junk rigs

[geoffr]

Iwant to own a junk rigged yacht suitable for extended singe handed ocean cruising. My thoughts are to go to Hong Kong and buy a traditional boat. All the literature I have read (Hasler etc) talk of junk rigs on western hulls.
Is there anything wrong with cruising in a chinese junk hull? Eg. can they self right from a knockdown without having any significant keel depth?

[Wellydeckhand]

MMMMmm............ depend wat type of junk u wanna built. Cargo and travelling home type differ.
Remember this it is stable but not intented to be a fast sail. It would take ages for u to travel the world........ but enough room for your family and pets.
A real junk was intented for trade travel in group to foreign land........ carry lots of cargo and humans labour.......... pig tails.
It will be a good boat house that can move into river....... some withstand typoone but i would not recomment it.
I would suggest a multi-hull.......... fast and room to spare.

But then again.......... choice is in your hand........ check it out in HongKong will be nice........ Ap Liu Chou......this place have boat maker(traditional)

[Ari]

Here is a site about junk rig boat name Naga Pelangi.
http://www.users.bigpond.com/parryn/html/engl.htm

[FAST FRED]

The usefullness of the junk rig is in its ability to be constructed of very low cost low, load materials.

One would assume that more than used flower or rice sacks would be avilable to a world cruiser.

The loss of windward performance is too great a handycap for any cruiser.

The Chinese ONLY blew downwind , with an occasional broad reach, great for semi anual monsoon commmerce , useless on a world voyage.

A modern Cutter rigged boat with a full battened main is the easiest and simplest to single hand.
Tracks well during sail changes and goes to windward like a proper cruiser.

Downwind, roller twins on 2 poles , and back to the sack.

Most racing boats are real pigs as there designed to have a low "rating" and not sail as poorly as their rating suggests.That's the way to win.

But the cruising boat can be built for the requirements of ocean sailing with NONE of the sillyness or expenses of a rated boat.

LOTS of sail area , thats easy to strike ,makes for the fastest voyages with least single hander effort.

Bon Voyage!

FAST FRED

[Milan]

Talk to Thomas Colvin, he designed and extensively sailed many different types of Chinese junks. Some of them are for open sea and some of those are quite fast according to T.C.

http://www.thomasecolvin.com/chinese_junks.htm

Milan

[Wellydeckhand]

Originally Posted by Ari

Here is a site about junk rig boat name Naga Pelangi.
http://www.users.bigpond.com/parryn/html/engl.htm

Nice......... beautiful...........

Is the wood any harder from kayu ulin of Borneo?

The ship should be compare with the Bugis junk PINISI would be interesting.

[Ari]

The wood is better than ulin.. Ulin is real hard and heavy.. but those Toredo could'nt careless about it..they love Ulin..Chengal are Toredo free..In Malaysia Ulin are called Belian (Diamond).Minus those worm..Ulin will survive for a few hundred years in an open to nature environment.The choosen wood for Tuai rumah and warriors tomb (something like totem pole).Those boat builders from Trengganu do converse in more or less same slang with the Bugis from Indonesia..posibbly from the same clan..! :d

[Milan]

Originally Posted by FAST FRED

...The Chinese ONLY blew downwind , with an occasional broad reach, great for semi anual monsoon commmerce , useless on a world voyage...

Fred, I agree that today would be better to use advantages of low stretch sail materials, and efficient sail plans. If priority is keeping the costs down, the most cost effective is to buy oversized second hand sails and re-cut them. (For those of us who are fortunate to live nearby developed sailing areas).

But talking about junks, I think it's a mistake, (very oftenly made), to generalise about them on the basis of just a few types, most commonly seen today. Junks, is just a very general name for hundreds of very different types of traditional Chinese boats. There used to be an enormous variety of different types, each one of them specialised for specific usage. Not all Chinese vessels were built for maximum load carrying and seasonal sailing in the direction of the prevailing winds. They also sailed many lightly loaded, lean and swift types, manoeuvrable, relatively fast and weatherly. Some of these boats were actually best windward sailing boats of their age. At the time, sails of the western boats were made of very stretchy flax. Battened Chinese sails kept their shape better and sagged less. Chinese also used high aspect ratio dagger boards for aeons.

Milan

[Wellydeckhand]

Bugis.......... is what nightmare in western urban culture are made of.

When westerner got rape n rob from olden days in high sea, surviver couldnt spell their pirate name so bugis somewhat turn into the word "Boogy Man"...... Believed it or not......... Bugis played a big... big..... role in South Philipine, Malaysia and Indonesia,......... even to China and Kambodia.

[terhohalme]

Got one, and it works well.

[Ari]

Welly for sure you know now that Bugis is actually the Viking of the east.. can't help it my clan do got it from them Boogey man..thats bygone days..a few of our kings are Bugis..and they know sailing better than any other clan..they still built boat the way they had done it eons ago..mixing the Dutch,Portuguese,Arabs,Chinese way of construction..and put in French name..ahh..Phinisi.The seven sail Indonesian Schooner..The one that built in Malaysia normally utilised junk rig.. and they sail the world.

[Wellydeckhand]

Originally Posted by terhohalme

Got one, and it works well.

Great sail....... Love the design.........

[Wellydeckhand]

Pirate in Asia are actually Arab and Bugis doin the orgy in the sea........... the rest of Asia are quite sane...

[Wellydeckhand]

Here are some of the rig in Junk Boat..................... HELP YOURSELF

http://www2.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/..._sail.html#Top

[loco]

Are boats like this still made?