Flying Canting Keel-Extraordinary Innovation!

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Doug Lord, Jan 3, 2010.

  1. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    That's why sandbaggers have a large burly crew.
     
  2. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    Cheaper too, I suspect. It would also be simpler to use a bigger hull or a motor. But in a race, the rules rule and the losers drool ... until the rules are changed to save lives, chopped off fingers (in this case), money or derision from the rest of the sailing community.

    It’s worse than that. Since the weight is suspended low down in pendulum fashion, it actually takes more energy to extend it to one side as the weight must be raised against gravity. Not too bad at first but as it continues to rise there is a diminishing return as the rate of RM increase is reduced whereas the energy required - also on a per degree basis - is increased.

    From a practical sailor’s point of view the additional cost, complexity, risk and energy required to operate has insufficient justification, but when competing against others restricted by the same set of rules the performance improvement obtained from the application of money and energy is, one must suppose, worth it. There are glorious sail boats still surviving from 100 years ago: my money would not be on this one to do the same.

    It occurs to me that the same effect could be obtained using something that would operate like an aircraft's ailerons, at less cost and energy and with less response time when tacking. Doubtless it has already occcured to others and been implemented too. It would only work at speed but that shouldn't be a problem for long on a fast boat. Why not? Oh yeah! The rules, right?
     
  3. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    -and sandbags :)
     
  4. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    -----------------------
    You mean sort of like an IC with crew out on the plank or Mirabauds crew trapezing off 17' wide racks? They seem to work real well with no extra hulls...
    And the Moth is a good example of a boat that could use extra hulls but in the meantime is faster than most, if not all multihulls under 20'. Not bad for an 11' monohull.
    The idea on these potentially fast monohulls like the Lake Racer is to take monohull speed to a whole new level which may lead to a bunch of monos that are as fast as or maybe-down the line-faster than multihulls.
     
  5. wet feet
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    wet feet Senior Member

    Well Doug,your post referred to older or unfit/disabled sailors sailing a boat with movable ballast.International Canoes demand a high level of fitness and coordination,Mirabaud is probably not too far removed and Moths are exceptionally demanding.A friend lent his Moth to another member of his sailing club who then had a heart attack while sailing it-this was in the days of boats with thirty inch waterline beam.If you want extreme performance you have a choice,get fit or sail a multihull.Moving chunks of ballast swiftly is not the answer.
     
  6. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ======================
    Well, I guess we'll agree to disagree-I certainly think it may be part of the answer.
    The "turbo" version of my Trapwing referenced in the other thread- IF it works- would be self-righting and blisteringly fast and I would hope something like it-well engineered and well proven-could be a real speed boat suitable for disabled sailing or at least for me.
     
  7. Chris Ostlind

    Chris Ostlind Previous Member

    Now that you've spilled the beans as to all of the powerfully functional elements of this terrific new boat, when will you be showing us progress photos of the build, or shots of the initial testing on the water?

    Steve Clark is showing us photos of his brand new C-Class cat right in the middle of its birthing process http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=101656 and you want to be so secretive with the mind-blowing Trapped Wing that it kinda hurts to think about it.

    What gives, Bubba?

    Do you have as much to risk as someone who is about to compete in the ultra competitive C-Class Catamarans?
     
  8. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    not sure if anyone mentioned it yet but there is going to be a lot of resistance approaching the air water interface for that keel bulb to break through, that and the moment arm of that resistance is going to need to be compensated for as well

    just an observation
    will be interesting to see how they overcome all the various problems

    B
     
  9. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    You're right but thats true on most canting keels yet they have proven very effective. On the "Lake Racer" the crew will have a lot of influence on RM and will probably try to see that the keel is popped out of the water at the earliest possible time.
     

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  10. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    Ya I seem to remember a jump in resistance as an object aproaches half its depth below surface
    or some such odd ball **** like that
    most canting keels dont get that close

    just thinking about what might need adjusting as the thing becomes airborne
     
  11. BeauVrolyk
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    BeauVrolyk Sailor

    +1 for the bike analogy - clear simple and obvious - thanks.
     
  12. Fanie
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    Fanie Fanie

    It's called a trimaran. For guys that cannot sail :D
    You mono hullers owe me...
     
  13. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Reichel-Pugh 180 degree canting keel!

    Pretty neat design with an essentially flush canting keel that is designed to function out of the water. Appears to use a version of the CBTF system-twin foils to develop lateral resistance.
    Unfortunately, they had some kind of equipment failure today and she capsized. The owner says it will be sailing again in a week. This is trememdous innovation in keelboat design and can lead to major jumps in keelboat performance.

    From the Daily Sail: "With those parameters in mind, Ian put his always fertile mind to work: "I wanted a boat which would accelerate immediately when a gust hit, just as you experience with a sailboard. I bounced some ideas around with John McConaghy and then, when I sat down with the gang to talk through what would be the ultimate boat it suddenly dawned on me – a carbon fibre ring around the boat that would transfer the keel from side to side."

    The end result is a rotating keel yacht where the efficiency of the ballast weight is fully optimised. This leads to the yacht’s displacement being less than Grand Prix racing yachts of similar size (Q weighs less than four tonnes), while the righting moment is increased to what was previously only achievable in much bigger boats. In short, the power-to-weight ratio is fully optimised, and that translates into greater speed."

    http://www.thedailysail.com/inshore/11/58792/0/q-flying-bulb-canting-keeler


    More pictures: http://www.sail-world.com/USA/New-canting-keel-42ft-Q---images-by-Andrea-Francolini/84072



    click on image: photos from Sailing World(Francolini), Daily Sail and SA-
     

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  14. Fanie
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    Fanie Fanie

    Almost sure I saw something similar before... ?
     

  15. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

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    You did, you did-BUT it appears R/P beat Whitehouse(1st post) to the sailing part!(And to the capsize part). I think what they've done is tremendous if they can make it work reliably. I've regulary checked on the Whitehouse project and, as best I can tell, its not sailing yet. Based on the Whitehouse rendering I'd have to say I like the R/P version better......

    PS-I just checked again and the Richards/Whitehouse boat was supposed debut last year-can't find any confirmation that she did. But I found her name: "Stravaganza":
     

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