subsitute fit out materials

[digger]

Hi guys, my name is Dan, and I work for a big boatbuilding company in Australia, and my job is to look after the timber machine shop and CNC processes.

Im currently starting to put the feelers out to see if I can cut some costs out of our boats by trying to standardise some of our materials. For example in our fit out kits we can have up to 10 or more different materials such as mdf, ply, marine ply, acrylic, pvc ect ect.

Have any of you had a look at trying to get down to a single material type before?

Im just thinking that cutting material types down will help with our CNC nesting aswell as our buying power with our suppliers.

Thanks for your help

[sabahcat]

Originally Posted by digger

mdf,

WTF

MDF as in Medium-density fibreboard

[digger]

haha, yep its still used widely in Australia. we also have asbestos sandwichs for lunch

[sabahcat]

Originally Posted by digger

haha, yep its still used widely in Australia.

Really?
cant say I've ever seen it used, in a reputable build, in my 29 years in the game.

Who is this big boatbuilding firm you work for that uses it in the actual build/fitout?

[digger]

i probably shouldnt say who i work for but they are quite large

we use it heaps in our boats, up to 8 or 9 sheets at a time.

has anyone used uniboard before?

[waikikin]

Originally Posted by sabahcat

Really?
cant say I've ever seen it used, in a reputable build, in my 29 years in the game.

Who is this big boatbuilding firm you work for that uses it in the actual build/fitout?

Hi Sabah, I've used it for templates(gotta be careful there as it changes size with temp/moisture) & in toolmaking, & seen it used on Mustangs on door reveals & window trims.Where I work now its not allowed even for templates
We got something in common, come 6th Jan 2011 I got 30 years.
All the best from Jeff.

[digger]

wow, you guys have really done away with that stuff.

i actually underestimated how much we use, it would actually be closer to 30 odd sheets of it in a 58 footer, i forgot about all our carcasses which are double sided white 12mm mdf.

it would be nice to get rid of it completely, nasty gear.

[Steve W]

Man, i gotta agree with Sabahcat, my son uses the stuff in cabinets for houses but i cant imagine using it in boats.
Steve.

[SamSam]

Maybe it's MDO.

Originally Posted by digger

it would be nice to get rid of it completely, nasty gear.

You should.

And you mentioned ply, and marine ply? There is no ply in boatbuilding, except marine ply. At least not, when quality is part of the building process. We even use high grade (GL approval) for bulking up our transoms.

well, not bookmatch veneered though.

Not to attack you, but your house has a quality problem.

It may already save some money to standardize your wooden sheets to marine ply. That would make it less painful to provide a proper quality.

Regards
Richard

[sailcat]

Originally Posted by apex1

You should.

And you mentioned ply, and marine ply? There is no ply in boatbuilding, except marine ply. At least not, when quality is part of the building process. We even use high grade (GL approval) for bulking up our transoms.


Regards
Richard

Hi Richard

some time ago it was talk about plywood. Why marine ply is a better for boats.
All of wood spec. used for marine ply are low or mod. rot resistance. Same as so call airplane ply which is made from birch. Do you have any proof (technical data?) or it is just tradition? In GL paper I don't see any better wood as birch, so what is magic stuff? Birch plywood has waterproof glue, no voids, so what is a catch?

[sabahcat]

Might be different elsewhere in the world but in Australia, hand selected AS2271 exterior grade hoop, with an AA face, shits all over a BS 1088 Marine, in my opinion.

Saying that, I am using (hand selected) BS1088 because it is considerably lighter, more than up for the job and cheaper.

Some of the crap I have seen badged Marine from Overseas, I wouldn't build a dinghy, or a chicken coop out of it.

[Steve W]

Sailcat,there is no majic stuff,its just that for most of us we cant hand select because we have to order from a supplier a thousand miles away and even if we could we could only visually inspect for face veneer,voids and construction but we still cant tell the glue quality until we do a boil test so we have to rely on a standard such as BS1088 and it works out fine,i for one have never recieved a substandard panel with the BS1088 stamp regardless of where it was manufactured and i have used ply from Aus,NZ,France, Isreal,Phillipines,Holland,indonesia and others. I will not use anything made in North America because i have yet to see a BS1088 panel and in nearly 30 yrs here i have not seen anything useable. However,i have seen Pros on various forums mention US made doug fir ply they like and would certainly be open to recomendations of specific brands and where i can get it to test (i like Doug Fir) As you say Baltic Birch exterior ply which is now available in big box lumberyards is very well made and if it passed the boil test i would not hesitate to use it for noncritical applications on my own projects if it met my weight goals and was well sealed with epoxy (which also applies to marine ply) Ive recently seen quite nice Radiata pine exterior ply sold under the brand Aroucco ply in the big box that is cheap and would be nice for building a dinghy. Bottom line though is use BS 1088 for any part of the structural boat and sleep well. What really pisses me of is when you pay a fortune for a decorative panel such as Teak or Teak and Holly cabin sole ply and it is just a paper thin veneer on a substandard piece of crap,why the hell dont they put a decent veneer on a inexpensive meranti BS1088 panel.
Steve.

[Steve W]

Oh,do any of you guys know if anyone is producing a BS1088 panel out of Paulownia?
Steve.

Originally Posted by Steve W

Oh,do any of you guys know if anyone is producing a BS1088 panel out of Paulownia?
Steve.

Me,

but as a sandwich of Birma Ironwood and Kiri only. Enquiries over mail only.


And forget about ALL the US ply products! Not for free I would even think about using them! All the latest crap, no matter which stamp they bear, just crap.

Regards
Richard