Teak Substitutes

[Steve W]

We all know how expensive teak has become, i no longer use much of it but on occasion its nice to use small amounts of exterior wood and its nice to use something you can leave to weather without setting yourself up for a lifetime of maintainance. So, i have been noticeing a number of south american jungle woods in the decking section of the local big box lumberyards that look promising as a substitute. There are 4 choices at the local store, Ipe ,Cambara, Garapa and Cumaru, all are hardwoods, clear, available in long lengths and very reasonable in price. I was wondering if any other pros on here have used any of these and have any comments. The only one i have used is a little Ipe, i made some 6 loop handrails which i varnished and they were gorgeous, however the stuff is nasty to work with and im not sure i would use it again although it would make an awesome compression post. I am thinking of trying one of the lighter ones to replace the toerails on my sailboat, maybe Garapa. Thoughts?
Steve.

[Submarine Tom]

Western Red Cedar: poor mans teak.

I use it a lot.

-Tom

[Steve W]

I love WRC and have used it for core in many composite hulls but much too soft to use for what im thinking. Im thinking along the lines of trim above deck such as handrails,toerails,hatchboards,steps etc,which would typically done in teak.
Steve.

[gonzo]

In South America several species are used instead of teak. It is difficult to say what species are sold under commercial names. Can you get the proper latin name?

[michael pierzga]

Locally. teak is so expensive that they substitute other tropical woods. The names of these wood..Ogabooga, Biggatwigga are so weird that I cant remember them. these weird sounding woods are used in high class exterior house and pool decking architecture. Talk to your exterior decking supplier. I see this..Ogabooga "? or whatever its called used in many restaurants terrace's. . Tight straight grain, limited checking...looks like the perfect stuff for imitation teak trim. Dont think Id try a teak deck with it...all these woods are heavy and dense, your boat might capsize. .

[Herman]

angelim vermelho could do the job. it is just as "tropic" so do not use it for saving the planet....

[gonzo]

Ruprechtia laxifolia (viraró) is used instead of teak. It bends easier too.

[Steve W]

There are a ton of species that we dont get in the US that have served the purpose such as iroko,what i am interested in is these tropical hardwoods that are readily available here for decks on buildings and are very reasonably priced,so here they are again, 1/Cambara,species name, erisma uncinatum.2/ Garapa, species name Apuleia Leiocarpa.3/Cumaru,or Brazilian teak,species name,Dipteryx Odorta. Im going to skip Ipe because it tends to be weak along the grain. Has anyone used any of these woods.
Steve.

[mrwright]

Originally Posted by Steve W

We all know how expensive teak has become, i no longer use much of it but on occasion its nice to use small amounts of exterior wood and its nice to use something you can leave to weather without setting yourself up for a lifetime of maintainance. So, i have been noticeing a number of south american jungle woods in the decking section of the local big box lumberyards that look promising as a substitute. There are 4 choices at the local store, Ipe ,Cambara, Garapa and Cumaru, all are hardwoods, clear, available in long lengths and very reasonable in price. I was wondering if any other pros on here have used any of these and have any comments. The only one i have used is a little Ipe, i made some 6 loop handrails which i varnished and they were gorgeous, however the stuff is nasty to work with and im not sure i would use it again although it would make an awesome compression post. I am thinking of trying one of the lighter ones to replace the toerails on my sailboat, maybe Garapa. Thoughts?
Steve.

Ipe, Cambara, Cumaru and Garapa are all good choices. You'll get the best longevity out of Ipe & Cumaru because of their hardness but they're going to be the hardest to work with in terms of tooling and their ability to take up any sort of oil, stain or varnish. Garapa is good if you need a lighter wood and cambara is ok but i wouldn't recommend it for an exterior application.

With any TROPICAL HARDWOOD you need to make sure they're FSC certified. Over the last decade especially, the amazon has been heavily exploited by timber importers - especially in brazil and bolivia. FSC (www.fscus.org) is the only 3rd party that can fully guarantee a tree's origins and whether or not it was logged in an environmentally sustainable manner. With domestic woods such as WRC this is less of a concern.

One other tropical wood to look for that is dirt cheap is purple heart. it's purple (think barney the dinosaur) when you purchase it but will fade to gray just like every single one of the woods above. it also looks great on decks!

best of luck to you and if you have any questions, shoot me a message.

[michael pierzga]

Yah..Its a shame that all those valuable tropical woods of being harvested so fast. Perhaps its best to use local woods, like they did for generations and accept that they aren't the best to be had.


When did Teak enter into the shipbuilding world ??

[mrwright]

Originally Posted by michael pierzga

Yah..Its a shame that all those valuable tropical woods of being harvested so fast. Perhaps its best to use local woods, like they did for generations and accept that they aren't the best to be had.


When did Teak enter into the shipbuilding world ??

i agree! i worked in hardwood importing for some time and today FSC is the only way to go if you're going to buy wood from far-flung regions and feel good about it. here in the NW there are several woods that are okay but with the advent of plantation wood, even cedar is less desirable than it used to be. today's cedar has big rings (rapid growth) and lacks the quantity if tannins/oils needed to have any longevity. old-growth cedar is much better but also carries with it the weight of logging old growth forest.

i would say that today for decking or trim with that natural look it's best to go with fsc tropicals. here in the NW Edensaw Woods is a great resource for affordable hardwoods SPECIFICALLY for shipwrights.

[Steve W]

mrwright,the lumberyard had some sample pieces you could inspect and i liked the Garapa for its lighter weight and color, we have miles of boardwalk along lake superior made from ipe and it weathers to a nice silver grey like teak, my feeling is that as you say they will all weather to about the same shade but i think any one of them would last better than teak as they have much tighter grain and are harder.I think Garapa or Cumuru would be my choices for a toerail.
Steve.

[mrwright]

Originally Posted by Steve W

mrwright,the lumberyard had some sample pieces you could inspect and i liked the Garapa for its lighter weight and color, we have miles of boardwalk along lake superior made from ipe and it weathers to a nice silver grey like teak, my feeling is that as you say they will all weather to about the same shade but i think any one of them would last better than teak as they have much tighter grain and are harder.I think Garapa or Cumuru would be my choices for a toerail.
Steve.

yes. that's quite smart i think. and yeah, teak's only benefit is that it's oily but it's not a hard wood - in fact it can be quite soft. best of luck to you on your project. hopefully you'll post some pictures as i'm sure it'll look amazing!

[michael pierzga]

My wooden boatbuilder friend tells me IPE is a good choice for trim and rails , but very hard to work with.

Originally Posted by mrwright

yes. that's quite smart i think. and yeah, teak's only benefit is that it's oily but it's not a hard wood - in fact it can be quite soft. best of luck to you on your project. hopefully you'll post some pictures as i'm sure it'll look amazing!

First,

Teak is a hard wood by spec`s

Second, it is a cheap wood over the lifetime of a craft.

Third, it is not replacable by any cheap lumber.

If you need to replace Teak on a newbiult, choose black locust. If you need to feel green, choose Teak. It is the longest recorded plantation timber. If you need to feel superior, choose Teak, it just looks better. (and sells accordingly)
If you feel to be obliged to save the world, use Paulownia and stay away from the harder timber.

Dreamers...........