Old Quarter Tonners -Magic Bus

Well,very good stuff from Tom Stephenson - but here's a short bit from Jim Young's viewpoint: We headed out to Channel Island knowing we were well back and after rounding near dusk, we set the spinnaker. The log reached 22 knots with the boat lit up like daylight from phosphorescence as we charged through the night. At daybreak we had caught the fleet and were very close to the leader. Seeing us overtaking them and into fourth place forced them to also set spinnakers. Everyone was pushing hard and it was a wild ride. We had a few broaches – but then later the wind fell away. Heatwave was not good in the light.....

 

Gary and Paul!
One gets nostalgic. It would have been really interesting to sail that 1-ton cup in NZ you are writing abot. The idea about the Gyllenhammar-owned 30.55 rater was to stay with the fleet and manage to win by having a slighltly lower rating. But in the 1-ton cup it was another thing. The keel was deepened. The alterations, I believe, were made by Pelle Pettersson. Yes, Gyllenhammar had a Håkan Södergren design as well. Södergren did some really good designs. Södergren designed a half-tonner "Helmer Bryd" that was 3:rd in World's in Sweden -81?, when ArBigouden won. Two years ago Södergren designed a 2.4mr that showed some speed. Regarding Holland being able to win with Tilsalg and Bremen 2:nd due to lack of good competetion, this may be true to some extent. But these boats had a hugh number of practicing hours before the World's. Tony Castro (earlier on Holland's office) some years later managed to beat Holland in a 1-ton cup (or maybe 3/4-ton cup) in Ireland. Castro had some difficulties with a special-built carbon fiber? rudder-failure before the event. They needed a rudder-stock with the same diameter, and managed to get one from a bigger boat. Despite this big rudder Castro managed to win. After that I believe Holland mainly has got success with really big boats.
Regards,
Booster

 

Paul, I think Holland had some pretty good competition. The designs that Indulgence beat included (IIRC) Cascabel (Peterson Dida type), The Red Lion (Farr), Export Lion (Farr) Heatwave, Fonta, various Fontana/Malleto/Navones, Vallicellis, Davidsons (Alerted), Dubois (Snowball) Jones (Rakau, Blue Point), Schiomachens (I think) etc.

Looking at the AC results around that time, we see that plenty of these designers were doing well at that level, too;

1979 - Top boat Eclipse (Peterson) from Police Car (Dubois) and Imp (Holland)
1981- Holland (Swuzzlebubble) from Victory (Dubois+rating error) and Regardless (Holland).
1983 - Diva (Joubert/Nivelt), Justine (Castro) Sabina (de Ridder) & Almagores (Peterson 43, top 'big boat'), then Brava (Vallicelli) and Pinta (J & V) =5th and = 2nd 'big boat').`

So Vallicelli, Dubois, Holland and Castro were all doing well among the "big boys".

 

I've pulled out some of my old Seahorse magazines to refresh my memory.

In '83, Helmer Byrd was said to be "the fastest of the Swedish team" but a DNF in the long race dropped her out of the top 10.

That year Fram (Amble) was noted as having "superb upwind speed" but the French (especially Cifraline) flew downwind whereas Fram was "sticky in the light".

Freelance (Briand, displacing 2,410kg) was the "worthy winner". She was the narrowest boat in the top 10 (2.8m) and carried the least sail (40.2 RSAT). Cifraline was 2nd (2,341kg, 2.947m beam, 42.23m sail) and a poor long race put Fram down to 4th. She was 2537kg with 43.4m of sail.

I just noticed that Stahle, the designer of Robber and Psyko that Booster mentioned earlier, finished 10th.

The year before, Freelance had won the French trials but had been DSQd in the Worlds; her crew and the witnesses then "got into a serious punch up, demolishing one of the bars in the yacht club" before retiring from the series.

I'll check out info from the other HTCs you mentioned later, Booster.

I think I've got all the early-mid '80s level rating reports in the collection somewhere. I was too young to do any of it because level rating died out so early down here, but the IOR racing around then was great fun. A few years ago we had an offshore series down here that included about 10 halves, mainly very early masthead heavies but also mid '70s Petersons and a Farr and my own modified and light 1968 Spencer. Although we had national champions from three significant OD classes aboard, were too short on $ and preparation (or speed in a windy series) to beat the Farr, but the racing against the Petersons was classic level rating stuff. The boats were very different in concept, quite different in performance at various angles, yet so close in overall speed that it was the sailing that made the difference.

So much more fun that racing dissimilar boats, no matter how fast.

 

That's the beauty of recollection; I can't tell you how many times I've been in races where "we were grinding them" all day, but in the end somehow still finished behind.

The way Young's account reads is strange. He was "very close to the leader" and "overtaking them" into fourth place? If you overtake the leader you are not in fourth place. I have a feeling he could see Jumpa ahead, and ahead of her were SNA and Lion, but maybe he couldn't see B195 who was far ahead (rounding 15 1/2 minutes ahead of Lion, so probably 20 minutes ahead of Jumpa and possibly more than a half hour ahead of Heatwave at the time)? When they rounded the wind had not yet fallen away and the top four boats were far separated from the rest of the fleet, including HW.

By Stephenson's account B195 were flying their kite under control without broaching, so it wasn't Heatwave's appearance that made them put one up, as Young's account states.

 

I've looked at the list of Peterson designs and I don't see a OT that would be of a Dida-type. If there were Peterson boats present they would have probably been from pre-B195 designs, maybe with some modifications.

The Farr boats had been gutted by the rules changes. When you look at Downtown or Export Lion you basically see the familial shape of the '77 boats, especially in the stern. Those boats had no chance after the rule changes. When Farr returned to the IOR with the magnificent 36s Migizi and Freefall in '83 the overall shape was much different, especially the stern treatment. This followed on to the 30 raters and 30.55 Rating One Tonners.

I recall in the Pendragon year there was a weird Jones Oyster 40 in the mix. Really big boat, tortured hull, and small rig to rate 27.5'. That's the type of competition present. As I mentioned, I recall a well known US amateur racer sailing his older Ganbare type into the top 5, and that should not have happened in a competitive fleet in 1979.

One thing Seahorse used to do was a sort of play-by-play of the Ton Cups showing places at each mark by a colored line representing each boat. So you could look and see who was blazing up the beats, who was getting run over on the reaches, and who was quick on the runs. You could also see when a significant windshift came through, as the colored lines would get all turned around.

The fastest boat did not always win the Ton Cups, as in many regattas. Sometimes luck happens (good or bad), sometimes one boat just has superior talent, and sometimes stuff happens. I liked the way the later IOR 50 class used to do it, with a circuit for the year where the best boat would eventually shine through. With the '77 OTC sailing in brave conditions for most of the regatta, like the '78 QTC in Japan, it doesn't really tell what boat is the best.

 

Hi!
CT 249, thanks for the support from your old Seahorse Magazines. Paul B, "tortured hull" I suppose means a lot of bumping. A world record must be hold by ArBigouden winner of the half-ton cup in Sweden -81?. The bustle was impressive, and the foreward of the the aft girth-stations was well developed above waterline, as well. Perhaps someone has a photograf?
Regards,
Booster

 

The Jones style did well in many level rating events, so it can't have been too slow. *********'s top competitors in 1978 were the Jones Hustler 32s Indulgence and Smokey Bear. Years later, Jones 32s were still capable of leading Elvstrom and King One to the top mark. That's pretty quick.

Similarly, the 1982 or 83 SORC was almost won by the Oyster 43 Nadia, which lost it on a port and starboard IIRC. And I think Gunsmoke or another 36 was 2nd in the threequarter ton worlds. And about '85, a long tortured quarter (Hanna) did well at the worlds. So the tortured Jones shape was quite capable of doing well.

I haven't got my reports of the 1978 OTC to hand, but Not By Bread Alone (the Ganbare) scored well in one race through navigating well in the fog and in another on a big shift. I think her other finishes were well down, which was a better reflection of her speed. But yes, the 78 OTC fleet was small - however 1979 wasn't.

We could probably diss the fleet in many regattas if we wanted to. Look at Peterson's 74 OTC win. Second was a cheap De Ridder (who???) design. An S&S was in the frame apart from a disastrous 33rd or so (after she had been leading) on a late windshift. Who else was there? Holland's boats either leaked or were poorly sailed. Ceil wasn't designed for OTC racing. Terrorist - well what other King design ever went well?

 

Hi!
Probably Jac de Ridder.
Jac de Ridder - Designer / Naval Architect - The Marine Directory ... - [ Översätt den här sidan ]Would you like to know more about Jac de Ridder? Use the contact form to send a message and request that this entry be updated. ...
www.sailingnetworks.com/organisation/view/9345 - 15k - Cachad - Liknande sidor
Regards,
Booster

 

Actually Bruce King's Terrorist has to be one the very first centre/daggerboard boats, albeit she had two asymmetrics, windward up/leeward down - and she frightened everyone present that year by her high pointing and speed - which when you look at the hull profile, is a little unusual, the boat was almost pot bellied. Terrorist would have won the OTC that year - (if and but) had she not lost her rig in the last race. Then because the twin foiled boat showed too much speed for its own good, was legislated out soon afterward. The other jpegs show the difference between Peterson and Berret, plus two dinghy types of the same era.

 

correction: the Andre Mauric is no dinghy.

 

As I noted earlier, many ton cup fleets weren't as competitive as we wish they had been. Just because someone was competitive in a worlds doesn't mean they were really top of the heap in the world.

Also as I noted earlier, the fastest boats don't always win. Ganbare was fastest in '73, didn't win. Terrorist was fastest in '74, didn't win.

What I look back on were the boats that were breakthroughs, boats we knew were the fastest at the time regardless of who showed up. Ganbare in '73, Terrorist in '74, the Farrs in '77, Passion in '84 were all unquestionably the best OTs in the world at the time. I can't say the same for Pendragon, although she meets the criteria for the year before as a 3/4 Tonner.


You may wish to question Terrorist, but if not for the rule change to realistically ban the type ALL IOR boats would have to have been bilgeboarders after Terrorist. King was not alone in exploring this idea. Peterson once told me he had also considered the same thing, but disregarded it because it was such an easy loophole to close.

Consider the Ganbare/Contessa 35 types could basically have won the OTC 4 years running (Ganbare 2nd in '73 due to navigational error, Gumboots 1st in '74, Pied Piper 1st in '75, and Pied Piper 2nd in '76 (only beaten by a daggerboarder that took advantage of a loophole in the rule). The same design won the SORC Overall, and multiple other improtant regattas.

Farr's consistent updates to basically the same design from '87 to '92 was equally impressive, without exploiting any strange corner of the rule.


By the way, Bruce King did have some very successful early IOR boats, such as the Ericson 39 and 46. At the same time as Terrorist he did the 50 foot version Hawkeye that won major regattas like Big Boat Series before the loophole was closed. He also had some horrible misses, like the Ericson 34 and the custom 40' Madcap.

I was walking down the dock in San Diego a few years ago and saw a strange looking boat sitting neglected. I walked over to have a look and it was Terrorist, probably had not been out of the slip since the early 80s. Sad to see.

 

There was another double asymmetric board boat that I know of, your mate Britton Chance's Fous du Vous, for the SORC I think - which looked a very interesting design. Still would like to see some brave person design a modern sporting boat, no rule, two boarder. Maybe I'll have to do it on a smaller scale with the second water ballasted 5.5 m Cox's Bay Skimmer.

 

Hi!
Yes, those were the days. In the previous posts Doug Peterson's Ganbare is dealt with. The boat had a low-budget profile. Doug and his friends had built it. The fore-deck hatch was reported to be made of masonite. However, the winches were in place and so on. Due to forestay-problems it only managed 2:nd in the OTC. In the same OTC Peter Norlin took part with Supernova. A 37 footer, with full forward sections and heavy displacement. Again, a low-budget profile. The Swedes arrived to the OTC with the fittings, winches and so on in bags. At the first race a minimum of winches were in place. As the series progressed more and winches fell into place. The results improved as the boat got more complete. At the final race, the long offshore-race all winches were in place, and a really good result was achieved. Anyone having the results-list?
Regards,
Booster

 

Low budget!

In Sardinia, One Ton world 1973. A Polish entrant had a steel mast.