Slickest folder ever

Spidennis,

I understand the value of a GPS for speed, but how do you tell the wind speed and direction to back out the tacking angles?

While I appreciate Franks Kiss and "enjoyable sailing is best" approach, a few degrees more tacking angle at the same speed really pays off when going somewhere.

 

The only way to achieve a good reliable polar is through much work. Predicted polars are great but using a GPS and many hours of trimming to known sailing angles, combined with good record keeping will produce a real polar for software to work with.Then best sailing angles in a given condition can be predicted with some reliability.

 

Marc, while I definitely value KISS as an operating principle, I never do so at the expense of optimized performance. I realize I'm in a tiny minority by being a leeboard fan. But I am very confident in my boat's upwind ability. If you have "x" amount of board in the water, does it really matter much whether it's under the boat or alongside it? Plus my leeboard can be instantly adjusted to balance for maximum upwind performance without ever moving from my seat. Can most daggerboarders say that?
I'm going to post a 10-point list on my web site re the superiority of CORRECTLY DESIGNED leeboards. (Bad leeboards are a disaster. Ask me how I know. )Meanwhile, I invite anyone with a 16' boat to a friendly competiton where we will see -- with no ambiguity -- who can get upwind best. Homemade boat or production boat.
Fair enough? - Frank

 

Frank, I'll take you up on that , but it might be awhile. Being able to fine tune the gear while up against a semi known craft over the same course a bunch of times would be cool. My boat will have much adjustability in it as like yours it's very "experimental" . And I've been thinking lee boards as well, just for the safety factor and easy of use. Presently my hybrid prindle 16 is an asymmetric but the next one won't be and that'll require boards of some sort. A folding cat vs a folding tri, the world is waiting ........ but the monos could care less!

 

DGreenwood,

I certainly would like a primer or directions on how to generate a real polar as you say. Could you specify the steps? Thanks.

DIYguy,
Actually I do think it matters if the board is under or alongside, but I can't prove it. I'm not really a fan of daggerboards although one in the perfect position probably does better than a centerboard (which I prefer). Looking forward to your list. And your definition of "correct".

Wish I was currently in the position to take-up the friendly challenge, I look forward to reports of anyone who does. Would this really be Homemade vs production or just a comparison of different features?

 

"FRP Panels" is probably referring using a flat surface (glass is best, sheet plastic covering over any real smooth surface works) for the initial wet out and soft cure of a layer of fiberglass. After initial setup but while still soft, the sheet can be pulled up and draped over something to get a really nice smooth curved single layer fiberglass surface. If if is too floppy once fully cured, you can laminate some thin strips of wood on the inside surface to stiffen things up. Alternately, you can follow up with a full core (foam or wood strips are both choices) and another layer of glass on the inside.

 

Hey, if I get enough of you guys to take me up on my challenge, we could create our own multihull messabout. Now that's something I could really get into! And yes, factory builts are welcome, though I know Hobie Cats will always be able to blow my doors off. (But hopefully by ever-decreasing margins.) It's other small tris I want to compare to.
Prior to this discussion, I have never even heard the term "polar." Guess that shows how really new I am at this sailing biz. In reality, I had never sailed a boat of any kind just 3 short years ago. Since getting hard data about upwind sailing seems so incredibly complicated, I'll have to leave it to the techies out there. That much thinking is contrary to my sailing philosophy anyway. I'm in it for the fun! I guess I'll just have to be content to keep gauging the performance of my various boats by how quickly they pass "racing" dinghys and other monohulls.
- The whole FRP panel thing sounds kinda messy. Maybe it's for bigger boats and bigger shops? All I have is a two-car garage.
- Meanwhile, I'll get to work on my article about "Why I Love Leeboards."
- Frank (the DIY-Tri guy)

 

The Florida VMG messabout ! catchy ! lol
RR

 

upchurchmr
Developing Polars from real data for small boats is a monster of a task. I would suggest that you start with VPP polars for your boat or a similar boat and using one of the current racing software packages you could "tweak" the polars with real data in any areas of obvious discrepancy.The countless variables in trimming small boats with weight, sail, sea state and their susceptibility to tiny wind shifts, makes for a monumental task. However a dedicated record keeper can be rewarded with improved results on the race course or even just in the satisfaction of knowing your sailing is more efficient.
I know there is some free software kicking around the internet, but I am not current with the latest and greatest. I would have to search or ask around about that. I know I have seen at least one tutorial packaged with software but I don't recall which. Try Google?

 

DGreenwood,

Not a lot of help.

 

there is the florida120 group on facebook ....
not a race but more of a messabout, similar to the Texas200 also on facebook

 

G'day Frank,
I love what you're doing - good on you. I haven't read all of the thread and this may have been talked about already, I see talk about leeboards v centreboards, what about assymetric floats? This would simplify contruction even further by eliminating any sort of boards. I'm sure I've seen a picture somewhere of a Gougeon Bros. trimaran with a dory bottomed dingy they split down the middle and used as floats.

Just trying to think outside the square

Tony

 

How about co opting an existing gathering of boat nuts like Cedar Key or the Cortez meet?

Dan

 

Basil,

If you ever find the Gougeon trimaran with the split dingy please post a link. I am a big fan of theirs but have never heard about this boat.

 

G'day upchurchmr,

Maybe forget the Gougeon bit of my post. I have seen an old picture of the trimaran I've mentioned but now I think about it maybe they were not the designers. It may have been a part of an article written by them. I understand asymetrical floats (amas) were standard on Corinthian Trimarans in the late 60's. Not sure about how they would work on a small tri but the idea should work. But you may need a fair bit of dihedreal (I think thats the word), because it might be difficult to tack with all 3 hulls in the water. I believe this a may be a failing of asymetric cats.

Tony