Restoring marine ply Yacht. Materials?? Please Help!

P.S.
Longliner,
Having only been out on her once, for a few minutes under power in a howling northerly when we took her from her pen- outside the marina and round to the crain where she was pulled out- I really can't say how she rides...
other than to retell one of the ongoing story's that come our way regarding the history of this boat.
The latest one I will briefly tell, and yes- it is from one of your favourite old guys, this time even older. As I have learnt to do now, as I was working up on deck in the yards where we have her, I noticed someone in a car cruising past slow right down and check out Altair, so like I say I have learned to do- I smiled and waved at this person. The car stops, and slowly out comes a lovely old man. He tells me that he knew Charlie Herrod who built my boat, and remembered fondly winning a race in her 40 years ago. It was the forty mile race around the perimeter of Port Phillip Bay (the bay that our city melbourne is on). The race was open to every sailing club in the bay, and this guy said that though by the finish line, they had blown out every single sail they had, Altair still beat the lot of them.
So from what we can tell and have heard, she rides very well, fast at the very least.
When we finnally get her out, after all this work, I shall certainly give you my own review.

P.S.S. what do mean by,
"be carefull and mast important,,,,"
Especially in regards to my last post about painting the mast?

Hans.

 

A long due update.

For those that have followed,
I guess it is time to give a bit of an update.

Pretty soon I am going to have some photos to post of the work we have been doing.

I have ended up pulling up the back 2/3rds of the deck, removing it up just past the first stays. Also we have removed the front half of the cabin roof.
Yesterday we removed the deck and dry fitted two out of the six full panels that are being replaced. The stern starboard, and the starboard cabin roof. Now we can work off these panels, and having fitted the most difficult first- over the petrol tank lid and the back stay, it should hopefully be getting easier from here on.
Once these are all fitted then the panels will be epoxied on all the end grains, penetrating epoxied over the whole top, primed and glued in with 3M 4200, then the 'match stick' size gaps between the rubrails and the new deck (OK I am not a carpenter) will be filled either with the glue or sikaflex.

I removed the rudder yesterday (had my uncle up top unscrewing the pin with me underneath easing it down slowly slowly grippin gripping nah not too heavy then OOOOOHHHHHHRR, almost gave me a hernia when it dropped, but at least I caught it), to replace the deck under the rudder plate, and aplied the final layer of epoxy filler to the back port side corner (where I cut out and replaced a soft spot in the hull) and also to a few little fixit spots under the water, on the keel and the bottom of the V on the transom. All the solid brass deck fittings have been completly restored and polished, and the a fair bit of the woodwork on the boat has been stripped and sanded back, and is beginning to be coated in penetrating epoxy, for the next layer of west system epoxy, then two pack polygrond, then international Goldspar original varnish.

Today (sunday) we had to deal with rain again, so spent the day in a workshed preparing all of the peices of timber we have removed from the deck, gunnwales etc..
stripping, sanding and grinding, overdrilling holes for refilling with epoxy etc.
We have two more weekends to get it finished before the yard fees get disgustingly debilitating (4x original price).
Fingers crossed we are going to make it.
Uni and work are being abandoned at the whim of the weather now. A sunny day with no rain is worth more than its hours in pay, or workload.


One thing that was a little funny a fair bit worrying was the old owner Terry (who I mistakenly called Stuart in a previous thread- must of been thinking of the engine) came up yesterday for another quick chat.
This time he was looking a decent bit worried and concerned.
His words of advice were,
"Don't do too much!"

We didn't have the heart to tell him
"It's too late mate!"
He didn't come up on the boat either. A good thing. Altair is looking just a little bit butchered at the moment.

Photos will follow soon.

Hans.

 

Hi Hans!

Good going, I like the story as I recognise a lot of the details ;-)

Some I did already, some to pass along the way the coming season. The cabin roof is on the agenda as wel as a thorough inspection of the deck area (although it looks fine, better safe than sorry)

Keep on writing as I like the story to continue...
Regards,

 

Wood Rot Killer.

Hey Sander, in regards to our previous conversation on 'Champignons' I have found a product that manages to kill woodrot.

In australia it is called 'Blue 7.'
I think different companies made different products out of it, the stuff I have is "Intergrain" and the stuff that I made an attatchment of is by "Protim." (attatched to thread http://boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=11447)

Its active ingredients are
fluron
Copper
Boron

It is a bit toxic, but most definately stops and kills any and all wood rot, fungal, or worms/ants etc..
It can be used as a remedy or preventative.

It is a water based product that you let soak right in.
While I have gone for the replacing rather than treating option for the deck and cabin roof, I am going to treat some of the timber (cedar) under the deck, and soak a bit into the end grain of the topside hull that is now temporarily exposed (with minor rot starting from its contact to the rotting deck). I am also going to treat the front 1/3 of the deck that is staying in (at least staying in untill the next major overhall)

It was developed by the Australian CSIRO (Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation).
In Australia it has been recently discontinued, rather quietly, for unknown reasons. Most probably toxicity reasons. Although no-where seems to be selling it, my uncle has managed to order me some (obviously from someone who has some stock left).
The idea is that you thouroughly soak the rot affected or rot threatened (in future) wood. Then you would use one of the penetrating epoxy wood preservers to hold it all together.
I think the chemicals are something like that used in treated pine.

Anyway, I don't know how much good this is to you.
Maybe there is something like this over produced over there.

P.S. How is your boat going?

Hans.

 

Lots done. More to come.

Ok.

As promissed, to anyone that gives a damn,
here is a follow up on the progress of restoring my lovely lady Altair.

photo one shows the stern end of the deck removed.

Photo two, the roof of the cabin.

Photo three, once we had fitted (and epoxied and primed) the deck, there was bounce in the wood, as the Pacific Maple (Maranti) obviously was not as hardy as the previous cedar ply- so we extensivly re-supported the whole new deck. Re-screwed, glued and clamped just about every single joint, new and old. Now solid as a rock.

Photo four and five, replacing the back stay chain plate, from corroded and thin, to thick and stainless.

Photo six and seven, after scraping sanding and priming, she gets a antifoul, three coats on the high wear areas (waterline, edges, prop, rudder, etc) and two everywhere else. Later on covered up with another coat allover. _yes I know we did it the wrong way round... should have done topsides first as every boatbuilder and his dog told us AFTER WE HAD DONE IT. But you see we were really trying to just get it ready for the water ASAP, better we thought to have the bottom ready and the top not, than the other way around.

Photo eight. Well this was a real killer. After two painfull coats of the dark blue colour you see, wet and dry sanding meticulously between coats, we turned up one morning hoping to put on a final topcoat and the paint was bubbling and blistering. Besides being a ******* of a paint to work with, it was a clear base and thus gave practically no coverage, the colour was simply too dark and seemed to be attracting too much heat, and thus on the sunny side blistering from evaporating moisture underneath. So I popped and peeled back the paint to RAW WOOD and dried it out, primed, sanded, primed, sanded, and sanded the whole topsides again (which is the picture you see) to prepare for a change in paint and colour.

Picture nine, is after the first coat of the new colour, a light powder baby blue. Desinged to be practical, reflective of heat, and COVER. It seems to have worked. After two coats it is looking lovely.

After this work, up untill today, the photos will come later.


so, we had the new deck and roof down, epoxied (evidure) and primed, and the rest of the old deck and cabin stripped and epoxied (epiglass wood preserver) and primed. Everything glued down with a range of stuff, some things a foaming wood glue, the edges 3m 4200, and every gap, join and seal that need the slightest bit of flex, Sikaflex.
We got the back cleats on, cleaned and greased and replace the rudder, we replaced the newly built BEAUTIFULL tiller, and we were ready (just) for the water.

You must understand that this was all getting to desperation point.
We had been out for seven weeks.
We had been planning and budgeting to be out for two- maybe three.
At the yard we have been at, the fees double every three weeks. So we had already passed our second doubling.
Utility bills have gone unpaid, way passed the orange, then red, letters, to the ones that come from debt collectors.
Plus as my girlfriend and I both study, we have been in the thick of final assessments. I have missed about half of this whole semester due to spending practically every day it was not raining, across the whole time the boat has been out of the water, at the boat- 14 hours per day.
I have no money, because I take work off to work on the boat- thus spend money.
We are so sick of takeaway and delivery food.
Who would have thought you could get sick of pizza?

So. A few days ago (sorry my essay destroyed brain cannot even comprehend time or memory at the moment) we put it back in the water.
Frantically unloading tools and wood and bits and peices as the tractor was beginning to tow us out of our position barely an hour before the sunset, and half an hour before all the yard boys were meant to knock off, they lifted us off the hard stand and I scraped and slapped on the last little spots of antifoul.
(not to mention covering and filling up all the holes that the damn surveyor had poked and dug into my hull below the waterline with his damn little pokey tool thing to see if the wood was OK)

Then they finally put us back in the water.
We have arranged to use one of the local pens as a COURTESY. Ie hopefully we don't have to pay for it. So when the crain dropped us in, we frantically set about reattachting the battery freshly charged, and tried to start the motor.
Tried, tried.
No luck.
The old stuart turner did not want to go.
I checked and double checked everything, fuel lines, water, spark plugs sparking-yes, replaced new spark plugs, and no joy.
So the boys went and got one of the work boats and towed us to our temporary pen.
We tied up, very very well as I have no insurance yet (and would literally die if we bumped into the boat next to us) and that is where we have left it.
I have been up most of the hours of the last four days completing essays, and now in about six hours I am off to work for the first time in three weeks.

Who would have thought boats could have been so much fun???

nah seriously, I love it.
Just wish time had not been such an issue.
More to come.
Hans.

 

Photos in the water.

Here are the follow up photos of us in the water, unfinished, ugly grey primed and dirty deck, holes still visable etc.. but getting closer.

Since these photos I have been been painting the deck and cabin. I have put on the front window, and a few other bits.

Apart from one disaster with acrylic paint that I won't even mention (at least not yet- when I think about it I start to get itchy and agitated), today after fixing it up I put on the second coat of international deck grip, cream colored, and a coat of baby blue oil on the cabin sides (matching topsides).

We are entering final stage planning to get the splashboards on, then the heavily resupported winches, and then the traveller, moved from the rear of the cockpit, forward to the companionway.

Then in four days (knock on wood) we will sail her to her new swing mooring.
Then we will probably tie her up, really well, try to forget about her for maybe a week or two, and SLEEP.

It has been a long and expensive three months.

Hans.

P.S.
Any comments?

 

congratulations!

Good to see your boat in the water!

 

Altair sails again- to her new home.

As the heading suggests, today we sailed Altair (for the first time) from the yacht club we bought her from (and have been restoring her at) to her new swing mooring.

She is not finished yet, but is ship-shape and sailable.
I guess most of all, for all the effort we have put in, the deck and cabin are now rock solid, mostly new, and do not leak one drop of water.
The splashboards are yet to go on, same with the staunchens and the as yet un-built pushpit.
The new traveller I put in on the companionway worked perfectly.
Because I have have tied up and bundled the staunchens around the spinaker pole and hoisted it up from the mast to get them out of the way, we sailed under a main only.

She sailed beautifully, in about 15 knots of wind and 1-2mt waves. Even with only the main up she perfectly steered herself. The helm is so light.

The stuart turner started and performed when required, and we found our new mooring and tied up, set up tarps to try to ward off the seagulls, and pumped up our brand new 10 foot inflatable- which just so happened to instantly start leaking air along a dodgey seam (I will take it back to try to get a refund!).

So, we made it.
Ny girlfreind has passed out, and I am trying to get my head around starting an essay that was due five days ago, that I haven't started yet.
Sleep sometime soon for me hopefully.
It has been a very long three months...


No photos for this journey, unfortunately, but more to come.
Hans.

 

more pics please?

 

Hello Andy,
Any pics inparticular your interested in? repair stuff etc, sailing, ?

I don't have any digital ones of actually sailing, and haven't done much sailing on it at all this last year (there is still too much unfinished that sailing is just a bit difficult- eg running our jib sheets around and and tieing off on the stern horn cleats), but as it has been a year now (already!) we will have a fresh round of photo's coming up soon when we haul her out again (in a month or two) give her a new paint job (and colour- any suggestions?) and finish off all the work that has been waiting.

I have a new stainless pushpit that I designed and built that is going on, which has a slightly overhanging seat on the back, then the staunchions and lifelines can go back up. The splashboards need to go back on, then the winches can go back on. The restored toerails need to go back on and there is a newly built curved top (instead of flat) poop deck hatch to go on.
I think that is most of it, and hopefull this time around every time I do one job it will not uncover three more.

I was hoping to get all this done out on the water, but that just hasn't happened. What will be done is that as much as possible will be pre-drilled and ready to go...

anyway, thanks for the interest.

Hans.

 

Hi mate, Thats a great job your doin' on the old girl! I just came across your posts when I searched for van de stadt seahorse. I just bought what I think is also a vds seahorse! It was in pooor shape also - oysters and barnacles vying for a spare inch along the waterline , a mussel had set up home in the head lol etc.- but the price was right. Also is/was set up for racing but appears to have been cruised at some previous stage. ( as well as a roller reefing boom, theres charts for most of the east coast onboard as well as telltale signs like radio direction finder, 'trailing' log, and man overboard strobes etc.)

I have not yet hauled her out and hope theres not too many nasty surprises underwater. The litre of black sump oil I sponged out of the shallow bilge I suspect was an attempt at sabotaging the price by an unscrupulous potential buyer from the local cut throat I mean FRIENDLY local marina and not an indication of the necessity of engine removal for repairs. In my initial inspection after removal of seagull debris and the torn mainsail cover I found the main was ripped along two seams - near the head and about halfway down. The jib started ripping on the first attempt to sail also!

ha ha old boats. you gotta love em. Shes not my first

I had a 26 ft kauri pine carvel built in 48 in in sydney in similar condition which I refitted and sailed to the whitsundays back in 90- 91. and its been too long.......

So as you know its an addiction.. I've been everyday working on something after work and both days of the weekend down on her scraping and painting.

I didnt take any initial photos - suffice to say she wasn't apretty sight.

she's still not- but she's getting there .

I'll try to attach a photo for you - I'd be interested to see if you think she may be a seahorse also. The coach house is a different profile but the lines of the hull look the same or fairly similar. - what do you think?

hmmlooks like it will not let me attach a piuc as the post is old- if you reply I may be able to - cheers - Fergus

 

What is the original deck construction? Epoxy/glass/plywood, polyester/glass/plywood, or painted plywood, possibly epoxy sealed?

 

The Altair Saga Continues

Yup, i am the new owner of Altair. I have just sailed her from St Kilda to Safety Beach. After an epic but well executed journey she is now safe and comfy in her new home on my berth in Martha Cove Marina. Let the restoration continue!

 

Nice. It's good to see a new owner take over the original thread.

 

Thanks Canracer! I was real surprised to find this thread when i was researching Seahorse 30's. Definitely an awesome piece of local nautical history, she needs a bit more work again but still in pretty good shape. The Water Police came yesterday, cus my mate got hit by the boom and cracked his skull right as we were coming into safety beach. They proceeded on insulting Altair with complete ignorance which, i did not appreciate nor did i let go without rebuttal, i see it as a calling to keep her alive and well. Anyway, most of the previous work has held up nicely, a couple of soft spots on the deck that i will rip out and treat right away. So, game on!