Inspiration or insanity - ontong java/hans klaar

[Alex.A]

Seen this thread before - can i lash 2 canoes together to make a cat?
Well it seems that you can - they dont even have to be matched to each other!!
Go cheap on everything - rigging, the works.
Is it a cat, a proa or ndrua?
I see it is for sale - wonder how much? Also wonder what it cost to create?
Personally i think it inspirational.......

www.wharrambuilders.ning.com

[Milan]

Originally Posted by Alex.A

...inspirational...[/url]

Hans Klaar certainly leads an interesting life:
http://atomvoyages.com/articles/hansklaar.htm
http://wharram.eu//live//article.php...91211171038282

Or Glenn Tieman who was roaming all over the Pacific in 8 meter Wharram during the eighties and is now back at it in the very basic double canoe:
http://wharram.eu//live//index.php?t...80416175514782

[Alex.A]

Yes but those are"properly designed" boats - whereas the other isn't. I like the voyaging canoe concept - keep it simple and cut costs!! Boats have gotten really expensive lately and money is a whole lot tighter....
Crab claw rigs also seem to work well and again are cost cutting.
Maybe this is the way to go?

Wharram has been thinking of doing a 26'6" / 8m15cm version - wish he would as i'd definately consider that!
Tahiti coastal - larger version of the tahiti wayfarer.

[yipster]

Originally Posted by Alex.A

Maybe this is the way to go?

after seeing snow for 3 months now it makes me think that way too, than i see snowed in boats on their site also
do remember my boats, cost and adventures and younger plans if something like this may be the way to go..
when ready to go these boats have a lot going for them and sure look attractive in my eyes

[Milan]

Originally Posted by Alex.A

…Maybe this is the way to go?...

Yes, many ways to skin a cat… Work and save for years and years and dream about ideal floating home in the distant future that may never come, or simplify, focus on essentials, adapt to a Spartan living style and go now.

Glenn built his hulls in wooden strips and epoxy, lashed solid wooden poles for crossbeams, hand - stitched poly tarp sails and off he went to the Marquesas. No engine, no electricity, no radio, no furniture, not even portholes, only sitting headroom in the hulls. Paddling outrigger canoe for a dinghy. Total costs 14 000 $. He never goes to slips, marinas, services, nautical shops... so his budget is only couple of $ per day. If he losses a boat he can easily replace it and move on without major trauma of loosing life savings. Makes quite a lot off sense.

[Alex.A]

Sounds good but they wouldn't let me out of the harbour - in SA we have a hectic coast and need max saftey kit. Not always a bad idea - guess it saves the govt expenses in saving people.... but maybe over-regulated? Seems we're turning away visitting yachts and their cash with our approach too.
But then we do have the S Ocean and some hardcore weather.

[marshmat]

I say inspiration.

Yacht brokers find this hard to believe, but very few of us can even consider a boat worth over fifty grand. Yet virtually every boat marketed at long-term cruisers starts well into the six figures; standard hardware on even a simple yacht includes hardwood joinerwork, $200 blocks and $80 polished stainless cleats. West Marine wanted upwards of a hundred bucks for an LED nav light last time I was there. We've been led to believe that yachts must be expensive to be successful.

It's great to see someone proving that this does not have to be the case.

[peterAustralia]

hi Alex A.

Hann's Klaar's boat, is something that some people refer to as a tacking outrigger or a tacking proa. The plusses might be more simplicity than a catamaran, lower cost. Downside is speed will not be as high.

some more craft in same vein that may give inspiration can be found here

www.tacking-outrigger.com




peter E

[manobra]

Hi Alex, yea nice ideas get your self up to northern Mozambique. Up there you will find old boat builders and fine teak wood, you can build your hulls with them and change your lines accordingly. I’ve built a few dhow type hulls with these people; even now in 2010 you can still get the wood. I’ve been thinking about making a great big trimaran with my dhow and you’re an inspiration, thanks. let me know ur thoughts and i can give you a few pionters. j

[Alex.A]

Peter E - i see a melanesia in my future - just for the fun of it!! Experiment with steering oars and crabclaw rig. Wonder what 2 melanesias together as a cat would be like? Keep the rigs as is - as bi masted......
Manorba - no cash for big project yet but working on it. Dont know enough about designing to take on such a project yet.

[Milan]

Originally Posted by Alex.A

...just for the fun of it!! Experiment with steering oars and crabclaw rig....no cash ...

Have you seen Garry Dierking's designs?

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/garyd/

[Alex.A]

Yes - nice. Like the simplicity and low cost of the melanesia. Does anyone have practical experience of it?

[peterAustralia]

Hi Alex A,

Yes you can build a boat, afterall I was able to do it, so it is not that hard!

Two Melanesia hulls lashed together, yes that will work. I think James Wharram has some small cats in that size range already. Some of his Tiki cats are very small about 14ft or so. So something designed as a cat from start may be superior.

The rig you refer to, yes that is a biplane rig. Yes that works too. It has been used on a small cat called 'Miss Cindy'. Use google, use the boat name and catamaran and it ought to turn up. I think there were some articles on duckworksmagazine.com

Ian Smith built a small cat with a biplane rig also, He used two sailboard rigs as his propulsion. If you look at my website (earlier in the thread) you will see a link to Ian Smith (one with the photo link). On one of the pages in Ian's website there is an article on his biplane rigged catamaran.

So yes what you seek to do is quite plausible and seems to make sense.

See what you can find about, Here in Australia old catamarans are sometimes given away for free as people are upgrading to the newer faster models, or are outgrowing the ones they used 20 years ago. If you search on ebay in SA I am sure there will be some well priced small cats, or some second hand sails and rigging.

My suggestion would be look at what is about, work out your budget, work out what you want to do, where you want to go, and just do it. Do it now before you grow old and feel it is too hard! You can do it.

good luck

n peter evans

[Alex.A]

Hi - like miss c - and Wharram has done the tahiti wayfarer as outrigger and cat and is similar but 21' - with schooner(?) rig. My thinking was that with the boom as mast crabclaw, it might help with blanketting if the leeward sail was upright and the windward as close to the deck as possible.....

[Milan]

Originally Posted by Milan

Have you seen Garry Dierking's designs?

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/garyd/

Originally Posted by Alex.A

Yes - nice. Like the simplicity and low cost of the melanesia. Does anyone have practical experience of it?

Yes, Melanesia is also nice. It isn’t simpler to build and can carry a less load then Garry’s waapa.

I highly recommend Garry’s book. There are a lots of information’s there - complete building plans for 3 boats, very clear illustrations, detailed info on building in strip-plank and plywood. Sail plans and simple sailmaking for these boats, e.c.t.

I don’t really have a time for building right now, but some plywood sheets from previous projects keep getting in the way. Maybe I’ll throw it into something on the lines of Waapa this summer as a father-son project.