their operators and training of crew.

US Sailing rejected ORC (Ocean Racing Committee) because of that culture of corruption. The culture is also known as a culture of patronage or a culture of silence or top down instead of bottom up decision making but the notion is that if you keep your mouth shut even when observing cheating and other wrong doing that this will be rewarded in time with a position on the US Sailing team or something similar. ORC is now a "friend" of US Sailing and has been renamed Ocean Racing Council but it is operating to undermine US Sailing now - this according to a US Sailing Board member who gave me that information over the holiday's. US Sailing has completely rejected ORC. The culture of corruption involves punishing any who disagree as well as rewarding the robots who keep their mouths shut. By posting you show courage. I respond with a well done. The training crew get on TP52s likely is training in how to be a good lubberly robot, or knife holding gang member, and not how to think like a captain. Of course that is but a theory and there must be exceptions but in general it is truth - am I correct? Do you not think of yourself as a gang member owing to crewing on a TP52? Do you have at tattoo?

Now what was the Christmas count on those TP52s? I think my prediction was 20 and defenders was 30 plus. How did we do? Note: ORC is not only not a friend of US Sailing and by extension the US Olympic team but it also is not a friend of TP52s, instead pushing 42 footers. The TP52 class truly operates on its own. Owners are lucky that IRC operates like SSSS and will, if perhaps reluctantly, accept them. They are a burden. Truly wards of the societies where they are found. Sad animals but gods creatures none the Oh - now the commurcial.

Bylaw discussion on the SSSS board anyone?

Frank L. Mighetto

[usa2]

damn and i was hoping this thread was dead.

[mholguin]

Granted, English is my second language (i was born in a Spanish speaking country). 7 years of English classes, two years working as a translator, all are wasted.

I couldn't, no matter how hard I tried, make any sense out of Mighetto's last post...

[fatdog]

Originally Posted by mholguin

Granted, English is my second language (i was born in a Spanish speaking country). 7 years of English classes, two years working as a translator, all are wasted.

I couldn't, no matter how hard I tried, make any sense out of Mighetto's last post...

English as a second language is not the issue here. Try wearing an aluminum foil hat, preferably Reynolds Wrap brand...it will block out all of the transmissions emitted from the TP52 Class mind control satellites, launched late last year from a secret bunker at NYYC’s Harborcourt in Newport, RI.
Here is a how to linik on constructing your own http://zapatopi.net/afdb/build.html

Couple this with massive quantities of LSD and homemade crystal-meth and you should be able to “see the light”.

[mholguin]

Could it be that I'm under Trip Gal's spell? Cause I do like the TP-52s... and the Vo-70s...

[marshmat]

Originally Posted by fatdog

English as a second language is not the issue here. Try wearing an aluminum foil hat, preferably Reynolds Wrap brand...it will block out all of the transmissions emitted from the TP52 Class mind control satellites, launched late last year from a secret bunker at NYYC’s Harborcourt in Newport, RI.
Couple this with massive quantities of LSD and homemade crystal-meth and you should be able to “see the light”.

I couldn't make any sense out of it either. I'll give my local cops a call and see if there's a meth lab nearby so I can try that!
For some reason, the more Frank bashes the TP52 and the more I look up on the class, the more I want one of these ocean greyhounds for myself!
USA2- I too was hoping the thread was dead. Ah well. Shall we try for #1500, folks?

[Shife]

Originally Posted by marshmat

I couldn't make any sense out of it either. I'll give my local cops a call and see if there's a meth lab nearby so I can try that!
For some reason, the more Frank bashes the TP52 and the more I look up on the class, the more I want one of these ocean greyhounds for myself!
USA2- I too was hoping the thread was dead. Ah well. Shall we try for #1500, folks?

I too was hoping for a corpse, but what the hell:

Hey Frankie. Sailing World has a pretty good article about the big boat scene in your area in the Jan/Feb issue. Strange they didn't bother to interview you eh? I mean, you are the self proclaimed sailing know-it-all of the PNW aren't you? I figured they would have consulted your vast knowledge of these boats for their article.

[TP 52 Defender]

31 TP52 active, 3 in build and 2 + on order. So Frank was once again WRONG 31 > 20 .... Apologies are due Frank ...

Last chance to come and do the feeder race to KW .....

Other Class scutttle - The current owner of Yasso is looking for yet another TP 52.

Now to address the *****:

"Everyone who has had to deal with these big boats is aware that they cause trouble, probably not because of the boat design itself but the arogance of their operators and training of crew."

- No trouble when the programs are run professional (that would be all of them). As to the Seattle port issue that’s odd as the TP 52's annually race out of Miami and Ft. Lauderdale - 2 of the busiest sea ports in the US. Seems the only arrogance her is yours Frank.

- Keep claiming something is true and guess what - some fools will believe you but it will still not make it true - this goes for sailing and politics.

"The training crew get on TP52s likely is training in how to be a good lubberly robot, or knife holding gang member, and not how to think like a captain. Of course that is but a theory and there must be exceptions but in genearal it is truth - am I correct? Do you not think of yourself as a gang member owing to crewing on a TP52?"

- As you have never sailed on a 52 how would you know, you do realize that some of the best sailors in the world sail regularly on TP 52's. Olympians, National & World Champions, Whitbread / Volvo, Americas Cup and many others will be sailing on them again this year in KWRW and at the Worlds in March.

- The ORC has been around for years you twit and they have had the same relationship with US sailing forever. IRC rule changes are coming that will change the TP 52 and other "larger" yachts ratings - do you know what it is or will you make up more of your BS?


- Frank you are a burden, to this board and I imagine from evidence presented here to sailing in general. You have been proven wrong, corrected and shown hard facts that back up claims here by many of the posters and yet you continue to LIE. Make a New Years Resolution - only talk about things you know about and to shut up and listen / learn from your betters on subjects you are ignorant on (TP 52's being one and racing sailboats is another).

[mholguin]

No wonder I was so confused:

Burdon = laste name. I figure he meant BURDEN:

Main Entry: 1bur·den
Pronunciation: 'b&r-d&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English byrthen; akin to Old English beran to carry -- more at BEAR
1 a : something that is carried : LOAD b : DUTY, RESPONSIBILITY
2 : something oppressive or worrisome
3 a : the bearing of a load -- usually used in the phrase beast of burden b : capacity for carrying cargo <a ship of a hundred tons burden>
4 : the amount of a deleterious parasite, growth, or substance present in a human or animal body <worm burden> <cancer burden>