Political blurbs and agendas

[Jeff]

The deletion - has made a mockery of an "open discussion" forum and the poll.

How would you feel if you offered me a free trip on your boat and I offended a number of the rest of your friends to such a degree that they were jumping overboard?

I do not like you chasing other people off this forum, at all.

[Willallison]

Trouty. I like you. But for F#$%s sake shut up!
35 - 10 agree with me (poll results)
And leave Jeff alone - we love him!

If you want to upset someone - tell em a lie, if you want to upset EVERYONE - tell em the truth!.

Sadly collateral damage (dead wimmin & kids) is not something, that sits easily with me..so I choose to tell it like I see it, and it upsets plenty.

I think I owe at least that much to the dead wimmin & kids and my God, who I suggest wouldn't take to kindly to the treatement we hand out to others in our desperate addiction to oil (including the oil we burn in our boats engines).

The only way to change the world is to stand up and be counted.

I've done that - always will, because it hels me sleep well at night.

My opinion in this matte won't be swayed, whether people jump overboard or not, that is THEIR choice if they can't live with their consciences...not mine.

I'll say no more - finito from me - we will just have to agree to disagree is all.

Cheers & let natural justice prevail for ALL.

[Oyster]

Originally Posted by Jeff

What I strongly object to is recieving email from members who have contributed 100s of posts about boat design - the primary focus of this site - that they have enjoyed the forum but are now choosing to leave because threads are wandering off-topic or because the political threads have offended them.

I don't like to moderate heavily, but at the same time, my interest and the focus of this site is boat design and boat building. Any time off-topic posts which are not directly relating to boat design or boatbuilding start causing us to lose on-topic contributors, those posts will go.

Does this sound so familiar. People use other people's megephones to be rude, and with topics that will not change any outcome or make anyone life better. In this case, I commend the forum moderator and his being willing to stay on message and address the upevil. Thats a thankless job for sure.

Boats are enjoyed by a cross section of people and enjoyed by people from around the world. Its also been noted that these contrasting political viewpoints, gathered from such confrontations over politics, will and has dictated the angle and approach of a reply in true boat sections and discussion on many if not most forums, or so say I.

[mmd]

IMHO, the only political discussions to be tolerated on a boat-related forum such as this are those related to boats, such as licensure of boats & designers of boats, legislated safety and operational rules, etc. Trouty is out of line in the context of this forum's intent to provide a place for friendly off-topic conversation among boat enthusiasts. He is free to mount his soap-box on the street corner and shout his views to the world, but if he insists on doing so inside the walls of a private meeting place, he should expect to run the risk of being stifled or ejected.

Using the metaphor of the BoatDesign Forum as the office that we work in, we go to work and do work, think about work, and talk about work. Then we take a coffee break. During this break in the coffee room at the office, we talk about other things with our colleagues - the kids, what we did on the weekend, the big game last Sunday; general chit-chat stuff that is the social grease of our daily dialogues. The Open Discussion section is the coffee room at the BDF. I come here to have pleasant conversations with colleagues with whom I have some common interests.

Some people seem to spend most of their day in the coffee room.

Some people come to the coffee room just to be disruptive and pick fights.

Some people who don't even know anything about the work done at the office come to the coffee room to be disruptive and pick fights, and won't stop when asked.

I support the notion that the coffee room should have a security guard/bouncer to encourage the belligerant non-employees to go someplace else. Warned the first time, sat down and told to mind their manners the second time, and ejected and barred from the office on the third incident. Don't like the tough love? Too bad - you are free to mount your soap-box and rail about it to the world...outside.

[Corpus Skipper]

Hey folks, if you want to vent your political rantings, check this place out, it's ripe for the picking! http://www.headsneedtoroll.org/forum/index.php

[gonzo]

I think that politics do affect boating and some of it must be talked about. For example, in the context of regulations. My problem was, and is, with blurbs. These are unrelated commnets; out of context with the topic discussed. It beats me why some posters insist a boating forum must allow them to use it as their political soapbox. There are literally millions of political forums to choose from.

[Figgy]

Originally Posted by gonzo

I think that politics do affect boating and some of it must be talked about. For example, in the context of regulations. My problem was, and is, with blurbs. These are unrelated commnets; out of context with the topic discussed. It beats me why some posters insist a boating forum must allow them to use it as their political soapbox. There are literally millions of political forums to choose from.

I totally agree. I think most of us come here because we all have a common bond. Politics and religion are not it.

[Sean Herron]

Hello...

I am one to invariably get myself into trouble on occasion...

I do not agree with eliminating politics from any human endeavour or discussion...

Politics is a human invention and should remain front and center for same - it seperates us from the hunters and gatherers...

Boat design - and by the simple the use of the word design - implies the need for discussion and input - the simple fact that this is a discussion of like minds to a common purpose creates a discussion framed around the absolute base of Democratic politics - which I believe to be the BEST example of same in our modern world - and for this matter - representative of our Democratic freedoms - as such - we must always accept freedom of opinion, freedom of speech and of public assembly - it is a foundation...

Importantly - and against what we feel emotionally - we must also allow for freedom of non majority opinion - in so much as doing same will keep that which is argued within the focus of proper media and prevent that which may be disagreeable from going underground where it can be lost to the majority ignorance and the Hollywood media - keep the enemy front and center and above ground - and thus within view of majority law and of those who respect same...

For that matter - I am not interested in some homogenous 'nothing place' - I am interested in the politics, the religion or anything that drives the man or woman of any race to attach themselves to the boating industry...

Money wise - it is market research - personally it is reaching out from where I am - let it all flow...

As for 'soapboxing' - go to Piccadilly or other now - and just listen to the hate spewed against that which offers sanctuary and good shoes to the announcer of same...

This is politics - and there is no getting away from it today...

Cheers...

SH.

[Figgy]

Why? Why must we bring polotics into it? What purpose does it serve, other than piss people off? I understand it play a major role in everyones life, but for a few minutes can't we pretend it didnt? Just you and me and everyone else talkin' about boats...

[longliner45]

this is about boats not politics ,,,,,if I wanted to talk politics ,I would go to another site,,,dont see how politics can help me paint my boat or make modifcations to it ,

[Sean Herron]

Hello...

Cheers...

Same is same against the foundations of our Democracy...

As in Dante's Cave - the red dots are against the wall behind you - the shadows of what you perceive to be real, and if you can see that much - the threat is behind you again...

Keep turning around until they are beside you...

I suppose the above cannot register against those who do not know same - so I will just carry on in ignorance...

Show me your boats...

I know what you want, and I want it too - but it does not exist - if you start painting your boat and one man walks up and pitches some advice - welcome to the world of politics - no one has to get bombed out of house and home - but you may end up wanting to poke this guy in the eye with your brush while we all laugh and herd him out of the yard - it is all politics - hehe...

I guess I am argueing in favour of the worker who sweats and bleeds - literally - into the boats that he or she builds - and comes here to share same - some real experience for down time - where he or she finds a self appointed majority who seems to want to remain ignorant of the monetary truth of the world - where same carries on swallowing the beatnik ignorance of a time long gone by in any daily struggle...

Tell me how I should go about installing a six inch fiberglass exhaust bypass tommorow - and I will consider your future opinions...

Cheers again...

SH.

[gonzo]

Sean Herron: my comment on blurbs is because of posters, that, like you, use a thread to talk about politics that are unrelated to the subject. You claim to be arguing for the "worker who sweats.." There are proper places to do so. You also say working on boats without politics entering into it "doesn't exist". Perhaps not, but it is because of people like you that won't stay on subject. Unless you can explain why it is a political issue to "pitch some advice" about painting techinques. It sounds paranoid.

[DanishBagger]

I have to put my two "øre" (my form of "cents") here.

I think it would be nice if it were allowed to make political threads. The thing is, I like most of the people that I have had the fortune to meet through here, and it would be interesting to hear what makes them tick (and tick off) in more than "just" boats.



Although 100 percent sure this wasn't directed to me (I was taking a break from all things internet), I still would like to comment on it:

Originally Posted by Jeff

How would you feel if you offered me a free trip on your boat and I offended a number of the rest of your friends to such a degree that they were jumping overboard?

I do not like you chasing other people off this forum, at all.

Let me start by p'ing some people off, by saying that you're completely wrong.

Although I do see that we/you/the site won't live if everybody leaves, making a blanket rule saying that if people disagree and bitch about it, then those type of threads have to go. How do you discern what is politics, what is "offensive"?

Also, in the example, you're making a parallel that is both extreme and doesn't really hold water (no pun intended). The example is extreme because it states that the "offense" is so severe that people will jump overboard. Now, using the same example, but saying that "If I came aboard your boat, and people we're so offended by the brand of deodorant I was wearing that they jumped over board", I certainly wouldn't ban that brand of deodorant.

Secondly, the example is using the term "over board", and since that is an extreme, I would go as far as saying that people are perhaps just a tad oversensitised.

If the threads were in a dedicated place, then noone should take offense. What is next - deleting all the threads about speedboats because some eco-junkie find them offensive?

[DanishBagger]

Hmm, I just realised that perhaps all of you guys are now discussing political "blurbs" in a thread that is already going, and is talking about something like, say, screws, or something?

Please tell me it is so?


Btw, I just realised, what if I make a thread about copper antifouling, it will be very hard not to talk politics, unless I merely ask where to get it.