Boat Design Forums  |  Boat Design Directory  |  Boat Design Gallery  |  Boat Design Book Store  |  Thanks to Our Site Sponsors
  #16  
Old 09-03-2009, 05:02 AM
rwatson's Avatar
rwatson rwatson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Rep: 1749 Posts: 4,916
Location: Tasmania,Australia
Had a good look around on Google Earth - could be mistaken, but it seems to be beached at 36 47' 29.48 South 175 00' 28.98 East, at the West End of Blackpoool Beach.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-03-2009, 07:18 AM
dskira dskira is offline
Previous Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by armcc View Post
The scow RWatson is referring to is, I think, the Pahiki. Pahiki was a 40 tonne, 56' ketch (scow) that I believe was originally owned by McCallum Bros in the early 1900s for transporting red shingle from Pahiki Island, near Waiheke.

My grandfather (Whitaker) owned her in the 1940s and used her for recreational sailing. He added a small cabin abovedecks. I do not know when he sold her or who to, but she is definitely sunk near the causeway (or forms part of the causeway) between Blackpool and Ostend in Waiheke Island, Auckland.

Apart from rather sketchy family history, the only information I have is from http://www.mccallumbros.co.nz/mcchistory.htm

I would love to know more about her and why she ended up where she is. Daniel if you come across anything useful about this particular scow, I would appreciate knowing more.

This is a great story, thank you for sharing. Your grand'father was a lucky man, what a beautiful vessel.
I you refer to me by saying Daniel (I see we have an other Daniel in the Forum) if I find more information of course I will be delighted to pass on to you.
I am very intrigued of the bow shape of these scow, far more elaborate than the US scow. Must made the construction quite more difficult but the result is really beautiful and distinctive.

Cheers
Daniel

Last edited by dskira : 09-03-2009 at 07:24 AM. Reason: forget something
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-03-2009, 09:25 PM
armcc armcc is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 5
Location: St Heliers, NZ
Pahiki

Had a look at the wreck on google earth. V Interesting. Not 100% sure if it is the same wreck. Apparently there are 3 scows wrecked on Waiheke: Vixen, Rahiri and Pahiki. It is a couple of miles west of where my mum believes she took a piece of wood from the wreck of her father's boat. But then she may have been wrong.

Yes I was referring to you Dskira. Since then I have spent the evening scouring the Internet for more information and found some fascinating news articles about her. She first sunk in 1914 when she was hit amidships "clean through her" by the steamer Clansman. She was raised 2 days later and beached. She must have been repaired because in 1928 she ran aground in foul weather near Pahiki Island. I'm almost certain she is the same boat my grandfather owned, so she was therefore repaired again. I suppose she was just wood and brass - no engine or metal bits to corrode.

According to the NZ Maritime Index she was possibly the smallest of the hold scows at 56.5' long, 17.1' beam and only had a depth of 3 feet. I don't obviously have plans, but I do have a photograph of a scale replica of her. Not sure if it is ok to post the picture here due to copyright (I'm not in contact with the model builder). But I could email a photo to you if you like. She has a long bowsprit carrying two foresails, one with a jib boom and one directly off the bowsprit. On closer inspection she looks to be a yawl rather than a ketch and the little cabin I mentioned is behind the mizzenmast.

There has been a book published called "The Ships of Omaha: NZ 1858-1921". It describes all the boats built by this particular boat builder in Omaha (the NZ Omaha): David Darroch. I haven't read it, and I think the only way you could get a copy in the US is to write to the author carol.ramage@xtra.co.nz Apparently NZ$49+p&p. It has illlustrations and maps of wrecks. I think he built boats other than scows too.

Last edited by armcc : 09-03-2009 at 09:26 PM. Reason: spelling
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-09-2009, 08:56 PM
AnalogKid AnalogKid is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 26
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
NZ Scows

Hi armcc,

I had no idea that the scows were built down to the sizes you mention, I thought they were all 90 foot plus.

I regularly kayak past a vessel moored in the upper Waitemata. She's named VIXEN, and seems to be of a scow type, straight sides, flat square transom and flat bottom, although her clipper style bow is far more elegant than the likes of the Ted Ashby.

I estimate her size to be around 40 feet, maybe more, based on the number of kayak lengths I measured off, although this was in a strong tidal current s not the most accurate of measurements.
New Zealand Scow-vesper.jpg
Does this look similar to the style of boat your grandfather owned?

Cheers,
Andy.

Last edited by AnalogKid : 09-09-2009 at 08:57 PM. Reason: multiple typos
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-10-2009, 01:49 AM
armcc armcc is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 5
Location: St Heliers, NZ
Vixen

Hi AnalogKid,
How funny. It certainly appears that the Vixen is alive and floating. I don't know enough about scows to tell off that photo whether she is a scow or not, and it is hard to get an idea of scale. However, she does seem to be gaff rigged and flat bottom boats are popular in the upper harbour to sit on the mud when the tide is out.

I never met my grandfather so finding out about his boat is one way of finding out about his life. The only visual reference I have is the scale model that an uncle made. It is very possible that the scale replica is incorrect, I wouldn't know. But her bow, with the hard chine, looks much more like the Ted Ashby, as a point of reference, than the photo of the Vixen you provided.

Perhaps the references to the wreck of the Vixen on Waiheke is in fact not a scow but the motor vessel of the same name. Or perhaps the Vixen you found is a different boat. According to the NZ Scows Graveyard Directory, the original scow named the Vixen, at over 69 feet, was renamed the Wendell or Wendele in 1918 or 1922 and caught fire and broke up near Pahiki Island (Pahiki being below Waiheke/Ponui Islands for those that don't know.) So already there are several versions of the "facts" in this one directory alone. Just like my grandfather's scow, the Pahiki, which one newspaper report says met its fate in 1924, yet another report mentions it in 1928 and again in 1942 and later yet in 1975.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 09-10-2009, 05:07 PM
AnalogKid AnalogKid is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 26
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
VESPER - not VIXEN

Sorry,

It's a while since I went out and photographed this boat, it's actually the 'VESPER', I got confused because the original 'VESPER' was sister ship to the VIXEN. According to the Subritzky book, 'VESPER' was last heard of being used as a mussel barge in the Marlborough Sounds. At 79' I'm sure this is not the same VESPER, even with drift I'm sure she was less than 5.5 kayak lengths. The name does have some pedigree however, so maybe a later, smaller boat was renamed VESPER in honour of the original that won the 1884 Auckland Regatta Scow Race.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 09-11-2009, 02:27 AM
waikikin's Avatar
waikikin waikikin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Rep: 871 Posts: 2,195
Location: Australia
Great thread Dskira, thanks mate. Regards from Jeff.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-01-2009, 09:24 PM
rayman rayman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 59 Posts: 129
Location: brisbane
Hi guys,there are a few errors creeping in here. "Pahiki" very little left of her now, alongside the Ostend causeway, the bigger wreck you can find on google at Blackpool is "Rahiri" and that "Vesper" is only one mans interpretation of what a scow might have looked like. There is another replica vesper built of steel by a mate of mine and a plywood version of Pahiki lives at Kawau Island. The smallest sailing scow is "Tramp" just 17' . Von Luckner could never have sailed "Moa" from N.Z. to the Kermadec's (***** Is.) without her crew.He admitted that himself.
regards rayman
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-10-2009, 07:33 PM
dskira dskira is offline
Previous Member
 
I have one day to visit New Zealand and Australia, you have a great yachting and vessel history.
Cheers and thank you all for your posts. very interresting
Daniel
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-17-2010, 06:10 PM
AnalogKid AnalogKid is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 26
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Sailing Scow "VESPER"

The VESPER (see post 19 above) is now for sale on TradeMe.

It turns out that its a 1983 Schooner Sailing Scow designed by Ralph Sewell:

Vessel Info:

Type - Monohull Sail
Keel - Flat bottomed retractable
Construction - Timber
Hull- 2" Carvel / 1.6" Chine
Deck - 1.6" T&G glass over
Builder Gorden Hendricksen
Displacment - 10.5 ton
LOA - 18.90m
LOH: 14.33m
Draft: .80m
Beam: 4.19m

Engine: Isuzu 1990
Horsepower: 72
Freshwater Cooled
Est Cruise Speed - 6.5 knots
Est Max Speed - 9.5 knots
Fuel - Diesel
Drive System - Shaft
Transmission 2:1 Man

Last edited by AnalogKid : 03-17-2010 at 06:11 PM. Reason: extra detail
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-17-2010, 06:23 PM
dskira dskira is offline
Previous Member
 
I feel something is wrong in the size of the masts.
Perhaps it is the pictures, but seams way to small in diameter.
As for the suprsructures, hum, quite slam boom pass the epoxy and we done!
I hope I don't offend anyone. it is just my two cents
Daniel
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-17-2010, 07:25 PM
AnalogKid AnalogKid is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 10 Posts: 26
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
I don't know enough to comment on the mast diameters, but I'm sure the clunky look of the superstructures is to emulate the style of the old working scows.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-17-2010, 07:46 PM
dskira dskira is offline
Previous Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalogKid View Post
I don't know enough to comment on the mast diameters, but I'm sure the clunky look of the superstructures is to emulate the style of the old working scows.
Realy not. The superstructure of old working boats are not plywood, they are solid wood, and generaly very well sone by master carpenters. Working boat do not means bad work, it means solid, practical and extremely durable.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 07-07-2010, 02:27 AM
tom kane's Avatar
tom kane tom kane is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Rep: 389 Posts: 1,757
Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.
" A History of New Zealand Scows and Their Trades " is a recent book by
David Langdon (Captain) Teach Press. An appealing feature is great collection of photographs. The Author has traced and described 140 scows and includes outlines of several restoration projects.An appendices which classify the scows by year of build,owner,size and type included.
__________________
tomkane
Reply With Quote


  #30  
Old 07-07-2010, 07:39 PM
rayman rayman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Rep: 59 Posts: 129
Location: brisbane
Tom Kane, there are errors in Langdons book too. There has only been one restoration done and that is Jane Gifford, the replice Ted Ashby is just that, a replica, not even built traditionly,the hull of Kiatia is still in the waikato river somewhere, she became the Winstone sand dredge Big Ben at Mere Mere in 1955. Alma is down at Waitapu, Nelson and in a poor state as is Portland at the far end of the South Island.Success is still a dumb barge in the sounds. Another error in Langdons book is the little tug Alice, she was never steam and was probably built about 1914 at Onehunga, I owned her sister ship Shamrock,Alice when built had a 2stroke Gardner semi diesel and Shamrock a 2 stroke Fairbanks-Morse both of 33 hp. Alice was plank on frame while Shamrock was 3 skin. If you go to Hamilton Pub. Lib. and in the Family Hist. section find the" Subritzky Story" in there is a pic of Shamrock when owned by them, from them she went to Smeeds Quarries, Tuakau, I obtained her from them about 1956, later sold her to Papakura where she was used once again on the Manukau. Regards Ray.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Large Sailing Scow bblair Boat Design 58 12-26-2013
08:27 PM 
Scow moth....fun looking boats alyne Sailboats 8 06-02-2011
12:28 PM 
8 mt scow bushman Boat Design 5 09-05-2008
06:08 PM 
F/S: 1977 Melges C-Scow ------ Pasadena, CA C4L Marketplace 0 06-01-2008
07:41 PM 
Optimum Scow bow angle? MarkIFC Boat Design 2 11-14-2007
06:38 PM 

Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:48 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Web Site Design and Content Copyright ©1999 - 2017 Boat Design Net