Diesel/Hydrogen Hybrid Trawler

[Towboat Ed]

I hope I am not violating any forum rules by posting a link to my website, but is the best way I know to show my Hybrid www.water4fuel4boats.com
If anyone wants to discuss it, I will get back when I have more time...

[KnottyBuoyz]

I'm going to play the Devil's Advocate here and say this sounds like snake oil to me! I go to the "test results" on your web site and I find nadda! Prove it works and I might consider it.

[Towboat Ed]

Hi Rick...the "Test Results" tab, or page was just added to my site. by my webmaster, yesterday. Maybe I should have waited until I am ready to leave on the 2-3 month cruise. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I have seen good results on my vehicles, in the year that I have been experimenting with HHO, but my site is about boats, so I want results from the unit on the boat. I will be leaving in the next week or so, and plan on posting my fuel usage, miles,rpm, etc...Daily...Good or Bad...I will post All the numbers, daily, on that "test Results page. Thanks again...Ed

[kistinie]

It is very likely this device work as

Injecting any explosive gas to a diesel give an incredible increase of performances.
A lot of patents exists about diesel injected with gaz.

How hydrogen is injected to engine ?
Hydrogen is the king of escape, how do you prevent leaks ?
Is it worth recycling lead batteries fumes ?
I guess yes

Electricity to electrolyse can be thermoacoustic ?

Great things to come !

[thudpucker]

I cant figure out exactly what is a HHO or Hydrocell.

Do we use the same Reciprocating engine; ie chebby 350, and feed it Hydrogen gas?
Instead of Gasoline? Or mixed in with the Gasoline?
I'd sure like to see a block diagram with all the parts noted.

[kerosene]

HHO is mystical way of creating hydrogen with less energy than can be recovered by burning it back to water.

Why these "water car" folks insist on burning the valuable hydrogen in crappy low efficiency engines is beyond me - If I had a solution for perpetual motion machine (output more than input) I wouldn't waste it at 35% (at best) efficient 4-stroke engines.

You can google youtube HHO and "whatever that fuel cell was called" and get bunch of guys building and proving but nothing functional or 3rd party tested.

It really would amaze me if stainless steel cylinders and simple electric current would make a device that could break the very fundamental physics rules.

Good luck.


edit:

"Reduce your Carbon Footprint !! HHO reduces Harmful Emmisions by up to 90% !!" - yah - and let me guess that it is oil companies conspiracy that we haven't seen these yet. After all the talk of HHO, brown gas, etc. is decades old.

Yeah - BMW, AUDI, WV, SISU, Mercedes, Nissan, Toyota etc. none care about fuel efficiency enough to try this public knowledge in practice?
Or they did but the results were so tremendous that they thought that the world wasn't ready for it?

Sorry for slamming you specifically but I have spent quite some time reading about "alternate energy" solutions that exist only for quick buck and to con audience who has lacking understanding of physics.

[thudpucker]

That's OK, Kerosne. I'm learning too. A little at a time. I can see why people who 'know' get sorta short tempered with those who keep suggesting without ever knowing it wont work.

I never really knew how the Hydrogen gas helped. I keep getting little tid bits but nobody ever offerd to show me something that works yet!

[Towboat Ed]

Keep em coming guys. Im getting underway in a couple days. I will prove it works. I dont have time to argue about the old outdated science or physics. I do appreciate your interest. I will be posting daily results on my website. Since the unit was installed on my boat , there have been 3 major improvements that we will be testing. Please check-out the link to the IHHOI , our "Trade Association"...and on my last page , the Hydrogen Super Highway. One of the major players in that project , is also very involved with our IHHOI......later.

[marshmat]

Im getting underway in a couple days. I will prove it works.

Ed, I think this statement sums up why the whole 'free energy subculture' is completely ignored by everyone else.

A much more objective approach, and one more likely to draw engineers and scientists who may be able to help explain what is going on and why, would be:
"I'm getting underway in a couple of days. I will collect data on fuel burn, speed and engine operating parameters to see whether or not it works."

Whenever someone goes out to "prove it works", all scientific objectivity is lost and it becomes very difficult for anyone to determine what is actually going on. I have no idea how many potentially good inventions we have lost this way over the years, but it's probably a lot.

As an example, there's a company out in B.C. called General Fusion, that might have a technology that could result in a practical fusion power plant hundreds of times less expensive than many current efforts in the field. But they don't say "it works, and we're going to prove it". They say "the concept is physically and mathematically sound, we will now attempt a step-by-step process of experiments to see if our predictions can be realized in practice". Because of this firm theoretical foundation and the absence of extravagant or un-physical claims, they are attracting a lot of research money and media attention.

[kistinie]

HH / OO + diesel or unleaded or GPL ...Combustion complete !

:-)

Full combustion is helped thanks to O², OO, oxygen, added by the electrolyse of water!

Hydrogen works as a catalyse the combustion. Hydrogen finishes combustion of the oil rising final temp
Timing is not affected as "éclair point" of oil under pressure is lower for oil than for hydrogen
Water resulting of the full combustion cools exhaust gases anf then rise air flow


Drawbacks ?
hydrogen escapes and explodes easily
uncontroled gaz production (too much gaz) will damage motor
to prevent this pipes feeding hydrogen to inlet must be equiped with non return fire valve
Hydrogen may be armful to silicon or P.U pipe
Hydrogen MUST be fed by suction not pressure - Hydrogen goes up (smallest and lightest element on earth)
Mix ratio / Rpm / Load control to added hydrogen
Liquid (potassium hydroxide, or sodium carbonate, or soude, and distilled/rain water) to control and refill to run the equipment.
Liquid is caustic, so careful... (but just under 6 grams of "soude" per gall is enough)



Average kit cost : 50 to 1000€

Starts for 50€ if you do all parts yourself
http://quanthomme.free.fr/qhsuite/AddWaterV.1.htm


or go shopping:

http://www.gasconversionkits.com/ind...FQZeswodqHo49w



Hydrogen can also be extracted from metals

http://www.physorg.com/news98556080.html

[apex1]

Has anyone around here a clue what the post above would tell us?
Knotty was right snakeoil! But that´s a liquid, are there gases with similar qualities?

[marshmat]

Please, enough of this "HHO makes you have more complete combustion" and "HHO is free energy from water from your battery" stuff.

There is not a single engine available for sale in the Western world today that does not already have complete combustion under all normal conditions. Engines that allow incomplete combustion within their normal operating range are flat out illegal under European, Canadian and US emissions laws. And the first and second laws of thermodynamics have been proven, time and time again, from the scale of galaxies right down to the scale of subatomic particles. If someone claims they're being broken or don't apply, the odds are almost certain that it's because the person making the claim simply doesn't understand what their own device is doing.

If anyone wants to discuss these hydrogen gadgets, please do it on a factual, informed basis and present a logical, rational theory for what is happening. Such explanations are definitely out there. Many of them make a lot of sense.

[kistinie]

Originally Posted by marshmat

There is not a single engine available for sale in the Western world today that does not already have complete combustion under all normal conditions. .

And the existing park of engines ?
And the non-western world ?

Hydrogen extraction and injection to motors is a 100% efficient operation any existing engine will benefit rising efficiency of the engine from 30 to 60%
50$ home made Kits, get paid in a month with fuel savings !

About efficiency of hydrogen and more generally gas injection, it works in ANY engine, even GPL.
A rapid search will show you an avalanche of (public domain) patent and sate research about it.

There are 1000's of proof it works
If you disagree, explain technically why

[thudpucker]

Here's what I've learned from these Hydrogen fuel threads.

Hydrogen is a very light gas that can be added to any existing fuel for use in any internal combustion engine.

Hydrogen gas is difficult to store, as it's molecules are so small they will slip through just about any man made storage facility.
For that reason Hydrogen gas is best used in a "Make it now, use it now" system.

Hydrogen gas is explosive. Like any Lighter than air gas, and requires some diligent care in the manufacture and use.

What I have not learned is exactly how the Hydrogen molecules are seperated from the Oxygen molecules. This I'd like to know more about. Just for my own knowlege. I have no intention of making or using this stuff.

If I were to bet on any home made and cheap fuel for the future, I'd go for Algae Diesel.

[kistinie]

Can be produced with DC electricity (electrolyse)
This is the actual simplest solution as it uses basic low cost technology

Or many other ways, including, ocean thermodynamic effect (heat pump), light, bacteria, aluminium-gallium...that requires more skills