If the members of this forum....

[Polarity]

OK here goes
My vote is for a racing sail boat - I'm a sailor and cruising boats tend not to be too radical. I also have some ideas for a specific race if we go this way!

[8knots]

My vote is for a power-cruser. I am biased of course. And the limited knowledge I have lies in that style. Unfortunatly I would not be able to participate or contribute much on a sailboat. Probably will not be much help anyway but i will try! I hope this gets a little more attention than the design competition Jeff is/was working on. I was dissapointed at the little interest shown to the prject. 8Kts

[Polarity]

In case the poll and the explanation get seperated - see this post - but please don't forget to vote!

Ta

[Stephen Ditmore]

I like the new Transpac 52 box rule. For an example go here:
http://www.andrewsyacht.com/deshome.htm
and click on the top link on the left.

I wonder if it's possible to design a boat that could sucessfully compete as both a Transpac 52 and an IMS 50
http://www.ims50.com/
http://www.ims50association.org/

Of course it might also be nice to design an unlimited trimaran, or even a proa!

Somehow in the powerboats I'm more into fast ferries than yachts right now, but I might get into the idea of a small commuter boat that could be used year 'round. In fact, perhaps that should be a theme - combining performance with comfortable year 'round use - a small boat for all conditions. It could be sail or power.

[duluthboats]

Interesting idea, but haven't you heard the one about to many cooks spoiling the stew. LOL!! Me, I voted power-cruser. But I'm into quiet, simple, and economical. I'm also an amature when it comes to design. Whatever you settle on you can bet I'll put my $.02 in.
Gary

[Stephen Ditmore]

Actually, I'm getting into the idea of a power cruiser, too, after sleeping on it. Jimmy (James M., son of James S.) Krogen used to talk about designing a "trailerable trawler." I think the idea's interesting, and fits with my interest in year-round use. In fact, I'm tempted to put on the client hat right now and propose a boat to 8Knots, or anyone else.

The idea would be a displacement motor sailor about 26' x 8'-6" stabilized by water ballast that would be drained to lighten the boat for trailering. It need only sail downwind, when "I" feel like turning the engine off and quietly birdwatching. I'll motor to windward. The mast(s) should cantaliever like on Bolger's designs. She should be shoal draft enough for gunkholing but seaworthy enough for an outside passage. Primary use to be circumnavication of New York State by river, canal, Lake Ontario, St Lawrance Seaway, Lake Champlain, Lake George, and back down the Hudson in Autumn. Standing headroom in central pilot house. In the trunk cabin forward I want to wear a bo'sun's chair and suspend myself in a sitting position from a level track in the overhead while preparing meals. I think 4'-11" headroom would be right for this. I want to be able to erect a clear standing headroom enclosure aft when at anchor, but strike or close it when underway. I see no nead for a cockpit in the usual sense, but would like a flush aft deck (when enclosure is closed) with outside seating built into the railings. Comfortable double berth under the deck - cushions fold against sides and berth becomes cabin sole when deck is openned under enclosure. For inspiration I like the boats at
http://www.cmdboats.com/smlboat.htm
and
http://www.devlinboat.com/
I see it being powered by a Westerbeke diesel turning an AutoProp. I'd consider a "kitchen rudder"
Kitchen rudder
but would also consider a 4 cycle gas or Yanmar diesel outboard. I invite discussion of construction method and all details. Want to take me up on the challenge?

[Stephen Ditmore]

These aren't exactly it, but they in the ballpark:
http://www.devlinboat.com/dckingfisher26.htm
http://www.devlinboat.com/dcsurfscoter25.htm
http://www.devlinboat.com/dcshearwater.htm
http://www.devlinboat.com/dccz30.htm

[duluthboats]

Well Stephen, you have my attention. Karl Strambaugh and Sam Devlin, are both high on my list of common sense designers. May I also suggest a look at William and John Aktkin's, Big Surprise. Or at least the Sea Bright hull form. A bo'sun's chair in the galley? I think sometimes it's hard not to laugh at a client. So do you have a material preference for the hull. Oh, just what is your budget sir?
Gary

[Stephen Ditmore]

I've said plenty, and am going to hold back a bit before offering my opinion on construction. After all, the idea is for it to be a group effort, not my assisted fantasy. What do you think we should build it out of? What's a reasonable cost target?

Concerning laughter, I find I laugh at the contortions people do when they have less than standing headroom. Why not move around in a sitting position suspended from a track on the ceiling?

[duluthboats]

Good point. OK, so if your going to trailer it, lets toss out plank on frame and traditional lapstrake. I think it would be a little large for glued lapstrake. So if the hull is to be wood then you have left, stitch and glue and cold molding. Both will give you a good hull with minimal tooling. Stitch and glue will limit the hull shape. Cold molding will add to the labor cost.
I’ll leave it to someone else to carry the water for FRP, or metal for a hull material. So what do the rest of you think?
Gary

[Polarity]

No one interested in a sail training vessel?, sail assisted Cargo ships , sail assisted cruiseliners (Club Med One/Two - Eugh!), sail assisted submarines - well maybe not. Sail assisted tugs ...

Just thought I'd ask...

Paul

[duluthboats]

Come on Paul, the only reason cruising boats aren't radical is that nobody has asked for one. This baby going to have a bo'sun's chair in the galley. We sure could use your imput. When we get this one done we'll move on to the kevlar proa with the carbon fiber mast.

I see many have read this and a good handful have voted. We can use some help here. Don't worry, if we make a mistake we will hear from one of the NAs that visit here. Stephen has stated what he wants, what can we come up with.
Gary

[8knots]

OK.
I am all excited now!! Here is my list of novice questions. First I do not know much about ballast tanks, but what if the vessel in question was of a v-bottom design with a fair amount of dead rise say 20 deg to keep the cg low when tanks are full. Then if need be when time comes to head to port drain them off. To lighten her up a bit maybe enough to get her to semi-plane say 12-14 kts? Will this be a production design or a one-off built at Capt Willy’s Lil boat yard? I am thinking glass or aluminum at this point for weight reasons of course and maintenance. The little added speed at the sacrifice of a little sea keeping would be a good selling point to the type of customer who would want this kind of weekend cruiser. The 9-5 blue-collar type “ME” The v bottom would help in getting the craft on the trailer too! She will be of shoal draft as Stephan suggested, reinforcing the semi-displacement cause and to help with keeping her profile low when pulling behind a truck and at sea. What SAIL… bah, give me diesel or give me death! Just kidding guys, At this point I would have no idea how to devise a sail plan or calculate sail requirements. So I will leave that to the brains of the operation! Although I can envision a brown Old town canoe with a gaff rig and a blue tarp for a steering shelter. Do not forget the Sterno stove galley and the 5 gallon bucket Thanks Steve for the chance to join in!! 8Kts

[Gades]

I think that I know more about sailing boats than power boats. So it'd be easier for me to help in a sailing design.
On the other hand, I wouldn't mind to learn more about power boats. I like the picnic boats a lot.

I don't know how much I could do, because I'm running late on my own project, though.

[Stephen Ditmore]

8Knots - I like your ideas, and I'd love to see a picture if you have the time. I'm not big on diesel vibration, though - I want the option of a sail when I want to move quietly and hear the birds sing & the water slosh around, at least for the next 10 years until fuel cells begin to be mass produced (Charles Allen, who was the senior draftsman at Krogen & Co. and last I heard was still working at Kadey-Krogen Yachts, couldn't get enough of diesels, so I'm well aware your kind exist!)

Polarity - as it happens I'm advising an effort to build a replica sailing vessel, though our idea is to seek full passenger certification, not sail training vessel status. I hope to have an initial design brief written in about a week, and we're looking for more people who want to get involved. The latest wrinkle is that Hubert Berti, associate of well known French sailing ship historian Jean Boudriot, is interested in getting involved, but doesn't speak English, so we're looking for someone to translate English-French. Would that be within your pervue?
See:
www.tallshipsacredromance.com
www.ancre.fr/index-e.htm
www.modelships.co.uk/Models/HMS_Surprise/