Whats this "red stuff"

[rwatson]

This picture shows some 'red stuff' being laid with fibreglass.

I am guessing it is 'peel ply', but I have never seen it in that colour.

It features big in this site :-

http://www.voile.org/trimaran/progre...ber11_2005.htm

Anyone come across it ?

[gonzo]

Have you asked whoever put it there when you took the photo?

[rwatson]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Have you asked whoever put it there when you took the photo?

No reply to the email yet. He is probably out sailing :-)

[SamSam]

Not sure where you got the picture you show, but on the site you posted, the first photo says the red stuff is peel ply.

Peel ply can be just regular nylon or dacron from the fabric store, it doesn't have to be from a fiberglass supplier with an official label of 'Peel Ply'. Here's a quote from this thread....

Peel ply....

We use a peel ply commonly sold as a lining material in clothing. It's called polysheen and is typically much cheaper some peel plys sold by composite suppliers.

[SamSam]

At the end of the thread I posted above is a link to a 'Duckworks' article on how to achieve a glass smooth finish on projects without sanding and fairing, similar to using peel ply....

http://duckworksmagazine.com/03/r/ar...ass/bottom.htm

[rwatson]

Thats a great technique SAMSAM. Shame it will only work on developable surfaces (not on compound curves)

[DaveJ]

After putting the peel ply, they then stick another layer of material, sealing the edges and create a vacuum and thats how vacuum baging works. Removes all the air bubbles makes the weave alot tighter and so forth. This will make the flim conform to the compound curves that aren't too drastic.

Seen it done alot on repairs of aircraft composites. Air bubbles are not good, you go up in altitude, the bubbles expand and cause delamination, and on a fast moving jet, a delamination can cause big problems.

[DaveJ]

Thinking about it more, before laying the fibre, sit the film over the shape, hit it with a heat gun and streatch to the shape it needs, let it cool, then try the vacuum bagging, just a thought.

[rwatson]

I have never seen that polyester film for sale- where would you get it from?

[SamSam]

Originally Posted by DaveJ

Seen it done alot on repairs of aircraft composites. Air bubbles are not good, you go up in altitude, the bubbles expand and cause delamination, and on a fast moving jet, a delamination can cause big problems.

I saw that on a new aircraft, flying on Delta or Incontinental, I don't remember.

Just in front of the flaps, it was perfectly fine on the ground, at cruising altitude it expanded to dinner plate size and disappeared as we went down to land. I drew a picture of it, as I figured the 'authorities' would not believe me. Sure enough, the young, stupid co-pilot poo-pooed it as something he pulled out of his ass. I took the stewardess aside, gave her the picture and told her take a look when they went back up and then show it to someone that wasn't a moron.

[DaveJ]

Thats very distressing, being an aircraft technicain, hearing this sort of stuff really scares me. Nowadays due to manufacturing technicals and controls, the reason for aircraft going down has changed from being mechnical/engineering failures to human error. I'm sad to say, its the Pilot that is the biggest percentage of the human errors, to the fact that nearly 90% (don't have the exact figures but its around this) of the reason for aircraft going down is because the Pilots don't believe what they are being told by the instruments, airtraffic control or with each other. It is a huge concern with airlines, so much so that Airbus try to remove as much as possible of the pilots inputs and do every thing computer controlled.

[rwatson]

DaveJ - are any commercial planes flying with composite material wings ?

Those 'dinner plates' would be in aluminium wouldnt they ?

[CTMD]

Having spent a lot of time using boeing autoclaves for a side project 10 years ago, I'm not sure if any have full carbon wings, but lots have large carbon wing componets.

[SamSam]

Originally Posted by rwatson

DaveJ - are any commercial planes flying with composite material wings
Those 'dinner plates' would be in aluminium wouldnt they ?

There were no rivets in the wing, so I assume it was composite. I"m thinking it was airbus, but I'm not sure.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=32312

George Larson, editor emeritus of Smithsonian Air & Space Magazine reported the comments of an aircraft maintenance professional in Opa Locka, Florida. After years spent dismantling dozens of large aircraft built by the major manufacturers he told Larson that, “Airbus products are the flimsiest and most poorly designed as far as airframe structure is concerned” and “The vertical fin along with the composite hinges on the rudder and elevators is the worst example of structural use of composites I have ever seen.”

[apex1]

Airbus is doing almost the complete wing in "plastic" on late models.