Lightest dinghy rig

[grob]

What is the lightest (least mass) type of rig for a dinghy? regardless of performance (within reason), i.e. don't say no sails.

[DavidG]

Kite?
Windsurfer Rig?
Conventional with Carbon Mast and Mylar Sails?

Why?!?
What is the dinghy?

[grob]

Its a 16ft catamaran, like a hobie16, I want around 12-15m2 of sail

The main aim is lightweight, I will consider any rig (maybe not a kite) and any mast material almost regardless of cost.

[ErikG]

Tha sounds like intresting work. Escp. the last thing "regardless of cost"!

Any takers? I sure would if I had known enough :-)

Erik

Carbon spars, mylar cloth. my boat's got some neat carbon reinforced mylar cloth which seems good stuff. A sloop (jib and main) with a square top or near so main probably gets the most area for the weight. A pole mast is generally lighter than a wing section IME.

[Andy P]

The A-class cat rigs are very light.

They are 9 m tall with carbon wing mast and tall square top mylar sail ( main only no jib)
The mast itself weighs 9kg.

[astevo]

in the moths we have spars about 5.4 m long weighing 2.2 kg in prepreg carbon. we use a windsufer style sail of 8 m^2 but many guys in the UK are using bolt ropes which are probably similar weight, but i favour the windsufer rig 'cos of the low drag and clean leward side of the mast /sail join.
it could probably be argued that a rig with a carbon spar and a single jib could be made lighter but i wouldnt go there due to the practicalities.

[grob]

Astevo,

This is exactly what I wanted to hear!

Do you have any more info on these rigs or know if these kind of rigs can be purchased in the UK.

Cheers

Gareth
www.fourhulls.com

[astevo]

http://www.moth.asn.au/pocket_luff.html
this one is a good bit of info about why they work. by thorpie the man whos developed the rigs for most of the moths in the world.

http://www.moth.asn.au/yellow_pages.html
this one shows all the austlaian buisnesses.

in the uk ther are several sail makers but have a look at the uk moth website
http://www.int-moth.org.uk/

there are plenty of other sailmakers around who have made them but if you are going for something a little weird, go to somebody who has made succesful ones before as there are a few little tricks to getting them right.

[CT249]

With respect to astevo (who knows As and Moths), wouldn't an A Class rig be a more suitable model? Surely the fact that the "A" rigs are so much heavier is due to the fact that they are much larger, taller and under more load? Isn't the cunningham on a cat rig much more loaded than those on a Moth rig and isn't the resulting compression a significant factor inthe extra weight of the A mast? Are they not closer to what you need for a 16' cat?

Or do you reckon the round tube/camber inducer/pocket luff setup is lighter than the wingmast and conventional sail?

[CT249]

By the way, what's with the high tech 16' cat? Is it a Formula 16 HP?

The boats that is probably the fastest F16 in the world just uses an alloy mast and Pentex sails, but that's partly because it's also a one design Taipan 4.9 with added kite.

[tspeer]

The lightest rig for a given area has to be a kite!

[Wardi]

Total rig weight is not so easy to define. The catamaran and Moth rigs being discussed actually use the hull for carrying vang and mainsheet loads. This makes the mast, boom and sail light, but does not take into account the full weight of the entire rig structure, which includes the hull to some extent. In the case of the A class catamaran, you should include the weight of the entire traveler system and its supports, which is quite a lot!!
I think a swing rig with through boom is the lightest fully contained rig in which all loads are distributed within the rig itself.

[astevo]

remember thats grob's initial request was for the lightest rig, period.
when the a class mast weight at 9kilos almost 7 kilos more than a moth with only 25% more sail area. sure they may have a bit more load but surley not over 4 times as much. remember how wige the staying angle on cats is (both to the side and how far back the shrouds are), it gets even wider when the skipper is on the wire and the windward shroud goes slack.

[CT249]

re "grob's initial request was for the lightest rig, period."

Sorry, you're right, I forgot that bit. I don't think the As can be over-built; they did something like 6 masts in one day at the last nationals! Perhaps it's a demonstration of the weight superiority of the Moth's round tube section? Or is it the A's vastly superior upwind pace in a breeze "cubing" the wind pressure and therefore loads? There are some smart guys in As....

A sailboard rig is as light as a Moths (?) and the wishbone means that there is no vang load and a very light mainsheet load. Whack some stays to the boom like Kovesi (?) did and voila!