I think she is a beauty

[dskira]

Originally Posted by PAR

I think you have to compare apples to apples. In her day, how well did she stand out or account for herself? Strictly from an aesthetic view point, styling is market driven and those spending the money want Clorox bottles. I think if you look at just custom designs, where aesthetics are carefully matched to client desires, you'd see a much high ratio of "classic" lines, compared to contempory styling. Very few of my clients want an "out of the future" look to their yacht. Most use terms such as stately, dignified and timeless, often voicing a concern about not wanting her to look "dated" in a few years.

I don't think it's fair to say she's better then modern yachts of similar arrangement. I think of this much like I do cars. Yes, a 1934 Cadillac is a pretty thing, but I wouldn't want to own or drive it compared to a modern Cadillac. Sure the styling is "modern" but you also have anti-lock brakes, cruise control, A/C and air bags to replace the leather cover piece of 1934 steel I'd bang my head on in an accident, instead of the modern air bag. Yachts are the same. Yes, you can retro fit the "up grades" but then some purists would be all pissy and they're partly right.

Par I can't say you are incorrect, yes the old Cadillac were not as good as the new one, that for sure, but old hull, very efficient hull are far better than the one we have now. The engine engineering made possible to push a shoe box the the planing stage. The hulls are going down the wrong path.
By force 6 you can't take a Ferreti, nor any overbloated crap, with a center of gravity on the radar, to take a ride safely, but yes you can take any well design smooth and efficient hull and you can go thru the worst with not pleasure (bad weather in a motor boat is always a bad experience) but more safely.
Now a modern shoe boxes need 1000 hp to push water, prewar and good design need far less power to not push water. Look at a Sunsikeer trying to speed up, it is pathetique.
The interior is so more important to sell the product on the showroom.
I am comparing apple and apple, you don't, boat are not airplane nor car.
Don't let the marketing crap taking the best of you. Battle for the good cause, efficient hulls, small engine, natural speed, no fuss, and let the gadgets were they belong, on the shelfs of Waste Marine, and the aluminum 5000 hours life span (if that) 1000 hp to the manufacturers.
I am not a old fart thinking of the good old time, I am a designer who know the difference beween crap design from a marketing corporation and efficient design by a good designer.
And as I said, a good heated discussion is part of the passion we all have for boat

Richard, thank you for the pictures. I love the exemples you show. Who don't

Thanks
Cheers
Daniel

[Tad]

I think you are talking about proper proportions, rather than comparing styling. The styling can be anything if you start off with reasonable proportions. The first picture in this thread exhibits really good proportions, but add a pilothouse where the dudes are up top......and it's all downhill.....

Whether there's a break in the sheer or not is just styling. For a long time I blamed the disappearance of breaks in the sheer on the early design software....now it owes much to the high cost of tooling. I think a break (or two!) adds distinction (differentiation?) and grace (styling) to any boat. But I don't think every boat needs a break in the sheer, or that having one will somehow make her a "classic".

An example of a modern break adding classic proportions (IMO)....



And a classic break....



Two breaks that work together....



A modern boat incorporating classic features and style......



A big break.....with a view to adding classic elegance to large motoryacht style.......I think the proportions are good for 165' boat, but the accommodation is not comparable to the current four deckers.



And finally a modern boat of really classic proportions.....again the accommodation is tiny in comparison to the investment, thus it's the owner's choice what is important.

[dskira]

again the accommodation is tiny in comparison to the investment, thus it's the owner's choice what is important.

I agree with you Tad, the owner choice when he knows what is want is important.
By classic I mean the hull type mostly, with the superstructure in accordances. Even with modern styling.
It is the shoe box hull with huge bluff bow to put the island double bed in the chain locker almost, which make me wounder of the sanity of the designer.
But the accommodation should (in a perfect word) follow the best shape for the use intended not the other way around as it is the trend.
I know that you don't sale without huges accommodation in a giving lenght, it is a pitty, because the result is huge engines, and finally the owner get so tired to pay thousand of dollar in fuel bill that the boat end up tied at the marina.
With a slander and correct hull, less accommodation perhaps but more sailing
By the way Tad, great design, I always admired your style.
I hope you don't miss Maine to much

Cheers
Daniel

[hoytedow]

Originally Posted by apex1

True classic.


and another "Svensk" ..http://www.loris.a.se/

Regards
Richard

It has a certain"rumrunner" quality to it.

[wardd]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...hn_W_Brown.jpg

my idea of a beautiful ship

[YuriB]

This one is for sale now

[YuriB]

Originally Posted by wardd

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...hn_W_Brown.jpg

my idea of a beautiful ship

May I inform you peers, that the thread opener Daniel Skira decided to quit his membership on this Forum!

Repeated personal attacks by some of our well known drivel and destruction experts, made him decide to leave.

We have lost a well respected NA with a sensible hand for drawing classical beauties.

A man of good temper and a sense for harmony and nice behaviour.

It is a pity that such people are pissed off here by two or three internet rowdies.

Regards
Richard