Hobby Kat

[Corley]

It would be interesting to build a set of tortured ply hulls for a hobie 16 the shape would be easily achievable and there is no shortage of soft hulled boats around. Has anyone had any luck digging up that gougeon bros article?

[redreuben]

http://www.dngoodchild.com/divide_for_sail_boats.htm

[redreuben]

Scroll down to build the hobby cat !

[Richard Woods]

My Quattro 16 is a stitch and glue plywood cat, it uses 6 sheets of 4mm (3/16in) ply

Similar speed to the Dart 18 and Hobie 16 but tacks quicker and more reliably. More buoyancy forward so less prone to nose diving. See a youtube video of the boat tacking on my website.

I know I can cartop a 16ft cat on our pickup truck, in fact I have done so. But I wouldn't want to car top it on a typical English car.

And you'll need a two piece mast for safety, if not to be legal

I don't actually recommend a Hobie 16 rig because it has a fully battened jib and a very long, low boom

Hope that helps the discussion

Richard Woods of Woods Designs

www.sailingcatamarans.com

[upchurchmr]

To each his own. I own years worth of Popular Mechanics and Science magazines - I regularly pick up one or two just to remind my self of the elegant way those magazines raise peoples hopes of some fantastic new design or breakthru, when a little different perspective showes the promises were never possible.

Very slick lies in fact.

My only question is how to spot the current set of Promises, snake oil, and flat out lies.

Marc

[GeNX]

I only hate to see some of the working hobie cat rigging go to the scrap metal yards because the hulls where too soft. Epoxyworks has no more copies but I am going to keep looking. Thanks for poping in Richard I love your designs. I saw a pixie on craigslist in Kelowna.

[bruceb]

On the for what ever it is worth front, Hobie used to supply "beach rental" 16's with roller furling/non battened jibs similar to the 18's. They really simplified boat handing and didn't effect performance very much. Hobie 16 rigs on "good" hulls make for a very exciting boat B

[upchurchmr]

Bruceb,

What "good" hulls are you refering to?

I have often wondered about the performance "advantage?" of putting daggers or centerboards in a Hobie 16.

Marc

PS what does it take to become a "Senior memeber" on this forum. I see to my surprise that I am one, and they don't know how old I am. Doesn't seem to take any demonstrated common sense.

[Boat Design Net Moderator]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

PS what does it take to become a "Senior memeber" on this forum. I see to my surprise that I am one, and they don't know how old I am. Doesn't seem to take any demonstrated common sense.

The default user titles are only based on post count; it allows certain features to be increased or enabled at a couple thresholds. You can change your user title to something more accurate or descriptive by clicking User CP > Edit Profile > Custom User Title

[upchurchmr]

Moderator,

Thanks for the answer about being "Senior". Actually it did not give me the data I was interested in. Is it a secret to know what is the criteria to become Senior?

Probably this is off topic. Please reply via private message if you don't want the information generally know.

I did review the Forum Rules after your post.

Another question: How would someone know if they are considered a habitual offender of the political correctness on this forum? I had one post deleted which I thought had factual information along with sarcasm. Do you let a member know when they crossed "the boundry"? In my case I would have never known the post was deleted, except I reviewed it after several days. I actually wan't sure if I had even made the post, for a little while. (I do delete some of the posts I write before sending).

[Boat Design Net Moderator]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

Moderator,

Thanks for the answer about being "Senior". Actually it did not give me the data I was interested in. Is it a secret to know what is the criteria to become Senior?

Probably this is off topic. Please reply via private message if you don't want the information generally know.

I did review the Forum Rules after your post.

Another question: How would someone know if they are considered a habitual offender of the political correctness on this forum? I had one post deleted which I thought had factual information along with sarcasm. Do you let a member know when they crossed "the boundry"? In my case I would have never known the post was deleted, except I reviewed it after several days. I actually wan't sure if I had even made the post, for a little while. (I do delete some of the posts I write before sending).

Currently accounts are automatically updated to the senior member usergroup at 100 posts. This number could change in the future, but that is the current threshold. (usergroup promotions allow some extra features such as uploading to the gallery without having to wait for the moderation queue, increased attachment limits, increased pm limits, etc.)

Regarding the deleted post, could you PM a link to the thread it was in? Sometimes there are exact duplicate posts (or threads) posted when someone may hit the reply button twice or some network issue happens and they believe it hasn't submitted but it has, or possibly from some mobile devices. When exact duplicate posts are spotted they are simply deleted on sight. Also if a post contains only an insult or jab directed at another member (e.g. "you're an idiot" or something along that line) it may be deleted on sight; if it becomes a pattern, you will receive a warning PM asking you to tone it down. Rarely but sometimes, if a whole thread takes a turn in an unfortunate direction and becomes a page of off-topic unfriendly posts that no longer have anything to do with the actual topic, the thread may be cleaned up with a simple note at the end along the lines of "this thread has been cleaned up; insults or off-topic jabs directed towards other members have been removed."

I do see your remark in Gimbal Cabin? but I'm not clear which post this refers to as I see your post directly above that one and don't find a log of a post from you deleted in that thread or this one. Please send me a PM and I will have a look. Thanks.

[upchurchmr]

Moderator,

Thanks for taking my complaint seriously.

I am not sure what thread I was deleted on. It might even have been woodenboat.com.

If it ever happens again i'll try to take notes.

Marc

[bruceb]

Some of us are "seniors" and write a lot because we can't remember what we wrote yesterday. (Just speaking for myself of course). But, there is a lot of good info from some of the other seniors Upchurch, I think Wood's cat would qualify as having "good" hulls. More volume forward, less rocker and lighter if built correctly, much more like modern high performance "beach" cats. Really, H-14s and 16s were designed as on and off the beach cats and were only expected to jump waves, reach well, and survive rough use. They still do their intended mission very well. Most modern high performance cats would not survive a day in beach rental use, and the Hobies could last several seasons. I have certainly abused a few myself, and enjoyed every minute of it- I just sold my last one earlier this year, and it was WELL used. B

[upchurchmr]

Bruceb,

I was only talking about myself as a "senior". Should have made that clear.

I generally prefer to insult people very clearly, if its unclear its just poor writing.

I have enjoyed Hobies in the past, my father wanted to get the "latest" sail number for the 14 we first bought, so we ended up with #6xx (I don't remember). I don't even know how many Hobies have been sold, I bet its very high now.

Hobies are great for off the beach, but they get used for everything else also. I have never used one as a classic "beach boat" just lake sailing. My interest was to see what could be done to make them go to windward better. It seems to me that an angled board, exiting to the inside of the keel line would allow the boat to be used on the beach (no jamming of the slot) and give better windward performance in the middle of the lake. The best of both worlds (except for having a board at all).

I just checked your facts on the Quattro 16. 10KG less weight, 28 sq ft less sail. I can believe the symmetric hull should be faster, just have a hard time with the skeg. (I liked my old broken down Tornado with boards).

If the performance is in fact better than a hobie, this is a perfect example of why I said the original poster should build something other than a Hobby cat (besides the blatant knock off).

Marc

[bruceb]

Marc, I once tried a H-16 that I put one board in an old hull. (I think a nacra's board), with mixed results. This was a one time trial and I may not have had ideal placement, but I was not impressed enough to put one in the other hull. It would make better VMG to weather and tack better, but but tacking the board from the raised tramp was hard, and speeds seemed lower whenever it was down. I think a boat needs round or flat bottom hulls to use a board's lift properly. I personally never thought much of Hobby cats, they were not very durable and didn't do anything better than a "real" hobie, and by the time you had purchased a good rig and parts, cost more than a couple of good used hobies. I was also a Nacra dealer, and they built both "racing" models- 5.2, 5.8, (board boats) and "beach" 5.0, 5.7, (keel boats). There were rig differences also, but they provided a fairly close comparison, and to me, there was surprising little difference. Boards had an advantage up wind and in light air, the rest of the time, the keels worked just fine and were very easy to sail, and were better for recreational sailors. The bottom of the keels, like the V bottom of a Hobie, could be thickened and survive some off the beach use and were easily repaired. B