Luderitz Speed Challenge New World Record of 54.1 knots

I didn't preach. I offered my opinion that speed records set in grossly artificial conditions are not as impressive to me as records set in real conditions. I said the kite records were "quite a feat", comparable in my mind to guys that set bicycle records riding behind a wind break on a pace car. Still records, but the guy on the kite board and the guy on the bike can't do it in non artificial conditions. Seems you have a problem with that. To each their own.

Chris, yes it has three wheels ... I did my best to keep all of them on the ground most of the time.

I do have some experience getting launched down the road at over 100 MPH, so to think that I don't get the idea of crashing at speed was just a bit presumptuous. I get the risks, I respect those that make the effort, I just don't think it has much meaning outside the ditch. I also don't think that hydroptre is much more than a curiosity until if/when they start hitting high multiples of true wind speed.

 

I think that we all have our own personal take on what is real or not. I don`t much care for the highly efficient approach where craft are designed to sail 3 times windspeed, yet end up looking much more like aircraft with plexiglass bubbles for the "pilot" as they themselves refer to the "skipper" of these craft. Yes they are highly efficient and very impressive, and I admire the skill and knowledge it takes to design, refine and get the most out of these craft. I am in awe of sailrocket, less so with MI, as it is just too far removed from any sailing craft that we know, and like the kites and windsurfers, are definitely restricted to a near-perfect water state. Only Hydroptere is vaguely similar to a boat, and stops being one that most sailors can relate to once it is on foils.
I guess that is what inspires me about the kiters and windsurfers - it is relatable, If I had the desire to have a go myself it would not be out of my reach, except perhaps that my sense of self preservation might limit my potential.

 

True limit

What is the last limit for kite-board: Human strength.
What is the current limit for hydroptères: Cost.
No doubt that hydroptères will win in the end...

 

As an engineer carefully following speedsailng for a while, I am tired of unfounded junk. The limit for Kiting is NOT STRENGTH.

The room for improvement is in getting smarter and/or working harder. Less air drag. More efficient rigs. Better hydrodynamics. Longer acceleration lane. Deeper trench so they do not have to shut down at low tide.

If strength comes close to limiting, a direct connection from the board to the lines to carry a portion of the load can be worked out. Strength is real important at this stage of the kiting effort, and will probably continue to be for some time. The physical demands are real, but there is also a HUGE skill factor. Keeping everything where you want it, flexing your legs to smooth out rough water, running the right line, etc.

Eventually, the top "Kiter" could well be someone sitting in a teardrop hull with multiple "planing surfaces" or foils while being pulled by a rigid wing "kite". The quest to be fastest is not going to end any time soon. Either jump into the game, or sit back and enjoy. Just do not go off talking about what can not be done if you have not even tried.

 

P Flados-

Very nicely said!

 

As an engineer, can you explain why traction kites don't hold landsailing speed records or icesailing speed records?

 

Traction kites are generally less efficient (useful lift vs. drag) than wings given the difficulties in achieving really good airfoil profiles, good aspect ratios and planforms. Use of kites also involves the not-insignificant drag of the lines used for both control and transmission of lift forces.

In recent years, most soft rigs used in speedsailing efforts (dirt, ice & water) are usually very advanced and are normally used used in conjunction with a wing mast in an effort to get as close to wing performance as possible.

Kiting on water has some real advantages.

The forces generated by the Kite, the pilots body position and the board can all be balanced and modulated at high speeds by a truly incredible active control system - the brain and arms of the very skilled pilot.

Kites are up where the wind is both faster and smoother.

The hydrodynamics of their boards is impressive. They operate mostly in a planing mode with very small wetted surfaces. There is constant force and angle of attack modulation via the sailors legs and that exceedingly impressive active control system. The total required vertical lift is minimal, the sailor and his gear is being lifted by both the board and the kite. The boards are probably one of the biggest reasons for their success. Foil cavitation has effectively created a wall for a number of speed sailing boats that have had more than enough power to blast way past 50 knots. These craft reached a peak speed at a medium wind speed but could go no faster in higher winds. The hydrodynamic performance of the the kiters is actually: outstanding, not very easy to understand, and potentially difficult or impossible to scale up to medium sized boat speedsailing challengers.

I have been astounded at how well the kiting configuration has allowed for such increases in top speeds in such a short time. I have regularly applauded their efforts and innovations. The fact that there improvements in the knots per year range makes for a strong case that they are no where near their max. I really want the boating side of the challenge to pick up the pace (Go Sailrocket Mk II) and I think they will end up on top, I am just not sure how long it will take.

On land, there are a couple of factors at play. Weight does not translate into drag nearly as much and in fact is useful for giving the wheel/skates the ability to generate the require side loads. If wing surfaces are used to create downforce, there is an induced drag penalty that you do not get with weight. To go really fast on ice or dirt, these guys find flat surfaces. Achieving good control and achieving the required forces to deal with roll moments is just entirely different on these surfaces. The kiting advantages on water are basically non-issues on land.

Also note that the actual max speeds are a lot higher. As the actual speeds increase, the penalty for things that cause air drag (such as the harness, the lines, the unshrouded sailor) also increase.

A large portion of the kiting "disadvantages" noted, are only a reflection of the current state of the art. If you think about it, Sailrocket Mk I is functionally much closer to the kiters than it is to Hydroptere. Kiting has plenty of room for improvement with just "tweaking" (improvements in the details). Other adventurous souls may figure out ways to make some basic configuration changes such as high pressure inflated bladders to get a "better" kite with fewer shrouds, bundled control lines to reduce drag, drag reducing foam to reduce pilot drag, etc.

I am not sure if the above is what you were looking for. I have thought about kites on land and I will bet that a determined effort could get some pretty fast results. I have just come to a position where I think that the same amount of effort could do even better with a fixed wing or a wingmast. Then again the land efforts just do not have the prestige / visibility of the water efforts. This is probably proportional to the number of active participants in the underlying sport. How many people have sailed a boat in a race as compared to the land versions.

 

RH,
Engineering may have something to do with it. This appears to be the current wind record; followed by the current kite buggy record.

 

This is about the best synopsis I have ever read. Spot on in every respect in my opinion.

Until the bigger "boats" can match the hyrdodynamic performance of the boards, their more efficient rigs are of limited value. The kite's performance relies on the control system rather than inherent design excellence.

Again, thanks for the excellent post!

R

 

It looks like they are going to spread out the ratifications to give each record breaker their due. Sounds like a grand idea to me:



The WSSR Council announces the ratification of a new World Record:

Record : World Sailing Speed Record
Venue: Luderitz. Namibia
Name: Alex Caizergues. FRA
Dates: 12th October 2010.
Course length: 501M
Elapsed time: 18.00 seconds
Speed: 54.10 knots


Comments: Current record: Hydroptere. 51.36 knots, September 2009.

As there were a number of subsequent claims on the World Record during the month-long Luderitz speed event, the Council will announce them in chronological order as they are ratified. This will give due recognition to each holder, even though it may have only been for a limited period.

The above record is remarkable in that it represents the first sailing craft to achieve 100 km/hr.

John Reed

Secretary to the WSSR Council

 

I posted this over in the Hydroptere thread, but will re-post it here give that the first run is now "official"

The best actual videos of the runs are probably:

Alex C, on 10-12-2010 with 54.1 kts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opBh6d44tQY

Seb Cattelan, on 10-28-2010 with 55.49 kts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syKXGBaZHIk

Rob Douglas, on 10-28-2010 with 55.65 kts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtFxstw9Zjo

Several points of interest.

1. The first run (Alex) shows the "berm" while the last two (faster) runs show it is clearly gone. The "berm" is not why they go so fast.
2. The water is not "super flat", it is probably just as rough as the water I saw in the MI record run at Sandy Point. Again, "super flat water" is not why they go so fast.
3. Although you have to look at other videos to see it better, they are all using boards that taper to a point at the rear along the lower edge. Alex was using a swallow tail version with points on top and bottom, the other two were one way boards with the taper on the lower edge only. Board improvements may be part of the reason for the speed improvement.
4. The kites are well out in front of the guys as they made the runs and the runs looked more smooth/steady. Part of the improved top speeds could just be that they were finally getting really good wind speed / angle / consistency up at the kites.
5. I also found a Rob Douglas interview video where he shared just how much he has been training for these events. Constantly out in the water in 30+ kts wind, constantly working out etc. The guy seems to have absolutely focused his life around this sport. You know, the biggest contributor to the improvements may just be they are getting so much more skilled. This is the kind of dedication you see in Olympic athletes. Quite of few of those sports have seen big leaps in performance over the years.
6. One last note. The more videos I looked at, the more I saw how much these guys are pushing past "reasonable risk". The crashes both during and at the end of the runs were both too plentiful and too violent. The organizers really need to step in and think through improving the end of run landing zone at least.

 

Hydroptere-Fastest Sailboat on the Planet!

==============
That's a good idea: Hydroptere STILL HOLDS the record for the fastest nautical mile in the history of sailing on water. Probably shouldn't be forgotten.
My congratulations to all the kite guys and gals for outstanding effort!

 

First woman over 50!

From Scuttlebutt: (Congratulations, Charlotte!)

"The World Sailing Speed Record Council has ratified a new World Women's
Sailing Speed Record. On October 28th, Charlotte Consorti (FRA) set a new
speed of 50.43 knots on the 500 meter course at Luderitz, Namibia on a kite
board. Charlotte is the first women to have exceeded 50 kts. The previous
record of 45.2 knots was held by Sjoukje Bredenkamp (RSA)". --
http://tinyurl.com/WSSRC-120610

 

It will be forgotten... for all but the folks that just need to see L'Hydroptere's name on the list somewhere. A simple Google session for fastest sailing speed record shows that even search engines prefer the 500m record, over all the others.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&expIds... sailing sp&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=1c030b17bae363c

 

For those that understand the magnitude of the achievements, ALL of the big records mean a lot. They are not forgotten any more than Antoine Albeau's 49.09 kts in the 500 meter (possibly the last outright by a Windsurfer).

The Nautical Mile, Hydroptère - 50.17 kts
The 24 hours run, Banque Populaire 5 - 37.84 kts
The Transatlantic, Banque Populaire 5 - 32.94 kts
Around the World, Groupama 3 -18.70 kts

The truth is that for most of the general public, they do not care at all about any of the sailing records.

Of the people that have ever competed in a sailboat race, only a fraction are really interested. But for those of us that admire those that would push the limits, each accomplishment deserves plenty of respect.