Welding a steel hull

[Brent Swain]

Fairness of the chine , depends on how fair you cut it out , just like the edges of the plates on any framed boat. I've seen a lot of wavy chines on framed boats over the years. With multi chined hulls they would be above the waterline and highly visible.
When I sell someone a set of plans I have no control on how fair they cut the chine edges.
I could show you some pretty rough, wavy , fully framed boats designed by Colvin, Roberts etc. Being underwater, the only creatures who see it are the fish and I dont think they give a damn. It has zero effect on sailing performance. A German aluminium boat that did well in the one ton cup in Auckland in the early 70's looked like a bucket that had got caught in a buffalo stampede. They figured the weight of filler would cost them more performance than any advantage of fairing compound. They proved to be right.
If you have built one of my designs it wouldn't have taken you 7 years, when the shell takes only a week or two. All the welding including the fitting takes only 350 hours for a 36. To claim that that kind of saving in the steelwork won't save any time, is to lie like a mountie in a courtroom.
The big advantage of origami is that a fair , good looking hull can be built quickly and easily,anywhere ,without cover or any fancy tools . I don't see a shop around Tom's boat.
Wanna save some cash? Sell the farm and go cruising. Get your advice from someone who has accomplished what you hope to accomplish. Not from someone who is still trying to buy the farm.
Get cruising with minimal requirements , like a roughed in interior, bare plywood, then sail off and embellish it in quiet peacefull anchorages, bit by bit ,as the materials are scrounged, treating the finishing like a hobby and a pleasure, rather than something you have to do before you are allowed to get any pleasure out of your labour.
Jack Carson , all 6ft 4 inches of him and his tall wife sailed one of my 36 footers around the world, one that had been modified by lowering the freeboard by 5 1/2 inches , drastically reducing headroom, and the back of the cabin modified by standing it almost vertical. This made the hatch a total rathole to climb thru. This is why he likes huge boats. Had his boat been built as I designed it , he would have had plenty of headroom and the hatch would have been every bit as easy to climb thru as any sliding hatch. Then he would be more appreciative of smaller boats.
A veteran circumnavigator , he still wouldn't consider doing it any other way than origami.
What offshore cruising experience is your expertise based on Lazyjack? Isn't it time you went out an got some ?
Do yourself any anyone else that listens to you a favour. Go cruising. Sell the farm.

[Brent Swain]

Lazyjack
It seems quite obvious that the main reason for your troubles is your inability to think outside the box and your slavish clinging to group think.Group think is exactly what has forced the price of boats far beyond what many can afford and forced many others deeply into debt.
I agree, there is no excuse for a boat being ugly. A fair line and a beautiful sheer costs no more than an ugly one. If you start with an attractive shape, you don't need to throw a lot of money at her. If you start with an ugly shape , you can throw all the money in the world at her and she'll still be ugly. That is why I give aesthetics top priority in all my designs. That is why they are considerd by most cruisers as some of the best looking boats out there, no bondo needed.
Minimising the amount of welding , cutting and fitting required is an easy way to keep a steel boat fair. The more you have to do to a piece of steel the greater chance of distortion.
Helping an owner build a steel boat in his own backyard is a great way to go. No overhead and it keeps the costs to minimum. Origami makes this much easier, but there are plenty of backyard builders who need a jump start to get the detailing done. Give it a try and you may find you don't need the shop , overhead , etc.
Brent

[tazmann]

Mike welder/fitter Yes it was hard to see chines here is a couple shots
LyndonJ few inside shots
Tom

[tazmann]

Mike welder/fitter
Everything but the cabin structure was cut with oxy-accetelene, didnt buy plasma till after decks were on. Did clean and prep before welding together, took about 15 minutes per hull half and I would'nt do it without cleaning edges up first.
I cant say for sure why this one looks different compared to others the hull is basicly the same as the 31' or 36' but I did recut the chines a bit, when I first pulled it together I had a slight upward and inward hook in the center of chines so I used a batton and my eye to streighten them out.
The lines of the boat and cabin are from Brents plans the only thing I did different was narrow up the side decks 3" to give the cabin sides more angle and the 6" gained on the inside made a huge improvment for the interior layout I had planned.
Single or multi chine doesnt make much diference to me, depends on the boat itself weather it looks good or not. I do like the round chines though, If I do another origami boat I think I will do the split pipe or rolled chines.
Tom

[lazeyjack]

I really can only reiterate what I have always said, just easy build sweet lines as a tub
I CAN NOT SEE THE EXCUSE FOR UNFAIR CHINES. all you need is a long fairing batten to prove the lines BEFORE you cut
I have this one, proven world cruiser, originally desined by Robert Clarke(British SteeL and many other fine boats
I will GIVE anyone the plans,
I did not do the keel here, but scheel is very good for two reasons, keeps ballast lead low, and gives bigger footprint when hauling out
the 32 vs, was 7300kg with neaRly 4 000 lead, the harder it blew the better she went
She is flush decked, with small access hatch a real storm boat

[lazeyjack]

and the render

[lazeyjack]

and what could be simpler than cutting these out
Look I am trying to teach some of you guys, and read what one of you posted about me, in another thread, the rudder, thing
Some of you have the ability to build, but not if you will refuse to learn
the EUROS IN THIS SITE MUST BE SHAKING THEIR HEADS AT THE STUFF COMING ONTO THE FORUMS
aND THANKS TO THE coward who just left a neg feed without his name, well done, I hope taz was not you after I gave you pos, in here

[tazmann]

I CAN NOT SEE THE EXCUSE FOR UNFAIR CHINES.

On the loft floor yes but for first time origami builder working from measurments you cant very well see it. Does it look unfair here?
Was not me that left neg.
Tom

[lazeyjack]

looks fine
i,m tired of it all, mostly try just help good Luck Tom, I,m out

[Manie B]

Tazmann

looking good

i can see you could be on the water pretty soon

keep up the work pace - its fun anyway

[LyndonJ]

Thanks for the pics Tom
Great piece of work and very fair, the best one I've seen so far. Are those bottom transverses optional or part of Brents design ? And they have not affected the hull visibly at all.

Thanks

[Wynand N]

some neat hull and workmanship Tom

[Brent Swain]

Great work Tom.
I was thinking that maybe using the Scheel keel bottoms on the outside of the twin keels may help a bit going to windward. With twin keels , one has to be careful not to design keels that an anchor rode won't slip off. Experimenting with a model makes this clear.
I didn't design the transverse webs in. I have found them only needed for the twin keelers.
The combination of hull rocker and width of the single keel, comming together ,is all the stiffness one needs in a single keel ,as long as it is long enough.
Brent

[tazmann]

Thanks All
LyndonJ The transverse webs were my idea, worked out a little better and gave me somthing to attach the floor angles to. If you take a look at the photo album in origamiboats site there are quite a few nice looking boats there.

All in all the 26 is a fun boat to build, relativly simple and quick if you keep working at it.

Back to welding, one question that might be of use to the amature welder.
When welding sheet material together, say 12 gage and you need to weld two 4' x 8' sheets together end to end, whats the best method to minimize distortion ? gap it , V it , or other

Tom

[bigbear69]

just wondering if you are able to weld deck fittings/ repair work while the boat is on the water? Or will the current associated with welding cause electrolysis or something?
cheers