Hartley TS16

[David Fouche]

I am busy restoring a Hartley TS16. I plan to learn to sail on her. I have completed all the exterior of the yacht and am now facing questions about floatation and rigging, etc as I proceed into the cockpit and cabin. The TS16 is supposed to be "unsinkable" - that's what they said about Titanic (to quote my wife). The plans I purchased say nothing about floatation requirements.

The second thing that confuses me is that there is no way of locking the swing keel into position once it is down. I understand that there is a lateral force acting on the keel as you sail, but what happens in a knock down or, even worse, a capsize? (Apart from getting wet obviously).

I'd appreciate any advice anybody could offer.

Cheers
Dave

[MarkC]

Have you tried asking the New South Wales Hartley (Australia) association? or the New Zealand Hartley association - I did notice on the NSW site that they have a great manual on Hartley use and safety - especially what sail techniques to use in hight winds. I have forgotten the URL but Google.com.au would find it.

I've just finished restoring my Hartley, floatation can be installed in a couple of ways

1. Water tight tanks fore and aft or
2. Solid bouyancy

I used the 2nd method as it is difficult to install water tight tanks (forward tank needs to be larger than aft tank) or boat will float stern up. Also creates a weight problem as I race my boat and tanks require extra timber / glass.

The tanks also have a complication of drainage as you need to run separate drain pipes to the rear which works out to a minimum of 3 - one for front tank, one for rear tank and one for remainder of boat. My boat originally came with tanks but they were to difficult to repair and opted to rip them out.

The floatation material I used was pool noodles - these are a high density neoprene type material in a spagetti shape approx 75-100 diameter and 1.2 to 1.5 metres long. The other alternative is styrofoam but this is a very messy material to work with.

Approximate volume (from memory) is 0.3 of a cubic metre (5 cubic feet) as a minimum but dont go overboard as it is reported that to much bouyancy makes the boat difficult to right.

With solid bouyancy you must fix the floor and supporting timbers very securely to the frames as the bouyancy can pop the floor up.

The boat should float at gunnel height without bouyancy, with bouyancy the idea is that it will float high enough to sail and drain itself. for this you need to have a self draining cockpit (not cabin).

As far as securing the keel, the only time that it should be locked down is if you are in conditions where a capsize is possible (say over 20-25 knots). All you need is a line attached to the top of the fin (where your pulleys attach to the top of the fin) and a jam cleat at the back of the fin case. When the fin is down just lock the line in the jam cleat. (this mechanism has just become a class rule in the Australian Hartley Association).

Under normal conditions the fin will not kick up even if you hit the bottom. The locking device is to ensure the fim does not go back inside during a capsize as it is difficult to get it back out and right the boat.

Hope this is some assistance to you. I can be emailed at jhorler at ozemail dot com dot au if you have any other questions.

Thanks
John

[john holloway]

I brought a hartley ts 16 that was partly stripped out, The previous owner had filled the tanks and under floors with empty, but sealed 2 and 4 litre milk bottles. After replacing the gyprock screws that he used fix the floors down. I checked with a few boat builder/repairers and they agreed that milk bottles or similar were an excelent idea, to use polystyrene needed a lot lot of cutting an chopping, 2 pot urathane needs a lot of preparation, and you cant control the expansion rate. So a visit to the local cafes got me, in a couple of weeks 10 full garbage of free flotation.

[Ian Ridley]

Originally Posted by john horler

I've just finished restoring my Hartley, floatation can be installed in a couple of ways

1. Water tight tanks fore and aft or
2. Solid bouyancy

I used the 2nd method as it is difficult to install water tight tanks (forward tank needs to be larger than aft tank) or boat will float stern up. Also creates a weight problem as I race my boat and tanks require extra timber / glass.

The tanks also have a complication of drainage as you need to run separate drain pipes to the rear which works out to a minimum of 3 - one for front tank, one for rear tank and one for remainder of boat. My boat originally came with tanks but they were to difficult to repair and opted to rip them out.

The floatation material I used was pool noodles - these are a high density neoprene type material in a spagetti shape approx 75-100 diameter and 1.2 to 1.5 metres long. The other alternative is styrofoam but this is a very messy material to work with.

Approximate volume (from memory) is 0.3 of a cubic metre (5 cubic feet) as a minimum but dont go overboard as it is reported that to much bouyancy makes the boat difficult to right.

With solid bouyancy you must fix the floor and supporting timbers very securely to the frames as the bouyancy can pop the floor up.

The boat should float at gunnel height without bouyancy, with bouyancy the idea is that it will float high enough to sail and drain itself. for this you need to have a self draining cockpit (not cabin).

As far as securing the keel, the only time that it should be locked down is if you are in conditions where a capsize is possible (say over 20-25 knots). All you need is a line attached to the top of the fin (where your pulleys attach to the top of the fin) and a jam cleat at the back of the fin case. When the fin is down just lock the line in the jam cleat. (this mechanism has just become a class rule in the Australian Hartley Association).

Under normal conditions the fin will not kick up even if you hit the bottom. The locking device is to ensure the fim does not go back inside during a capsize as it is difficult to get it back out and right the boat.

Hope this is some assistance to you. I can be emailed at jhorler at ozemail dot com dot au if you have any other questions.

Thanks
John

That's very interesting, i have just decided to do the same and was hoping i wasn't first. How many noodles did you decide on and where did you place them? I am just restoring on old TS with wooden mast and boom but am changing to new aluminium, do you have a buoyant mast?

[safewalrus]

I thought Hartleys made Jam?