Sailboats are evil...

[Thunderhead19]

Originally Posted by tspeer

Well, be thankful for the sailboaters! When the Cadillac VanIsle 360 fleet pulled into Pt Hardy, the Mayor said, "We like you sailors. You spend money. You're not like them kayakers."

Mayor Harry Mose is a splendid speaker, isn't he? Anyway, that comes back to my original post, only applied to "kayakers" as opposed to sailboaters. There must be some kind of "food chain"

[dvgale]

Originally Posted by Thunderhead19

Mayor Harry Mose is a splendid speaker, isn't he? Anyway, that comes back to my original post, only applied to "kayakers" as opposed to sailboaters. There must be some kind of "food chain"

As a kayaker, I would definitely argue that point - but, then again, I may lavish more on my sports than others. Anytime I enter a paddle sports shop, or just about any marine-related store, for that matter, I never seem to leave without spending at least $100 at a shot - often much more. "Chump change", maybe, compared to larger sail and power boats, but fair enough for "discretionary" purchases. Of course my "fuel" is more likely bought at General Nutrition Center than at the waterfront marina, but I am happy to pay a fee for the convenience of using a launch ramp at a marina to cruise an intriguing locale rather than parking in a questionable location at a put-in (especially if the marina has SHOWERS I can use on take-out!)

The kayaker's "money hole in the water" may be small, but it's there, just the same.

Don Gale
South Salem, NY

[bblair]

And just what is wrong with a good bar fight among friends?

Before learning to sail, I had the idea of crossing oceans in boats. As a complete lubber, I asked a broker about power boats. He asked if I was rich. I said no, and replied that I needed a sailboat. I learned to sail, and untimately cruised across the Pacific. Recently, I considered buying a motorboat, but then I realized that that grateful moment when you turn off the motor and sail would never come. I leared sailing as a means to traveling, and later came to love it, as a graceful dance with the winds and waves.

[Thunderhead19]

I know a guy who sails and on at least one occasion I know of, never ran his Aux engine. He left the marina with enough sail for steerage, and came in with enough sail for steerage. He and his crew docked perfectly. I can appreciate that. I'm not a minimalist, but that kind of unfettered experience appeals to me.

I'm going to start a new thread on this

[asathor]

You blokes are all taking the bait.

What Thunderhead appers to be saying saying is that sailboat owners on average are cheap, that power boaters on avareage do not care about money and that the Harbormaster he worked for was a fool who had no understanding of supply and demand.

At least all you sailors should be quiet before he figures out that the real problem at the dock was a goofy pricing structure that encouraged sailors to line up and keep the powerboaters away.

I like free waters and like that my boat does not use a lot of expensive fuel - and frankly for the $7 an hour the pump attendant job pays I don't require much.

I have already said too much.

[Thunderhead19]

**snicker snicker**

[dreamer]

Thunderhead you've been a good sport!

I commend you on your risk-taking skills. Which, by the way, will come in handy when you're sailing:

Q: Which way is the wind blowing?
A: I don't know (or 'Over there', 'From that way', etc.)

Q: Do you think the sails look a little funny?
A: DUCK!

Q: How much fuel do we have?
A: I don't know

Q: Which rope should I pull?
A: That one, over there...no...that one there (pointing), not that one, THAT one!

Q: Okay, everyone ready to jibe?
A: huh?

Q: Sailboats tip over don't they?
A: Oh yeah, all the time (eyes roll). My usual response to this one is 'Only when they're on a trailer'

Really though, in general those who make boating a part of their life will give it the respect it deserves...regardless of whether it is sail or power.

You alluded to one aspect of powerboating, however, that contributes to the reason there are more accidents, more rudeness, more disrespect among powerboaters: convenience. Turn the key, floor the throttle, drink beer. If you piss someone off, just hit the gas and put them out of mind. As the speed goes up, so do the risks. Sailboats do run into each other. Sailboats do run up on shore. Sailboats even run over people. But, it's all in slow motion and the perpetrators walk away from the incident with their lives.

Beyond that, there's nothing that is quite so fascinating as taking command of a vehicle whose only propulsion is the wind. It's incredible when you think about a 15 ton vessel being pushed (or pulled, if you like) by air. It never ceases to amaze me when I see a sailboat out of the water sitting in a cradle or on stands. On land they seem so massive. Put a shoulder to a 40 footer and the solidity is incredible. Now, imagine this beast silently gliding along with its sails up, rigging taught, and the crew having a conversation at normal speach levels. It's even quiet enough to have some background music.

Then of course there's the fuel. We owned our sailboat 4 years before we had to fill the tank. It's a 30 gallon tank. We rarely (try to) sail when the winds are less than 5 knots . Most sailboaters (all the sailboaters I know anyway) will only take their boat out if there's wind. In the summer in MN, there's usually wind. That means most sailboaters hardly use their engines. Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely not a purist. In fact, nothing bugs me more than to hear a ragbagger complain about their 'iron genny'. I could not imagine anything more frustrating than having a sailboat without an engine. Besides providing flexibility for your vessel, it's also an important safety device and should be maintained in close-to-perfect working condition. Sorry Lin and Larry, but I would prefer NOT to sit in the mouth of a harbor for days waiting for the wind to come up and get me into port.

Sure, there are some green-slimers...boats which never make it out of the slip. But I don't know any of them. Neither do any of the sailboaters I know. We sit in the cockpit after a great day of sailing, look across the marina at these boats and shake our heads muttering 'what a shame'.

But, above it all, people who own a sailboat...even the green slimers...have The Dream. The Dream is the realization that a sailboat gives you an out. It's a gateway in a garden wall. On the Mississippi it's called 'The Right Turn' (or 'The Left Turn' if you're in Wisconsin). On the East or West coast of any continent it's simply referred to as 'Out There'. Only a few sailboaters make the dream a reality, but all sailboaters have it. Even if they don't realize it. It's great to meet new sailboat owners. The Dream is right there on their shirtsleeves.

So, what does this have to do with boat design? Everything! If the design is implemented to cater to The Dream (whatever form that dream may be), it will be a success.

[OrionsSword]

hey i have somthing that might explain this so called sailors taking to long...its not were your going its how much fun you have along the way. Personnaly (i'm a sailor) i'm going to take the fun journey allong the way to death and if some poluting idiot stinkpotter want to give me the finger for that then i'll give it right back.
also i'd like to point out as others have that this is a design forum not a forum to bash sailors mearly because we have are slightly more relaksed but if you want to argue about sailboat vs powerboat design then bring it on!! sailboats cut through the water like beautiful thing in cunjunction with nature and stinkpots mearly smash the water and nature out of the way

[K4s]

Sailboats are truley the most evil of inventions to ever have been exposed to the general population.Since my first time on a yacht,it doesnt matter where I am or what Im doing I find I am aware of wind direction and strength.It takes true concentration and determination to keep my mind on more mundane things like work etc.Every day I dream about hoisting sails and escaping the NOISE and stress of everyday survival,luckily almost every day I can feed this addiction and destress in the most peacefull way there is.....I go for a sail.
So if you apply the rule that anything this good must be wrong...Sailing and sailing craft are in deed truley EVIL.........
K4s

[gonzo]

Orionsword: You speak about "more relaxed", but your insults, crude language and bad attitude attest to the contrary. I know polite people that boat with diverse types of propulsion.

[OrionsSword]

ok i do apologize for my cude language and inciting comments i was not having a good day (i had just discovered a rotten core in my boat and another soft spot)
and yes i do know many polite and thoughful boaters of every kind of propultion and have been resucued and nearly run over by both sailors and powerboaters

orion

[Wynand N]

Thunderhead19

Please consider another job or take up sailing.

If your symptoms still persists, feel free to consult a witchdoctor here in darkest Africa. I will pickup the tab.

Fair winds (or rather in your case - High Octane & Smoke)

Wynand

[gonzo]

Just don't put the tokoloshi under my bunk

[FAST FRED]

The basic advantage of SAIL is unlimited crusing range.

With a simple boat that does not require a gen set the RANGE can almost be unlimited.

Even water capacity can be extendes with the use of a rain catching tarp , or simply lowering the main a foot to create a water chanel.

The problem with stink pots is they frequently cant GO anywhere since the range is so limited.

I have happily sailed fromTrinidad to NYC , with the only fuel used being a gal of Kero for the primus stove.
Perhaps 100 to 120 NM a day isn't Macho , but it does the job.

FAST FRED