Cheapest 2 person sailing boat

Not forgetting the old Mirror.... still pretty good for it's length.

 

To me just one of those two requirements would rule out the PDR

if you want a cheap singlehander you might like to look at my new 2 sheet Duo, currently Wooden Boat magazine Boat of the Week

http://www.sailingcatamarans.com/in...ats-and-dinghies-/420-duo-10ft-sailrow-dinghy

But I wouldn't want to race it with two adults.

Richard Woods of Woods Designs

www.sailingcatamarans.com

 

You might want to consider the two larger cousins of PDR's, the PD cruiser and the PD goose.

The "cruiser" is a PDR stretched to 10 ft, by lengthening the station spacing to to 15 inches, and the "goose" is the same with the station spacing lengthened to to 18 inches. The advantages are finer bottom curves and greater capacity, along with greater length. Both would be considerably faster than the original PDR, especially with two crew on board.

As a racer, the PDR tends to be a one person boat.

With more than one person on board, they are considerably slower, as the chine rocker sinks deeper, and the bow corner tends to dig in.

The real issue here is not so much what boat to build, but how to build it. I'm sure we would all like to have a near maintenance free, epoxy coated, boat of yacht quality finish.

This drives up the price considerably.

No matter what you build to these standards, it is likely to cost through the nose.

The epoxy and the subsequent glass fiber cloth, along with all the fancy paints and the fillet compounds are what drive the cost up.

Is it worth it.

You bet.

But only if you can afford it.

If you can't, you need to consider work boat standards.

Out with the lighter, more fool proof taped seams. In with the timber chines, with screws, and prodigious amounts of roofing cement.

Or, in with polyester taped seams, along with semi gloss house paint, and constant vigilance against rot.

Even the GIS can be built without epoxy, if chines, clamps and cleats are added, in exchange for the filleted epoxy joints.

It will definitely be somewhat heavier and maybe not quite as durable, but may well prove to be much more affordable.

My next boat, if I ever have one, will be built to that standard. This is mainly due to my low income and the fact that I will most likely build a boat of my own, unproven, design.

 

Nope.

It's the bottom 10 inches that have to conform.

 

Upchurch: The OP said that he wanted a simple boat, low cost, had some shape, and had some "go". The GIS came to mind. There are plenty of others that would fill the bill of course.

The OP quoted some material prices that would make US buyers cry. His material was/is scandalously cheap compared to the 70, 80 dollars we'd pay for a sheet of 6mm BS1088 Ocumee or Meranti.

Now he is thinking of the PDR. It does not come close to satisfy the original want list but it could be a helluva lot of fun for a bunch of scheming, conniving, devious, engineer types. Engineer dudes are generally thought to be clever and resourceful.

One of the choices for a PDR could be the Sunfish lateen. Not long ago I rolled the dice and bought a new Sunfish sail on Ebay. It cost me $140 including shipping. Sure it is a Chinese or Sri Lanks build but it turned out to be a first class piece. Meanwhile a class legal sail, ( probably built at the same loft) is three times that much. Shopping carefully can save a bundle, a necessary trait for the impecunious.

 

Messabout,
The prices quoted were very cheap.
One way or another the cost of the boat you suggested would matter to him.
I was just asking what yours cost. You could also provide the equivilent costs compared to his materials, to see what the GIS would cost in SA.

Just trying to help him understand what a realistic cost should be.
Did you want to help?

 

I have built many small (14 to 18') boats for $100 or less, using salvaged materials and remilling the lumber on a portable Makita table saw (it could be done with an inexpensive circular saw too).

Using almost all salvaged materials I have spent only $35 building 14'x4'8" sloop with Tyvek sails. Though that took over a year of searching for and gathering good materials. I have built many full sized sea kayaks with good purchased materials and durable finish for well under $200. No reason why a sailing dingy should cost much more. the whole "trick" is to do your own lumber selection from the lumber yard and than remill to the sizes you need from larger wood, and to fabricate as many of the parts as possible from raw materials. it is easy to make some attractive cleats and pad eye from hard wood for next to nothing with a few simple hand tools. You do not need a lot of costly Harkin hardware for most small boats. the best guide is to look at the way small boats used to be built over 150 years ago when there were no catalog of costly hardware available, the builder had to fabricate most of the parts himself.

 

Looking at the often recommended Goat Island Skiff I see plans are 125 dollars, stock sails are now offered at 380 dollars. so that is already 500 dollars, minus hull or rig...

 

Upchurch; I do not have a GIS. I know some guys who have built one. They got by for about a thousand dollars US.

I have a little flattie skiff that is similar. I built it about 8 years ago and our prices were not as inflated as they are now. I used first class material in the build and it cost about $700 including a dinky little sail that I bought from Dynamite Paysons firm. I confess that I machined and anodized almost all the hardware. That would have added another $150 +.

The OP would be in good shape cost wise and even fun wise with the ugly little PDRs. The ugly duckling is far more stable than, say an El Toro. It is cheap enough that it can be consigned to the landfill if the fun begins to diminish.

One importand drill for economy, is to contrive a rig that needs a minimum of hardware because Harken and the rest cost a plenty. Jibs, cunninghams, barber haulers, traveler rigs, vangs, cam cleats, ratchet blocks, and all that stuff makes the total cost a signifigant part of the whole. Sails are a whole other ball game because you can easily spend six or seven dollars per square foot for custom sails here in the US. Maybe the sailmakers are a bit less ambitious in South Africa.

 

Oh that is interesting. As it turns out the SA sailmakers are actually a bit more ambitious, at about $300 for a new jib of 30 sq feet, $10/sq ft.....
I guess this whole thread then reduces to : cheapest sailing rig for two person sailing dinghy
Sliding gunter, balanced lug, cat rig?
I do very much like those cat ketch rigs like on the Core Sound 17...
Is there any one with a clear advantage between these three rigs?

 

All else being equal the cheapest rig is going to be the one that requires the least gear and the fewest spars. Which is almost certainly our old friend the standard bermudan. There are good reasons why its popular.

Don't forget that below a certain size, and I would guess 30sqft is well into that territory, sail cost is going to move from per square foot being a reasonable approximation in the direction of per sail being a reasonable approximation. It takes about the same time and effort to make three corners for any sail in the small size ranges, and that's going to be a substantial part of the cost.

 

A huge advantage. No need for a "kicking strap" (Boom Vang). No standing rigging (stays and shrouds). And boom can be clear of a sailor's head with out raising the Center of Area (CA) too high.

There are, of course, always ways to make an inexpensive rig expensive, and ways to make one with a reputation for being expensive, inexpensive.

The PD Racer fleet has tried just about every sail rig known to man, including wing sails. Almost all these sail were made of poly tarp or other inexpensive materials.

Banning expensive materials is the first step.

I would expect lower aspect ratio sails to work better with the cheap stuff, but no one ever accused the Leg-0-mutton sail of being low aspect ratio. It competes with Balanced Lug as being the most popular sail in the PD Racer fleet.

Usually competing for 3rd and fourth places are Boomed Lateen and Bermudan mainsail onlys.

 

If you want really cheap check out this thread for ideas -

http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/projects-proposals/100-boat-challenge-47423.html

 

... and this one: http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/projects-proposals/challenge-100-boat-12176.html

 

It is hard to beat insulation foam for 'cheapest' boat building material.
A wharram style cat with V hulls made from thin ply/veneer glued over insulation foam,
would cost about $100. Some drop cloth sails, twin unstayed masts windsurfer rig from pvc pipe.