Mac 26 "Blam" Thread

[Gromet]

People,

Please leave Frank M. alone. This is a thread for "blamming", discrediting and insulting the design of the Macgregor 26. We need to rant and rave.

What fun is it without Frank M. He brings ot the worst in us. He makes sure everybody knows of these blamming threads. A Mac owner could have lived in ignorant bliss without knowing how many jerks there are out there. Frank M. made sure that wouldn't happen.

Let us be thankful for Frank M.

[Mark 42]

There are three M26 versions.

The classic had a swing keel.
The M and X models each have a centerboard or daggerboard.
I can't quite remember which has which... I think the X had
a centerboard and the M has a daggerboard.

Gromet (& anyone interested) click the picture...
also: there's a new movie coming!:

[TheFarSide]

IIRC and with the caveat I could be wrong,
The last "classic" with a swing keel was the 25, also the
transition boat between the Venture and MacGregor names.

The first classic 26' was the 26D with a a daggerboard
Then there was the classic 26S with a swing centerboard

Then there was the powersailor 26X with a swing centerboard
Followed by the current 26M with a daggerboard

I've also heard of people refer to their classic as a 26C,
and in those cases it's had a daggerboard.

So there have been at least four M26 versions, maybe five.

Brochures & Manuals here.

[mackid068]

"The classic had a swing keel."

That'll be a "bit" better...especially considering the fact that it probably had better sailing abilities.

[Plumbtex]

there is no insight or skill required to "blam" another vessel.It is quite another thing to offer a viable alternative. Mine was fantasy bordering on silliness but, not ill intentioned,please give us some alternatives.

[TheFarSide]

The high quality alternative to the MacGregor powersailor is the Odin 280, sold in the US as the Mast 28, at about twice the price. My main complaint is that it doesn't have the Mac's side dinette layout.

[Gromet]

Originally Posted by Plumbtex

there is no insight or skill required to "blam" another vessel.It is quite another thing to offer a viable alternative. Mine was fantasy bordering on silliness but, not ill intentioned,please give us some alternatives.

I agree but let's start a new thread. This one started off with such a negative tone. I own a Mac 26X and am enjoying it. I'm in Little Current, Canada writing from a little cafe. I'm cruising the North Channel. I really like powersailors but agree there are many shortcommings with the MacGregors.

[TheFarSide]

I think you will find that any shortcoming, of not only the Mac, but any trailer sailor, much less any boat, is a result of a compromise to gain an advantage in another area.

[mackid068]

"I agree but let's start a new thread. This one started off with such a negative tone. I own a Mac 26X and am enjoying it. I'm in Little Current, Canada writing from a little cafe. I'm cruising the North Channel. I really like powersailors but agree there are many shortcommings with the MacGregors."

Very many shortcomings. A new thread would be better.

[JustSailing]

Originally Posted by mackid068

It's a poorly designed vessel! That's what it is.

Then why is it such a popular design? Why are there so many M26? Why do they keep such high resale values? Why do so many, like you, keep talking about it? Why do sailing magazines give the M26 favorable reviews?

Assuming that this thread is not to "troll" or to "tabloidize" a desing forum one must ask "What is a good sailboat design?"

Will the boat carry cargo across oceans, or be the fastest or used for PHRF racing or coastal cruising. Who will use the design? How often? What is the target audience and price point?

Any boat design is a mass of parameters and decisions and is always a compromise.

The M26 is a successful design beacuse it met its target market. Good commercial designs fill a need. The M26 is a good design beacuse the manufacturer created a boat that fulfills a need.

I am a "boat consumer", I will never build my own boat. I cruise them and sometimes I race them. I would like, however, to see a clever designer look at what makes the M26 successful so he or she can improve on the design and create a boat larger (than the M26) that both sails well and can "get there" quickly at an affordable price.

[DLackey]

I dunno. Why is a Bayliner such a popular design?

Why are there so many Bayliners under 30' out there?

Cheap...affordable...a good marketing department. That's about it. None of those means good design. Just means hat there are a lot of gullible people out there.

Originally Posted by JustSailing

Then why is it such a popular design? Why are there so many M26?

[TheFarSide]

Originally Posted by DLackey

I dunno. Why is a Bayliner such a popular design?

ROTFLMAO! It's amazing how the arrogant snobs are usually the most clueless. Bayliner is a brand, genius, not a particular design. There are so many of them out there because they're of ADEQUATE quality for the price, for some consumers. I see lots of families, probably without snob-class incomes, having a lot of fun in them. While a few may be gullible, it more likely means there are a lot of people who don't give a rat's ass what snobs think about them or their boat. Of course, snobs can't stand being ignored by the little people and have to call them gullible.

[SailDesign]

The Mac26 is popular (IMNSHO) becasue it is advertised as being able to do both sailing and powering with equal ease and aplomb. Sailing speeds are advertised WAAAAaaayyyyyyyyyy above what is really possible (yes, in the right conditions it might do 17 under sail, but it will be a rare occurrance in nasty weather) while powering speeds are, as ever, dependent on the weight hung off the transom.
Does this make it a good boat? That is up to the owner. Does this make it sell? You betcha! And for the builders, and anyone trying to sell it, that makes it a good boat.
Do I like the Macs? No, but then I have only tried to sail the 19' version. The word "Tried" is the operative one
Steve

[mackid068]

"I see lots of families, probably without snob-class incomes, having a lot of fun in them. "

Snob-class income? What do you consider snob class?

In regards to the Mac26, it suckers in powerboaters to think they can sail (LOL) and do it with a powerboat's hull. I'm sure that, quality wise, in interior comfort and in motoring the Mac is fine, but not in relation to safety or performance under sail.

"The Mac26 is popular (IMNSHO) becasue it is advertised as being able to do both sailing and powering with equal ease and aplomb."

No boat can do that, no matter how they advertise it, as you said.

[TheFarSide]

No, I said it can do it with compromises. And while the Mac may only be 80-90% as easy to sail as some, and 80-90% as easy to power as some, it CAN "sail and power with equal ease," i.e. its ease of powering equals its ease of sailing.

MK, you're doing a great job of following in Frank M's footsteps.

Both of you criticize boats you have no experience with.

Both of you have little to no knowledge of boat design or physics.

Both of you ignore advice from those who have experience.

Both of you ignore being proven wrong.

Both of you seem to believe that if you keep repeating the same statement, it will come true, or at least someone might believe it.

Both of you believe that bashing something makes you a "big man" and gives you credibility.

There are some differences. Frank name drops yachts, you name drop youth boats.

Frank never admits not knowing something. You do, but then become an expert in 3 months, or more recently, less than an hour. If you're going to be Frank Jr., you can't do that.