New High Performance Monofoilers

[Doug Lord]

This is from a couple of posts made by Steve Clark on DA. The boat is 18' yet weighs only 70lb-a Moth weighs around 66lb-remarkable. I'd sure like to hear how Steve built the boat. It was designed as a foiler*.
This is the kind of innovative experimental work I'd like to hear more about.

*not! according to bistros and Steve Clark,my mistake

Some Locust particulars:

LOA: 18'
Beam at racks: 8'
Beam of Hull: ~12"
Mast length: ~22'
Gooseneck height:~20"
Boom Length: 95"
Sail Area: 104 ft^2
Weight: ~70lbs all in

[bistros]

Originally Posted by Doug Lord

This is from a couple of posts made by Steve Clark on DA. The boat is 18' yet weighs only 70lb-a Moth weighs around 66lb-remarkable. I'd sure like to hear how Steve built the boat. It was designed as a foiler- he hasn't posted any foiling pictures yet.
This is the kind of innovative experimental work I'd like to hear more about.
Some Locust particulars:

LOA: 18'
Beam at racks: 8'
Beam of Hull: ~12"
Mast length: ~22'
Gooseneck height:~20"
Boom Length: 95"
Sail Area: 104 ft^2
Weight: ~70lbs all in

Actually Doug it was not designed as a foiler. It is one hull from an A Cat, put together as a high speed thrill ride that would be challenging to sail. It certainly is a handful! I watched Steve sail it here in Ottawa, and quickly came to the conclusion I couldn't have sailed it to the breakwater without swimming.

Steve indicated he's waiting for his son to get his Moth built instead. Steve is a big guy - at least six feet plus tall, and over 200 pounds - and he's had no problem foiling on a Moth when he tried.

Steve is so heavily involved in building the International Canoe fleet in North America - I'm pretty sure he's not intending to become a flag bearer in the foiling revolution.

--
Bill S.

[Doug Lord]

Hadn't seen this one yet-thanks to WA. Lest anyone has forgotten this boat is 2.5 times as heavy as a Moth and yet has beaten one several times. It is the only production foiler with practical retractable foils-and does not require buoyancy pods like the Moth because of the hull beam. Those who say this boat is "too heavy" simply don't know what they are talking about. It is an exciting foiler development!
Foiling tacks and gybes -and the new square top main on the RS600FF-and Moths as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iaQL8ItUXA

RS600FF-old rig in 20k:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjoKE...eature=related

[Doug Lord]

The guys in NZ have now got 5 foilers in their fleet!
Heres a tidbit-you can find much more on their site. http://www.rclass.org/

"In foiling conditions the foiling boats are clearly faster around the course than the non foiling boats. In sub foiling conditions (with the wand disconnected) the boats with foils are marginally slower to windward. They are faster downwind, even when not quite foiling, as you can use the foils to get better depth at about the same speed"

[Cheesy]

Originally Posted by Doug Lord

The guys in NZ have now got 5 foilers in their fleet!
Heres a tidbit-you can find much more on their site. http://www.rclass.org/

"In foiling conditions the foiling boats are clearly faster around the course than the non foiling boats. In sub foiling conditions (with the wand disconnected) the boats with foils are marginally slower to windward. They are faster downwind, even when not quite foiling, as you can use the foils to get better depth at about the same speed"

Doug I cant belive you missed the bit about retractable foils!!!

[Doug Lord]

Dr. Ian Ward( Wardi), one of the original Moth foiler pioneers, has been spotted sailing an NS14 on hydrofoils. I've written to him for more details.
For those not familiar with the boat here is some info:


History and Design


Introduction to the NS14
The NS14 is an Australian designed sailing, intended for competitive family sailing. It has a simple rig, is light enough to be lifted from a trailer into the water by three people of average strength, requires no olympic skills to sail, and is affordable for the private sailor.

How it all Began
The NS14 was designed in 1960 by a group of senior members of Northbridge Sailing Club, Sydney. They wanted a high performance class boat which would not demand abnormal strength or acrobatics from its crew.

After some experimentation, the class restrictions were formulated around the successful combination of the New Zealand Javelin Hull and a sail area of 100 square feet. From the original two prototypes the class grew rapidly. Over 2000 boats are registered in the state of New South Wales, with numbers continuing to increase.

Control of the class was transferred in 1965 from the Northbridge Sailing Club to the NS14 Association of New South Wales. The Association is now a National body with state associations active in New South Wales, Victoria, Queensland, Tasmania, South Australia and in the Australian Capital Territory.

High Performance Family Sailing
This popular class has attracted many top flight skippers who have contributed their ideas to make the NS14 the highly developed boat in Australia.

The NS14 is a dingy which is ideal for two adults or an adult and a child. As the boat does not have a spinnaker or trapeze, yet retains high performance, it is ideal for parent/parent/child combinations of skipper and forwardhand. The minimum weight and age rules do not allow for individual advantage in these areas.

The minimum hull weight of 64kg (150 pounds) is light enough for easy on shore sailing, whilst the ample buoyancy allows the boat to be righted and sailing on after a capsize. The crew can be completely independent of the boat on and off (and in) the water. This is a big plus for family sailing, where novice crews are common.

The simple design makes for convenient and easy boat rigging when preparing for racing or family sailing.

Racing
The association conducts comprehensive inter-club calendars, the highlights being the state and national championships. The national titles are rotated around the states, giving members an opportunity to sail in various types of waters. Each state also arranges its own specialist series of events, for example a series of events throughout the sailing season may be conducted at different regatta throughout the state. There are travellers trophies and metropolitan trophies.

Sail Area, Hull Size Restrictions
The NS14 is not really a "one design" class, but is a restricted developed class, which allows variations within its simple restrictions. Experimentation with proportions of the 9.3 square metres (100 square foot) of sail has produced a highly efficient combination of jib and main sail, which contributes much of this boats amazing performance.

In hull shapes, expermentation has produced some interesting designs but as yet no one design has proved noticeably superior. The rules prevent exotic materials and radical shapes being used.




Principal Restrictions
Length 4.27m
Sail area (jib and main) 9.3m2 max
Weight of hull 64kg min
Max height to top of mainsail 5.5m above deck
Beam 1.6 - 1.8m

The boat must pass between two horizontal beams, spread 660mm apart. No trapezes, sliding seats or spinnaker. The boat must have buoyancy to be rightable after a capsize. The complete rules are available from the association secretary

[Munter]

Actually Doug - I think the northy would be a good boat for you. It is relatively high performance without being difficult to handle or unreliable. You could save yourself all sorts of foiling grief, jump into an off the shelf boat, and start having a good sailing time instead of constant internet bickering.
From memory I think there are a few in California already. They would be slightly out of date but would still be good to sail.

[Doug Lord]

Originally Posted by Munter

Actually Doug - I think the northy would be a good boat for you. It is relatively high performance without being difficult to handle or unreliable. You could save yourself all sorts of foiling grief, jump into an off the shelf boat, and start having a good sailing time instead of constant internet bickering.
From memory I think there are a few in California already. They would be slightly out of date but would still be good to sail.

==============================
Hey thanks,Munter-but I already have two foilers-one almost ready to go.
Appreciate the thought,though.

[Doug Lord]

Originally Posted by Doug Lord

Clive Everest is famous for a bunch of things but well known for his development of the RS600(to be covered later). Now he has embarked on a project that integrates electronic control with a wand system. His boat is quite unique having twin daggerboards to support the main foil:

-----------------------------------------------------
This is an update of the original post earlier in the thread with information posted a while back on SA. Includes specs of Clives boat:

" I have a foiler that is flying under full electronic control.
The boat is considerably bigger than a Moth.
At 195 lbs I am significantly heavier than a sensible weight for a Moth, though I did sail Moths competitively some 20 years ago.
The boat is 4.5m long 3.2m wing span and 12.5m2 sail area, It is about 55kg fully rigged. It has similar sail carrying ability and sail area to weight to a Moth.The boat was flying last year under mechanical control how ever there are inherent limitations in the standard control system that the Moth sailors hide with a lot of skill and practice.
It had always been my plan to develop electronic control for this boat.
The boat now uses an RS600FF main foil with the flap glued solid.Control is through a smaller balanced rudder foil using a Hitec HRS5995TG RC servo.
I have now had 5 or 6 hours of electronically controlled flight with no servo failures, once I had worked out how to stop water ingress.
Initial attempts to put a second servo to control the main foil flap did result in failure of the servo under static load.
The core elements of the control unit are a dsPIC30F6012A processor, ADXRS300 solid state gyro, LIS2L02AL solid state accelerometer for DC pitch measurement. The control unit has a 2x20 character display for diagnostics, a keypad that allows me to adjust key control parameters whilst afloat, and 2M of NVRAM for data logging.
Height is still measured with a wand that is connected to a POT.
The unit is powered by two 7.4V 4.2AH Li Ion Batteries. I think that I seriously over estimated the battery requirement as it is still virtually fully charged after 2 hours afloat.
The entire electronics package including batteries and servo weights 900g. It could be less with reduced battery and no display or keypad.
The system is still in early stages of development, though last weekend I did line up against Si Payne, and whilst he was faster upwind and down the difference was not that significant.When I had a mechanical linkage (when the pic was taken) the twin dagger boards allowed a single higher aspect main foil to be used without the weekness of the T joint. It also allowed thewhole foil to articulate and be controlled by the wand and not just the trailing edge flap giving greater control authority but more drag around the joints.
Also any control system that exclusively controls the main foil cannot provide an effective reactive torque to gusts on a high rig. Hence the wild course sailed by Moths downwind in windy weather.
I now have a fixed main T foil and a controlled foil on the rudder.Controlling through the rudder foil does generate new problems due to the extra lag in the control loop. It is akin to reversing a trailer rather than pulling it. "

[Doug Lord]

From the promo blurb here for February 2010-way to go Paul! http://www.seahorsemagazine.com/2010-February/2.php

Olympic & small boat news: A pervasive influence
Andy Rice is off in search of other classes where foiling is moving beyond the occasional 'experiment'

The foiling Moth has been capturing the imagination of sailors (and non-sailors) around the world ever since Rohan Veal first burst onto the scene a few years back. From being a 'garden shed' development class that attracted a few eccentric magnificent men in their non-flying machines, the adoption of hydrofoiling has launched the International Moth into a new era of prominence. Rohan Veal has experienced being mobbed for autographs by kids when he visits boatshows, and the class is increasingly talked about as a genuine cause for Olympic selection.

So if hydrofoiling heralded a new dawn for the Moth, why has no one jumped onto the bandwagon with a doublehanded foiler? There have been one-off foiling experiments with established skiffs such as International 14s, 49ers and 18-footers, but strict class rules have generally prevented the idea from properly taking off.

The R-Class in New Zealand, on the other hand, looks set to move en masse into foiling, just as the International Moth has done over the past five years. Then again, en masse is a relative term, as numbers in the R-Class are not that high to begin with. Indeed, that is one of the attractions of adopting the new foiling technology – that it could breathe new life into a class with a long and interesting history of development.

The stronghold of R-Class sailing is based in Canterbury in New Zealand's South Island, although foil developments are beginning to emerge in Auckland too. Like the Moth, this Kiwi doublehander is governed by a short list of rules. In many respects the R-Class bears comparison with the 12ft skiff, being a similarly proportioned twin-trapeze skiff with gennaker. Unlike on the 12-footer, upwind sail area is restricted to 13m2, but the R-Class makes no restriction on hydrofoils, which are banned in the 12.

[teknologika]

Originally Posted by Doug Lord

Dr. Ian Ward( Wardi), one of the original Moth foiler pioneers, has been spotted sailing an NS14 on hydrofoils. I've written to him for more details.

It is running Ilett moth foils and a moth main, it is definitely NOT NS14 class legal.

[Doug Lord]

This is the first foiling gybe I've seen done by a 2 person foiler:
http://www.rclass.org/video/leander-...-kite-run/view

great sailing and crew work:
http://www.rclass.org/video/leander-...-series-1/view

-------------------------------
2/16/10 See this: http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/ope...ies-31524.html

[Doug Lord]

From the front page,a tidbit:

"The 2010 Leander was a fantastic showcase for the foiling R's. The breathtaking speed, sailability and obvious fun of the foilers has generated a lot of interest and heralds an exciting resurgence in the R Class. Reliability is getting better with the foils and boats surviving a gruelling Leander Trophy and five race Sprint Series unscathed.

Merde made massive speed and stability improvements throughout the contest by moving closer to TheVirtual's setup. They are now starting to show the potential of the older boats on foils.

One of the important parts of the project has been to make hydrofoiling an affordable and practical part of R sailing for anyone in the fleet no matter what boat they have and how old it may be.
We have a specially built oven and foil moulds for squadron members to easily build their own set of foils. There are also people who have already built foils who are happy to help those who are new to this and let them know how it's done. If you don't want to build foils yourself then you can hire someone within the squadron to build them for you."

Much more here:
http://www.rclass.org/
---

From Sean M on DA:

http://www.rclass.org/leander/2010/p...iew_fullscreen

[Doug Lord]

New-and spectacular-pictures of the premier 2 person monofoiler-these are great:

http://www.rclass.org/leander/2010/p...tart:int=0&-C=


pix by Sutter Schumacher:
check out the difference in the spinnakers!

[Chris Ostlind]

Spectacular... I think not.

This image shows three boats tooling along, trying to get up and maintain a foiling condition with different rigs. Not really a big deal.

From the image, I'd have to say that the conditions were less than optimal and the functional relationship of this shot to anything of the so-called, spectacular, variety is purely interpretive. Perhaps you find it of the wowee variety. That's your call to make. I do not.