Anyone know what happened to the foilers in the Texel?

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But I reported the facts accurately , I think, whereas you attempted to obfuscate the real story by implying something must have been wrong with the foilers. You do that sort of thing a lot in your attempts to diss many types of modern technology.
Like this typical "CT thread": http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/sa...ome-canters-foilers-quants-bol-dor-56450.html
And one doesn't have to look far to find more examples.........

 

Hmmm. I went looking at Texel results again because of Doug's complaints.

It turned out that this is the second year in a row when the foilers were beaten home. Last year the "seahugging" Nacra 20 came home first, four minutes ahead of the foiling Nacra 20. Another seahugging Nacra 20 was third.

In more than two and a half hours of racing, the first of the cheap and tough F18s was just 6 minutes behind the first of the bigger carbon foilers.

 

Texel 2015

Well, the facts prove that you are wrong. The winner, a Nacra 17, finished in 2:37:00.
Nacra F20 Carbon finished in 2:30:18 (if this is not a foiler then you are right) see here: https://www.facebook.com/Nacra-F20-Carbon-International-Class-1419580084948872/
Nacra F20 FCS finished in 2:34:03,
Nacra F20 FCS finished in 2:36:00



https://roundtexel.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/Results-2015.pdf

 

Not the same handicap for "carbon" and "carbon fcs" .I think Carbon has C foils. The winners in 2015 were quite decent sailors , as they represented the Netherlands in Rio

 

Over the past five years, there have been 550 Moths, 400 A Class, and probably a couple of score of big foiling multis launched. That's enough boats for about 1300 active sailors, assuming that one different person takes each crew position. They have been involved in at least two "catastrophic injuries", namely one death and one amputation.

That is a annual rate of one catastrophic injury per 3,250 participants, compared to sailing's normal annual rate of one catastrophic injury per 20,000 participants according to Charles Tator's work on sports injuries. If we use Prof Nathanson MD's figures on the annual death rate among sailors (0.35 per 100,000 sailors) then the foilers look very bad indeed by comparison to normal craft.

Of course, we are dealing with a very small sample size. However, that works both ways. Most of the foilers are also doing inshore racing, which is safer. But the overall tendency appears to be clear, and only the most biased people would claim that there is evidence that foilers are as safe as conventional craft.

A lot of the sailing I do is quite dangerous. No one is saying that people shouldn't sail dangerous craft. However, if we are discussing whether claims that "the future of sailing is written in three dimensions" or "the foilers are the future" are right, then we can't ignore the possibility of higher risks.

 

Yes, I am right. I quite clearly stated "came home first", which doesn't mean the winner on Texel yardstick. Both the designation of the boat that came home first and (as Jonas noted) the handicap indicate that it was a non-foiling Nacra 20 carbon.

 

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A ludicrously small sample size........

 

Yes, Doug, which means that it is just as ludicrous for you to claim that there is evidence they are just as safe.

 

You're right, Jonas, it is just marketing. But if the marketing guys are free to spew biased BS out there (whether it's for high performance dinghies, fast multis, funboards, whatever) then the rest of us are free to try to correct it.

Much of the marketing of some types of sailing seems to be negative, which (as I understand it) is not just poor marketing for the vendor, but can also harm the general image of the sport. My whole problem with this sort of rubbish is that it's disrespectful of other craft and of the people who prefer them.

Fast craft are great (which is one reason I sail them myself) but to attack our own sport by claiming that other types are not part of its future is unimaginative, insulting and arrogant.

 

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I didn't claim that. And that you would say I did is very telling.......

 

https://youtu.be/nfBumbfPpnM Old video, but it seems like the nacra fcs needs some breeze to start foiling

 

When it was noted that foilers were more dangerous, you said you would bet that claim was not correct. The only way that the claim "foilers are more dangerous" could be incorrect (as you claimed) was if they were just as safe, or safer.

If there is not enough information to demonstrate that foilers are more dangerous then there is also not enough information to bet that they are just as safe or safer.

Anyway, I'll put you on ignore and just keep on presenting the other side of the biased stuff that comes out.

 

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Thats why some companies are investing in designs that allow their foilers to take off in very light air. The Q23 starts to foil in around 5kts of wind, the Whisper cat in 4 kts.

 

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Please, please do- especially if you actually believe what you just said!

 

It's entertaining to watch these threads. The first page has interesting stuff, the rest are a bunch of insults being thrown between Doug and everyone else. Enjoy folks! I think I'll go sailing instead or spend more time on my FEA analysis of the main cross-beam.