Fastest Sailboat on the Planet!

even cooler

 

Hydroptère update

Like others, I don't have more info that the video available on their web site hydroptere.com.

The little we can see on that video, suggests that:
- yes they will have much more aerodynamic arms. This would seem to be the very minimum, given that ORMA tris have had aerodynamic arms for quite some time now. And may of us here had suggested that indeed the cross beams looked like they were generating TONS of drag
- they're currently toying w the idea of a canting rig. Now I think we here all understand the advantages of a canting rig (windsurfers prove it all the time) over a vertical rig because of the righting moment issues. Even if a kite may be the ultimate best solution, but that's another issue. Whether this was just them toying and showing this on the video, or whether they're working on it for real, who knows? But they had said they would be working on a "pure performance machine", and indeed a canting rig is something that suddenly makes a craft much less suitable for everyday sailing (windsurfers apart).
- not much is being done on the side hulls (at least for now), they look smaller on the designs and clearly less frontal area would be an advantage, but it is not striking in the video

Finally from another post on their site, it seems that they're indeed working hard studying cavitation at 53 knots - so whatever the final outcome, clearly they seem to mean it.

Two other comments:
- from another post it seems that they aim to have the craft ready to sail by March '08. Maybe not ready to beat records, but ready to sail
- the hydroptere.ch won't sail on Lago di Guarda in Italy (unlike what I believe it was Doug, wrote) - it will sail on Lake Geneva. Hopefully from next spring

 

More news from Hydroptère

A local newspaper published an update, after a presentation given on Dec 5th by the Hydroptère team, at the Paris Boat Show.

Main points
- team confirmed main issue is (was) cavitation, which they said became a major blocking factor from about 49 knots. (As most of you here will know, cavitation means the water boils due do depression, which 1.increases drag, and 2.reduces lift
- however, team said EPFL engineers have developped new foils, and a new "tail fin" (or rudder). And that computer simulations suggest these should allow to go over 50 knots, with a good margin (hence apparently all the comments on the site about "foils tested at 53 knots", and "simulations match reality very well")
- team confirmed the double beam would now be more like a pair of wings, thus reducing drag a lot. No comment made on whether just a skin around the beams, or a new structure. Or, whether these wings might be used to generate additional lift
- team commented about "optimisation of rig and sails" but no detail given. So we're left to wonder whether we'll see a wing, or whether we'll see a tilting rig as the video's final images seem to suggest
- team again mentioned a replacement of the side hulls but nothing substantial said about changes

It was confirmed that they expect to be back in the water by Fed '08 and to start making records attempts from "the spring" ie technically March 21st. But if this year is a guide, they could start sooner. Will depend I guess whether they remain in the Baie de Quiberon, or whether they try for another spot (some have mentioned the Mediterranean)

Team seemed very confident throughout their presentation, based on what numerical simulations have shown.

My take:
- just less drag from arms, various ropes, cables, should easily allow to gain 2 knots and maybe a bit more, at lower speeds. Which might mean 43-44 knots on the mile, maybe 45
- this lower drag, and the better foils and tail fin, should allow for instant speed say 4 knots above previous best, ie 51.6.
- whether this, plus improvements to rig and sail, suffice to allow for up to 53 (or more) top speed, as probably required to average over 50 over 500m, remains to be seen.

But obviously I wish this great team good luck!

 

Thanks ,Antoine-go get 'em Team Hydroptere!

 

Update Dec 13th: skin on the arms!

Just like many of us had guesstimated, the Hydroptere team are working on the arms' aerodynamics. We weren't sure how - completely new arms, or just a "skin" on existing arms - but now we know: they're adding a skin to the arms, to optimise aerodynamics.

Judging from the photos, the skin is thick enough at the front to be fairly solid. What's still not clear is how they'll do the rest - thick skin would be better to avoid the "distracted sailor goes through the paper-thin windfairing", but thin skin ie a mere cloth, would be lighter.

This being said the weight increase cannot be more than of the order of 100-200 kilos or rather less, which is small compared to the take of weight of 5 to 6 tons (depending on how much water there is in the ballasts). So it should not hurt, especially in record attempts where the minimum wind speed for take-off, won't matter.

If they hold the planning, it's only about two more months to go before the craft gets back to the water. As I said I continue to believe that 50-plus top speed is well within the reach of the improved Hydroptere. What remains to be seen, is whether we can see 50-plus over 500m (or more, of course ;-)

 

If the Hydroptere was bigger, would it go faster (on average), or would it's power to weight ratio become a problem? It seems like a lot of rocket science just to break 50 knots.
If it was me I would just sit back and chill out until the next big hurricane comes along.
(don't you just hate people like me )

 

Good question, and thank for the humour

Second bit first ;-) Don't even need to wait for next hurricane, guess free fall from a cliff might work also. Guess you could also argue, or have argued when people were trying to develop airplanes, that anyone could just jump off a cliff, and would go massively faster, and that would require no R&D whatsoever ;-)

Guess it's only when planes reached 200mph and more, that the off the cliff thing, became uncompetitive.

I like this example because it's mine ;-) - and also because, as in the case of the hurricane, I guess a difference is about control, and another about survival. For the time being the very fast craft tend to go so much faster than the wind (2x as fast or more), that this ends up being a problem ie like Macquarie then cannot sail in over 20 knots (though Hydroptere can) - quite a contrast w windsurfs who will do 50 knots (nearly) in 35-40 knots of wind, so closer to just being a leaf in the wind ;-)


Now scale, scale. Big question. Fluid mechanics is so complex that even people w access to the best computers, end up testing in wind tunnels and water tanks because they're not sure. There's a lot of data to suggest that bigger and longer boats go faster, in general. W quite a few counter-examples, such as Orange II going faster than Cheyenne despite nearly 10% less length, or Groupama 3 going faster than Orange II despite being 5 meters shorter (31.5 vs. 36.5 or so). Or Joyon's IDEC currently going nearly as fast as Orange II around the world, despite it being about 6 metres shorter and being sailed singlehanded.
So can the maxi-Hydroptere people have talked about, be built, and fly? Who knows.

Yeah Hydroptere is a lot of effort but it's this and others that are progressively getting more boats to fly and go faster, the Moths, the few first 18', etc.


But I like your hurricane idea - and in that case, better to go with a (solid) kite - better chances to get carried away by the storm, where Hydroptere might simply break?


All these guys trying to go fast, for the hell of it, whatever the means - it's just cool, that's all. Isn't it?

 

it made me feel nervous (almost) just looking at a photo of the Hydroptere in full flight....for that reason alone, it is very cool
The 'hurricane' principle still applies to the Hydroptere because to break records you need some luck from mother nature....that is, until the boat is too fast even for that.

 

And the modified Hydroptere may look even scarier! ;-)

let's wait until Feb to see it

 

More Hydroptere news: new mast!

No comments about a potentially canting rig - though my personal take is that this adds complexity and they may not do it.

Photos of the new mast: it will be shorter, and broader, ie a longer cross-section on the fore-aft axis. To judge by the photos (not easy given the perspective and the wide angle lens), the fore-aft dimension of the new mast could now be about 2 to 2.5 metres, vs. about 1 metre for the old mast. The old mast was 27m if I'm not mistaken, so the ratio length to height was 1/27th - this will now be up to 10% or even a bit more.

Needless to say, new mast means new sails - but it seems pretty clear we won't have a wing on this craft.

So so far we have, confirmed:
- new foils which are said to have been modelled and tested good for at least 53 knots ie cavitation-resistant (up to a point)
- a fairing around the cross-beam, to remove a lot of easy to remove drag
- a new mast with a much more wing-like front section
- confirmation of smaller side pods but w/o specifics

Let's wait and see. Hopefully less than 2 months to go before it is back in the water!

 

L'hydroptere 55?!

They're making progress:

 

Just a non-designer's opinion, but I was amazed that they could go so fast with the old beams, which were an obvious source of drag. With the right wind/sea conditions and the reduced drag of the new beams, an increase of at least 3-5 knots seems likely.

 

l'hydroptere 47.2 knots

Yes, the new beam is an improvement and the boat will be faster but ...... it is still not a true wing section with the cutoff trailing edge - there is still plenty of drag there as there is also drag on the ORMA 60 bras de liasson designs (except with Grouparma 2's forward beam which has material fairing over some of its span - but none on the rear beam and semi circular track) - and the sunken cockpit with the crew all sitting in a high pressure area (and not to mention the high seat and steering arrangement) is still going to cost speed. This is obvious, basic stuff you hydroptere blokes. And I've never understood why you lug about those large area, real draggy fishing net trampolines, good for bouncing about on but hopeless for aerodynamics. Don't get me wrong, Hydroptere is a fantastic craft and I love the concept but ..... there is some more refinement required. I mean, you blokes could be touching 60 knots if you were serious about slicing wind drag.

 

Back in the water!

From Scuttlebutt:
"L'HYDROPTÈRE BACK IN THE WATER
l'Hydroptère came back to La Trinité sur Mer marina this week after a
pure-speed configuration period of six months in the shipyard. l'Hydroptère
team took the opportunity of a quiet weather period to put the flying
trimaran back in the water and to remast her. Last season, the carbon bird
broke two world speed records. In April 2007, l'Hydroptère broke a first
record over 500 meters at an average speed of 44.81 knots and a second one
over one nautical mile, a performance which made her the fastest craft over
the last distance.

After this triumph, the team decided to temporarily set aside open sea
trials in order to concentrate on breaking the mythical speed barrier of 50
knots. Thus, 2008 will be devoted to pure speed. l'Hydroptère is now
specialized. In order to accomplish this, studies and trials have been
carried out by our team of engineers, in collaboration with the Ecole
Polytechnique Fédérale de Lausanne, prior to and throughout the entire
works. The rigging, the platform and the external parts have been finely
modified to bring the boat's speed potential over 50 knots.

The next few days will be devoted to a series of tests on the new rigging
and sails, and on the new textile streamlining, which has recently been
installed. L'Hydroptère will then be convoyed to Lorient, where she will be
transported by cargo ship to the Mediterranean. After a final phase of
assembly in Marseille, l'Hydroptère will be able to tackle her goal for 2008
- to become the fastest sailing craft on the planet. --"
http://www.hydroptere.com/_en/index.php

 

Hydroptere-50+ soon?

From Scuttlebutt today:
READY TO GO FOR FIFTY
On April 4, 2007, the team onboard l'Hydroptère beat two world speed records
ratified by the World Sailing Speed Record Council (WSSRC): An average of
44.81 knots over 500 meters, speed record in category D; An average of 41.69
knots over one nautical mile (Outright Nautical Mile) in all categories .
Both those records were set in an open ocean setting, and now with the
team's goal being to break the all-time sailing speed record and mythical
barrier of 50 knots , the hydrofoil trimaran has been undergoing
modifications that will increase speed and better adapt to an ideal, smooth
water course. The boat has just arrived in Toulon (South of France) to begin
this campaign. -- http://www.hydroptere.com/_en